shuyung wrote:
For actively seeking employment, certifications are a great help. Elsewise, they're not of use, unless the company you work for provides incentives for obtaining them.
Yeah, I should have mentioned they're good for resume padding.
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| Author: | Midgen [ Mon Dec 14, 2009 11:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | IT Certifications? |
Not really a rant, but I'm curious what folks here think about IT certifications. I got a CCNA and MCP about 10 years ago when I was getting ready to leave the Air Force and enter the private sector. Since then the only certs I've recieved were the result of company provided training and free exams. I have no 'current' certs, mainly because I don't think it's worth the hassle or money to maintain them. With very few exceptions, most certifications have turned into ridiculous money scams on par with Martial Arts training. When I was a hiring manager, I put very little stock in certifications, mainly because we were hiring for high level positions where experience is an absolute must. I guess they might be helpful to get a toe-hold in the industry, but I guess I don't put much stock in them for senior positions. This came up because our company has recently (in the last 12 months) invested a bunch of money in Crossbeam XOS chassis for security platforms (Firewall, IDS, etc...). As part of our support contracts we get two training courses a year. Last week they had the second round of Crossbeam XOS training and certification. This company puts a lot of restrictions on their training. For example, you can't even attend the "Expert" course until you pass the "Specialist" course exam (which is not easy). Pass rate for the "Specialist" course is ~60%. Pass rate for the "Expert" course is about 30%. Mainly because they expect a lot of prior knowledge and hands on as a pre-requisite. The expert course is 3 days and the test(s) consist of a half day practical in the AM followed by a timed (2.5 hrs) 100 question multiple choice test (multiple correct answers possible). Passing score on the written is 85%. Of the 14 poeple who have managed to qualify for and attend the expert course, only two of us have passed the expert exam. For reasons I cannot comprehend, my boss is ecstatic that two of us now have this certification. It's completely meaningless in terms of measuring real productivity. We have no contractural obligations to be certified. I'm not suddenly better at my job, or more valuable to the team (more likely the folks that failed will be resentful). I guess she believes that if its hard (difficult) it must be good. Anyway, how do you folks view certifications these days? |
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| Author: | Aethien [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
If nothing else, it shows that you have some ambition to actually jump through the hoops ... which means that you have some skills and perseverance that they can actually count on in the corporate world. I'm not familiar with Crossbeam cert, but it sounds somewhat similar to the Cisco stuff (you know, the one where they give you a TORX wrench or whatever and a pencil and lock you in a room for eight hours with a broken router). As an MCSE in NT 4.0, I haven't thought about them in a while, other them to give some passing thought to getting an MCSA or maybe an MCSE in whatever MS is giving out these days. But, I certainly don't look at the MS certs as being on the same level as Cisco. I honestly haven't thought about them in quite a while, which probably answers your question. Might be different if I was actively job hunting. |
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| Author: | Timmit [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 6:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
They're completely worthless outside of job interviews (imo). In my experience, most people who have them brain dump most of the information as soon as the test is over... |
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| Author: | shuyung [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 11:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
For actively seeking employment, certifications are a great help. Elsewise, they're not of use, unless the company you work for provides incentives for obtaining them. |
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| Author: | Corolinth [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 1:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
It depends what you're doing. A friend of mine worked for a company with a few CCIEs on staff. When the batch of CCIEs got pissed off at the company management and left, Cisco dropped them from a platinum partner to a gold partner, and the company couldn't charge as much for their contracts. Your boss was probably ecstatic for a similar reason. You having this cert means they can charge more money, although you don't necessarily see any of it. |
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| Author: | Midgen [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I probably didn't explain it well, but the company I work for doesn't contract out. We are an internal network operations team. I completely understand that in some cases there are contractual obligations that require a certain number of certain types of certifications. In my situation this is definitely not the case. My boss is just whacky. One of these days I'll write a rant thread detailing some of the fun we have working for her... |
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| Author: | Elmarnieh [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 3:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I don't have any certs and have never had a problem getting any job I wanted without them. I've hired people for IT positions before and we never even looked at certs. |
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| Author: | shuyung [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 4:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
It depends on what you're talking about. Helpdesk and other entry-level positions generally do not look for certifications. Get into network engineering and architecture, though, and if you don't have the contacts, you'll probably need some certs. |
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| Author: | Elmarnieh [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 4:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
When I was working for an IT recruiting company we never recruited anyone without at least 2 years experience. So from our entry level positions to the most senior we had we never considered certifications - only job experience. |
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| Author: | damaged [ Tue Dec 15, 2009 5:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I have a few certifications, but for the most part they're just pieces of paper, if that. It depends on the company though... MS partners tend to like their employees to have MCP certifications. |
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| Author: | Timmit [ Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: |
shuyung wrote: For actively seeking employment, certifications are a great help. Elsewise, they're not of use, unless the company you work for provides incentives for obtaining them. Yeah, I should have mentioned they're good for resume padding.
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