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I just spent a couple of hours in a meeting with a state agency today discussing the a) justifications for, and b) the methods I need to use to make a High School cross country trail ADA compliant.

W... T... F....

Arathain Kelvar wrote:

Who called the meeting, and why?

Having run on some very steep courses as a freshmen, I guess they are expecting that perhaps someone might lose their balance trying to stride out, fall and knock out a tooth. That or running into obstacles along the way.

However, there should be no reason to invoke ADA approval for such a thing - it is just a general hazard associated with cross country, a very low probably, high consequence one at that that bears minimal consideration when designing a course.

You do need to design a XC course, just like you need to design off-road mountain biking trails.

Failure to do so results in terrible drainage/erosion problems.

Or it can be prevented from being a problem in the first place, by having good grading for drainage, shoring up erosion-prone areas with rock or wood borders, or better vegetation nearby, etc.

The goal is to create a path that requires minimal maintenance, rather than one you have to babysit constantly.

The goal is to create a path that requires minimal maintenance, rather than one you have to babysit constantly.

Author:	Arathain Kelvar [ Wed May 12, 2010 4:28 pm ]
Post subject:	Bureacracies
I just spent a couple of hours in a meeting with a state agency today discussing the a) justifications for, and b) the methods I need to use to make a High School cross country trail ADA compliant. W... T... F....

Author:	shuyung [ Wed May 12, 2010 5:28 pm ]
Post subject:
Well, you wouldn't want tree branches knocking people's teeth out.

Author:	FarSky [ Wed May 12, 2010 5:32 pm ]
Post subject:
Now that we have a corporate structure established, and I'm working out of an office again (rather than from home), presidents and managers have been brought on. Once upon a time, I was able to do my *** work. I got **** done. Those halcyon days seem a distant memory now, as I'm constantly being called away from my work for a meeting. Or a conference call. Or a conference call to discuss the meeting that we'll have tomorrow. Or a meeting to set up a conference call to discuss a meeting... GAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH! LET. ME. WORK. Work doesn't get done by sitting around talking about it. Work gets done by getting work done*. I swear, conference calls were invented solely so that managers could fill their otherwise entirely useless time with an activity that gives the appearance of working, but without the stress of actually accomplishing anything.

Author:	Arathain Kelvar [ Wed May 12, 2010 5:48 pm ]
Post subject:	Re:
FarSky wrote: meetings MEETINGS To really succeed in a business or organization, it is sometimes helpful to know what your job is, and whether it involves any duties. Ask among your coworkers. "Hi," you should say. "I'm a new employee. What is the name of my job?" If they answer "long-range planner" or "lieutenant governor," you are pretty much free to lounge around and do crossword puzzles until retirement. Most jobs, however, will require some work. There are two major kinds of work in modern organizations: 1. Taking phone messages for people who are in meetings, and... 2. Going to meetings. Your ultimate career strategy will be to get a job involving primarily No. 2, going to meetings, as soon as possible, because that's where the real prestige is. It is all very well and good to be able to take phone messages, but you are never going to get a position of power, a position where you can cost thousands of people their jobs with a single bonehead decision, unless you learn how to attend meetings. The first meeting ever was held back in the Mezzanine Era. In those days, Man's job was to slay his prey and bring it home for Woman, who had to figure out how to cook it. The problem was, Man was slow and basically naked, whereas the prey had warm fur and could run like an antelope. (In fact it was an antelope, only nobody knew this). At last someone said, "Maybe if we just sat down and did some brainstorming, we could come up with a better way to hunt our prey!" It went extremely well, plus it was much warmer sitting in a circle, so they agreed to meet again the next day, and the next. But the women pointed out that, prey-wise, the men had not produced anything, and the human race was pretty much starving. The men agreed that was serious and said they would put it right near the top of their "agenda". At this point, the women, who were primitive but not stupid, started eating plants, and thus modern agriculture was born. It never would have happened without meetings. The modern business meeting, however, might better be compared with a funeral, in the sense that you have a gathering of people who are wearing uncomfortable clothing and would rather be somewhere else. The major difference is that most funerals have a definite purpose. Also, nothing is really ever buried in a meeting. An idea may look dead, but it will always reappear at another meeting later on. If you have ever seen the movie, "Night of the Living Dead," you have a rough idea of how modern meetings operate, with projects and proposals that everyone thought were killed rising up constantly from their graves to stagger back into meetings and eat the brains of the living. There are two major kinds of meetings: 1. Meetings that are held for basically the same reason that Arbor Day is observed - namely, tradition. For example, a lot of managerial people like to meet on Monday, because it's Monday. You'll get used to it. You'd better, because this kind account for 83% of all meetings (based on a study in which I wrote down numbers until one of them looked about right). This type of meeting operates the way "Show and Tell" does in nursery school, with everyone getting to say something, the difference being that in nursery school, the kids actually have something to say. When it's your turn, you should say that you're still working on whatever it is you're supposed to be working on. This may seem pretty dumb, since obviously you'd be working on whatever you're supposed to be working on, and even if you weren't, you'd claim you were, but that's the traditional thing for everyone to say. It would be a lot faster if the person running the meeting would just say, "Everyone who is still working on what he or she is supposed to be working on, raise your hand." You'd be out of there in five minutes, even allowing for jokes. But this is not how we do it in America. My guess is, it's how they do it in Japan. 2. Meetings where there is some alleged purpose. These are trickier, because what you do depends on what the purpose is. Sometimes the purpose is harmless, like someone wants to show slides of pie charts and give everyone a big, fat report. All you have to do in this kind of meeting is sit there and have elaborate fantasies, then take the report back to your office and throw it away, unless, of course, you're a vice president, in which case you write the name of a subordinate in the upper right hand corner, followed be a question mark, like this: "Norm?" Then you send it to Norm and forget all about it (although it will plague Norm for the rest of his career). But sometimes you go to meetings where the purpose is to get your "input" on something. This is very serious because what it means is, they want to make sure that in case whatever it is turns out to be stupid or fatal, you'll get some of the blame, so you have to escape from the meeting before they get around to asking you anything. One way is to set fire to your tie. Another is to have an accomplice interrupt the meeting and announce that you have a phone call from someone very important, such as the president of the company or the Pope. It should be one or the other. It would a sound fishy if the accomplice said, "You have a call from the president of the company, or the Pope." You should know how to take notes at a meeting. Use a yellow legal pad. At the top, write the date and underline it twice. Now wait until an important person, such as your boss, starts talking; when he does, look at him with an expression of enraptured interest, as though he is revealing the secrets of life itself. Then write interlocking rectangles like this: (picture of doodled rectangles). If it is an especially lengthy meeting, you can try something like this (Picture of more elaborate doodles and a caricature of the boss). If somebody falls asleep in a meeting, have everyone else leave the room. Then collect a group of total strangers, right off of the street, and have them sit around the sleeping person until he wakes up. Then have one of them say to him, "Bob, your plan is very, very risky. However, you've given us no choice but to try it. I only hope, for your sake, that you know what you're getting yourself into." Then they should file quietly out of the room.

Author:	shuyung [ Wed May 12, 2010 6:11 pm ]
Post subject:
Dave Barry is a very funny man. Also, he likes it when you preserve attributions.

The Glade 4.0 https://gladerebooted.net/

Bureacracies https://gladerebooted.net/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=2918	Page 1 of 1

Author:	Rafael [ Wed May 12, 2010 8:58 pm ]
Post subject:
Having run on some very steep courses as a freshmen, I guess they are expecting that perhaps someone might lose their balance trying to stride out, fall and knock out a tooth. That or running into obstacles along the way. However, there should be no reason to invoke ADA approval for such a thing - it is just a general hazard associated with cross country, a very low probably, high consequence one at that that bears minimal consideration when designing a course.

Author:	Micheal [ Wed May 12, 2010 9:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Bureacracies
Arathain Kelvar wrote: I just spent a couple of hours in a meeting with a state agency today discussing the a) justifications for, and b) the methods I need to use to make a High School cross country trail ADA compliant. W... T... F.... Who called the meeting, and why?

Author:	Arathain Kelvar [ Thu May 13, 2010 11:27 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Bureacracies
Micheal wrote: Arathain Kelvar wrote: I just spent a couple of hours in a meeting with a state agency today discussing the a) justifications for, and b) the methods I need to use to make a High School cross country trail ADA compliant. W... T... F.... Who called the meeting, and why? County (client) asking for funding from State. State must review project to make sure it meets State requirements before funding. Project has nothing to do with trail, but trail cuts through project site and will have to be moved over a bit.

Author:	Kaffis Mark V [ Thu May 13, 2010 11:55 am ]
Post subject:
You do need to design a XC course, just like you need to design off-road mountain biking trails. Failure to do so results in terrible drainage/erosion problems.

Author:	Arathain Kelvar [ Thu May 13, 2010 2:07 pm ]
Post subject:	Re:
Kaffis Mark V wrote: You do need to design a XC course, just like you need to design off-road mountain biking trails. Failure to do so results in terrible drainage/erosion problems. Nah, that can generally be solved with maintenance.

Author:	Kaffis Mark V [ Thu May 13, 2010 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:
Or it can be prevented from being a problem in the first place, by having good grading for drainage, shoring up erosion-prone areas with rock or wood borders, or better vegetation nearby, etc. The goal is to create a path that requires minimal maintenance, rather than one you have to babysit constantly.

Author:	Arathain Kelvar [ Thu May 13, 2010 3:05 pm ]
Post subject:	Re:
Kaffis Mark V wrote: Or it can be prevented from being a problem in the first place, by having good grading for drainage, shoring up erosion-prone areas with rock or wood borders, or better vegetation nearby, etc. The goal is to create a path that requires minimal maintenance, rather than one you have to babysit constantly. True, but I would argue that the benefits do not outweight the impact and expense of designing, permitting, and the necessary clearing and grading to achieve this. You'll discover pretty quickly where your problem areas are, and can probably fix these by hand.

Author:	DFK! [ Thu May 13, 2010 3:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re:
Kaffis Mark V wrote: The goal is to create a path that requires minimal maintenance, rather than one you have to babysit constantly. Well, not if you want to fail at preserving the bureaucratic organization....

Author:	Kaffis Mark V [ Thu May 13, 2010 3:28 pm ]
Post subject:
Note: By "design," I'm not advocating permits, or inspections, or even necessarily drawn-up plans. Simply that there's more to creating a well-built, lasting trail than trampling a path in the dirt.

Author:	Lydiaa [ Mon May 17, 2010 11:40 pm ]
Post subject:
I love meetings... means I get to day dream and play my online MMO time.

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Author:	Kirra [ Mon May 17, 2010 9:52 pm ]
Post subject:
Meeting are frustrating when half the time ..ppl just chat