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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 8:07 pm 
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Kaffis Mark V wrote:
The bulk of the increase in game design has been improving art quality and the resolution engines can handle. That's not depth or complexity. That's shiny window dressing for lazy game designers to coast on for a decade.
This will earn you a concurring but separate opinion for your last post ...

There's been tremendous work done in the field of data transmission by game designers and their collaborators as well. Hell, I'll just put the bulk of network gaming infrastructure out there ...

Granted that's not actually part of the "game" ...

But I'm fairly certain most people don't consider DSX:HR to be the axiomatic operators that control decision making and outcomes within the experience to the "game" ...

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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 8:12 pm 
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Kaffis Mark V wrote:
The bulk of the increase in game design has been improving art quality and the resolution engines can handle. That's not depth or complexity. That's shiny window dressing for lazy game designers to coast on for a decade.


I agree, but that's not to say we're arguing that Bioware's last bunch of games weren't stellar in almost every way. I can't think of anything lazy about any of those games. They weren't perfect, but they were some of the best gaming experiences i've ever had. Most of that, for me, comes from the branching dialogue systems and NPC interactions. (And the voice acting, but that's a result of technological advancement, rather than design.) But game design is not universally better. They just have more tricks to make them better when they do things right. For example:

Master of Orion 2 remains my favorite game in its genre, ever. It doesn't matter how many wonderful Civilization revisions Sid Meier releases, he has never been able to come up with an answer to MoO2, and I doubt he ever will.

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 Post subject: Re: Mass Effect 3
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 8:17 pm 
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Ummmmmm ...

I can think about lots of things that were lazy about Mass Effect and every Bioware game after ... including TOR. Let's just put it this way ...

Start with Elevators, work your way to Hero Engine, and then figure out if they had worked harder on KotOR, they wouldn't have given up that UE license.

This does nothing to alter critical appeal or acclaim or the quality of the games, because you guys have already decided that (and that's all gravy). But, seriously, there are lots of places they have been lazy ...

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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 8:41 pm 
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Talya wrote:
Sean wrote:
Uh, ME2 does not have 150 dollars worth of DLC.


I didn't say it did. I said the total cost of all the DLC and the game was probably about $150.

There are 10 paid DLCs. Assuming they average $8, that's an extra $80. With a $60 base retail price, that's $140. Okay, so I may have overestimated by $10.


They do not cost that much. You don't even know how much they cost or what they are and are completely pulling numbers out of thin air. Nice.

Content DLCs:
Kasumi - Stolen Memory: $7
Overlord: $7
Lair of the Shadow Broker: $10
Arrival: $7

That's an extra $31. All together that's actually probably about the size of an expansion pack and roughly priced the same.

Other content:

Alternate Appearance Pack 1 & 2
Equalizer, Firepower, and Aegis Packs

Each of those are $2. That's $10 total for mostly fluff.

So that's a grand total of $41 in extra content.

The last item is the Mass Effect: Genesis "interactive comic book" that came for free with the PS3 version. It lets you pick a couple major ME1 plot decisions and load them up into ME2. It was later released for the X360 and PC for $4. This item doesn't really count, imo, but even if you added it in that's $45 total.

All of it together is still roughly an expansion's worth of content, even if a bit on the pricey side of things with the weapon packs, costumes, and interactive comic book added in.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:17 pm 
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Kaffis - FPS AI has improved, their ability to flank properly and rush is a whole hell of a lot better than it was in the late 90s. Late 90s FPS also pale in complexity to a huge current generation FPS like Battlefield 3 for depth, size, variables, ect.

You don't play many Mech games I suppose. To be fair, there's not many made. The Armored Core series has a hell of a lot more configurations and customization than the old MechWarrior games do though. Armored Core V is due out this month!

I think anyone who says that games haven't improved much in depth or complexity over the years simply does not play very may games. I play tons of them from every single genre. I buy 3-5 new games every single month. I have witnessed a lot of the evolution of games.

Platforming, Racing, Shooting, RPGs, Action, Puzzle games, ect. They have all evolved over the years. They have all gotten bigger and better. The size and quality of environments, the blending of genres together. Everything has character progression, stat tracking, tons more interaction with every part of the game. Stuff is more complex.

Maybe there's some rare outlier games from the past that have crazy stuff, but the vast majority of older games simply do not come anywhere near just the Average things we expect out of games now.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 4:25 pm 
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Launch trailer. Wasn't as good as ME2's launch trailer, but it was still fantastic.

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 Post subject: Re: Mass Effect 3
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 4:37 pm 
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Attention Talya:

ME3 PC version has been leaked online, deluxe digital edition with DLC included - clocks in a little over 10gb.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 5:37 pm 
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Not a spoiler, just the audio from the Blasto: The Hanar Spectre movie in ME3. **** hilarious.

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 Post subject: Re: Mass Effect 3
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 6:18 pm 
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Khross wrote:
But, seriously, there are lots of places they have been lazy ...

Level design in DA2. Level design of extra dungeons in ME1?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 12:23 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Mass Effect 3
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:17 pm 
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Lenas wrote:
Attention Talya:

ME3 PC version has been leaked online, deluxe digital edition with DLC included - clocks in a little over 10gb.


Yeah, I noticed that. No crack with any of them yet though.

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 Post subject: Re: Mass Effect 3
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:55 pm 
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360 leak is out too :p


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 Post subject: Re: Mass Effect 3
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 12:05 am 
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Friend brought his 360 over and let me play the beginning with my Shepard imported... Very awesome first few hours. I can't wait for Tuesday to get here.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 3:41 am 
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 12:05 pm 
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It's a sad but true state of affairs.

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 Post subject: Re: Mass Effect 3
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 3:02 pm 
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A note on flying around solar systems & scanning:
Spoiler:
you scan planets by sending a pulse out from your ship, and if anything is on a planet, EDI will mark it, and you can send a probe down. You have to be efficient with your pulse usage, though, because it's like a beacon to the Reapers. Every time you use it, a little meter on the bottom starts to fill, and after a certain point, Reapers invade that part of space.

I only got to scan a couple of planets, but I found a weapon upgrade on one, and 10k credits on another.

and regarding my romancing of Liara and Tali both:
Spoiler:
I have to decide pretty quickly what I want to do, I think. Liara is one of the first party members you get, and there have already been a few close moments with her. I have no idea how far off Tali is, but you get a note at the beginning of the game that says all signs are pointing to a Quarian/Geth war. To which I have a very slight glimmer of hope that my romancing of her in part 2 is the only way to find a peaceful resolution.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 5:06 am 
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My PC Collector's Edition has shipped. Will arrive tomorrow. So **** excited I can barely contain it.

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 Post subject: Re: Mass Effect 3
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am 
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Lenas wrote:
A note on flying around solar systems & scanning:
Spoiler:
you scan planets by sending a pulse out from your ship, and if anything is on a planet, EDI will mark it, and you can send a probe down. You have to be efficient with your pulse usage, though, because it's like a beacon to the Reapers. Every time you use it, a little meter on the bottom starts to fill, and after a certain point, Reapers invade that part of space.

I only got to scan a couple of planets, but I found a weapon upgrade on one, and 10k credits on another.



Wow, it sounds like they really worked on making the scanning mini-game fun and interesting.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 5:19 pm 
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Crack's out
Spoiler:
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:06 pm 
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Load up your saves you are importing and reset your talent points. If you import a game with spent talents, you won't get to choose the first evolution of your power, it will be chosen for you. If you import a character with no talents spent, you can purchase ranks as normal.

Of course, you will get the option to respec later in the game, but I've heard you have to wait until after you go to the Citadel.

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:19 pm 
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Raltar wrote:
Load up your saves you are importing and reset your talent points. If you import a game with spent talents, you won't get to choose the first evolution of your power, it will be chosen for you. If you import a character with no talents spent, you can purchase ranks as normal.

Of course, you will get the option to respec later in the game, but I've heard you have to wait until after you go to the Citadel.


I went through most of the Citadel before I had to stop playing, but I didn't know you could respec. That's cool. I imported my Infiltrator at level 25, and he had a lot of skills already purchased, but I still had 25 skill points left over to spend. It didn't seem like they only copied over if you hit the first evolution, because I know for sure a couple of my skills were only level 2 and my assassin's cloak was 4 or 5. The first branch for skills comes at rank 4.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:52 pm 
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Lenas wrote:
Crack's out
Spoiler:
Image


Yeah, they beat EA to release by several hours. I'm surprised. I honestly didn't expect to see a crack until late tomorrow, or perhaps even 2-3 days later.

Of course, they haven't cracked the DLC "From the Ashes" yet. I expect now that the game is cracked to see the DLC cracked later tonight.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:58 pm 
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Eh, they didn't beat EA, just activated early with Korean VPN's or something.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:01 pm 
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I thought you purchased games you liked, Taly?

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:13 pm 
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Usually on Steam, after the price has dropped to $20 or so. (Of course, these won't be on Steam. And Origin sucks. We'll see.)

And then even after I buy it, I continue to play the cracked versions (now legally). They tend to be more convenient, better performing, and more stable. (DRM sucks.)

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me

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