T3 doesn't exist.

and MST3K.

What does LTTP mean? Late to the party?

Was the "third" Terminator bad or something? Was that the one with the girl terminator?

Ugh. I agree with Señor Ogre here. I couldn't stand Terminator 3. It was poorly assembled (looking and feeling more more like a direct-to-video sequel than a legitimate Terminator movie), with a hideous, overly jokey script and phoned-in performances.

And WTF is up with the MST3k hate?

In order to understand why I hate T3, you have to understand why I think Cameron's first two movies are very good.

1. James Cameron's first Terminator movies were perfect dichotomies of each other. Two people sent back in time to do the same missions, one big and scary looking, the other slim. Roles reversed in both movies.

2. "The future is not set. There is no fate but what we make." That was the driving force behind T2, even moreso if you watch the Director's Cut. Having T2 end with the possibility that Judgment Day could actually be avoided, and leaving it up to the viewer to decide, was a specific decision made by Cameron. So much so that he changed the original ending of T2 which showed Judgment Day did indeed not happen. It makes a statement about humanity and that we are control of our own lives and destinies. I like movies with statements, even if veiled.

3. The T-800 in T2 made a rather large sacrifice. He learned and understood the importance of destroying Skynet and the importance of humanity so much so that he went against his hard-wired programming (he disobeyed direct orders from John).


T3 pisses all over each of those things. It destroys the dichotomy of the first two movies by re-hashing (poorly, I might add) the plot from the second movie. It destroys Cameron's message about "no fate" by laying it all flat-out that Judgment Day does indeed happen... and, inso-doing, also completely nullifies the importance of the T-800's sacrifice in T2.

I don't mind movies like Terminator: Salvation because if T-3 never existed, you could (if you believed Judgement Day doesn't happen, since Cameron gave you that choice) view it as a "What If?" or an alternate future. In fact, that is exactly what I was hoping T3 was going to be when I first heard it was announced.

I know some people need things spelled out for them. They don't like things left up to themselves. They want it all clear, black and white. But sometimes having things spelled-out too clearly ruins some of the point of certain stories. This was very much the case with T3. Another perfect example is the difference between the original and Director's cut of Donnie Darko.

I don't remember point 3).

In order to understand why I hate T3, you have to understand why I think Cameron's first two movies are very good.

1. James Cameron's first Terminator movies were perfect dichotomies of each other. Two people sent back in time to do the same missions, one big and scary looking, the other slim. Roles reversed in both movies.

2. "The future is not set. There is no fate but what we make." That was the driving force behind T2, even moreso if you watch the Director's Cut. Having T2 end with the possibility that Judgment Day could actually be avoided, and leaving it up to the viewer to decide, was a specific decision made by Cameron. So much so that he changed the original ending of T2 which showed Judgment Day did indeed not happen. It makes a statement about humanity and that we are control of our own lives and destinies. I like movies with statements, even if veiled.

3. The T-800 in T2 made a rather large sacrifice. He learned and understood the importance of destroying Skynet and the importance of humanity so much so that he went against his hard-wired programming (he disobeyed direct orders from John).


T3 pisses all over each of those things. It destroys the dichotomy of the first two movies by re-hashing (poorly, I might add) the plot from the second movie. It destroys Cameron's message about "no fate" by laying it all flat-out that Judgment Day does indeed happen... and, inso-doing, also completely nullifies the importance of the T-800's sacrifice in T2.

I don't mind movies like Terminator: Salvation because if T-3 never existed, you could (if you believed Judgement Day doesn't happen, since Cameron gave you that choice) view it as a "What If?" or an alternate future. In fact, that is exactly what I was hoping T3 was going to be when I first heard it was announced.

I know some people need things spelled out for them. They don't like things left up to themselves. They want it all clear, black and white. But sometimes having things spelled-out too clearly ruins some of the point of certain stories. This was very much the case with T3. Another perfect example is the difference between the original and Director's cut of Donnie Darko.