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 Post subject: Is Ulysses Overrated?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:38 pm 
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Apparently this guy thinks so:

Slate wrote:
Ulysses is an overwrought, overwritten epic of gratingly obvious, self-congratulatory, show-off erudition that, with its overstuffed symbolism and leaden attempts at humor, is bearable only by terminal graduate students who demand we validate the time they've wasted reading it.

:P


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:41 pm 
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Yes. It's indecipherable. I tried looking at the first few pages before and gave up.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:50 pm 
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Oh ****, son.

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And we will risk the ship, ourselves and all.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:19 pm 
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Heh. /inc shitstorm, right?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:24 pm 
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Quote:
Warm sunshine merrying over the sea. The nickel shavingbowl shone, forgotten, on the parapet. Why should I bring it down? Or leave it there all day, forgotten friendship?

He went over to it, held it in his hands awhile, feeling its coolness, smelling the clammy slaver of the lather in which the brush was stuck. So I carried the boat of incense then at Clongowes. I am another now and yet the same. A servant too. A server of a servant.


Does anyone else have trouble reading this or is it just me? Books like these just make me sleepy. It's almost like the ramblings of a schizophrenic.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:28 pm 
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RangerDave wrote:
Heh. /inc shitstorm, right?
Probably not, actually.

I'm just going to take this opportunity to remind you all that you should NEVER google "james joyce love letters".

Image

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Sail forth! steer for the deep waters only!
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For we are bound where mariner has not yet dared to go,
And we will risk the ship, ourselves and all.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:36 pm 
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Given that the first site Google tried to send me to was blocked for Adult Content, I'm guessing that's probably good advice!


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:38 pm 
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Lex Luthor wrote:
Quote:
Warm sunshine merrying over the sea. The nickel shavingbowl shone, forgotten, on the parapet. Why should I bring it down? Or leave it there all day, forgotten friendship?

He went over to it, held it in his hands awhile, feeling its coolness, smelling the clammy slaver of the lather in which the brush was stuck. So I carried the boat of incense then at Clongowes. I am another now and yet the same. A servant too. A server of a servant.


Does anyone else have trouble reading this or is it just me? Books like these just make me sleepy. It's almost like the ramblings of a schizophrenic.

Actually, I kind of like that passage. It's all poetical and sh*t. ;)

Seriously though, Ulysses is on my reading bucket list (and likely will remain there for many years, I'm afraid).


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:40 pm 
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It is readable. I read it just out of high school.

I remember very little of it other than I really enjoyed the overwritten prose, the way that he had of making you stop and think about what had just been read.

No, it is not easily understood. It isn't meant to be. Several artists have tried to make one or a few of their works relevant only to those who can comprehend it. Joyce is one of them.

Though I am interested in what Khross has to say on it.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:12 am 
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In it's defense, though I haven't read it, people enjoyed literature in a different way than we do now in ye olde times.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:46 am 
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Incoming Khross.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:45 am 
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Wwen wrote:
In it's defense, though I haven't read it, people enjoyed literature in a different way than we do now in ye olde times.


I guess if new books were not made since Ulysses then it would not be overrated. Maybe it's deprecated?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:27 am 
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It is my understanding that Ulysses was not written with the intent of being easy or enjoyable to the typical reader, regardless of their education level. Ulysses was an excersize in writing for its own sake, appreciated primarily by linguists, more advanced writers, and some other academics for the very things that make it inaccessible to most of us.

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:33 am 
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"Advanced" writing is actually no more advanced linguistically than your average English speaker except for increased vocabulary, vague references, and intentional obfuscation. It is cool how Ulysses is totally littered with references, if I recall correctly.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:42 am 
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Lex Luthor wrote:
"Advanced" writing is actually no more advanced linguistically than your average English speaker except for increased vocabulary, vague references, and intentional obfuscation. It is cool how Ulysses is totally littered with references, if I recall correctly.


Oh, I don't think that this is the mark of a good peice of literature. In fact, accessibility and wide ranging appeal (which is not the same thing as popularity) are, in my view, somewhat essential for a work to be considered "well written." James Joyce wrote what is little more than an "inside joke" for literature snobs.

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me

█ ♣ █


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:55 am 
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Talya wrote:
Lex Luthor wrote:
"Advanced" writing is actually no more advanced linguistically than your average English speaker except for increased vocabulary, vague references, and intentional obfuscation. It is cool how Ulysses is totally littered with references, if I recall correctly.


Oh, I don't think that this is the mark of a good peice of literature. In fact, accessibility and wide ranging appeal (which is not the same thing as popularity) are, in my view, somewhat essential for a work to be considered "well written." James Joyce wrote what is little more than an "inside joke" for literature snobs.


That's why I put "advanced" in quotes. I'm glad he intended it to be a joke, that redeems it for me.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:59 am 
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Heh. I don't know if he would have liked the comparison.

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But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:11 am 
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Talya wrote:
Oh, I don't think that this is the mark of a good peice of literature. In fact, accessibility and wide ranging appeal (which is not the same thing as popularity) are, in my view, somewhat essential for a work to be considered "well written." James Joyce wrote what is little more than an "inside joke" for literature snobs.

Eh...I used to kind of come down on this side myself, and to extent I still do, but these days I don't think that's entirely fair. I should preface this by saying that I'm speaking to a more general case. I have not read Ulysses myself.

Have you ever seen a masterpiece painting and thought, "I don't particularly care for this painting", i.e. the subject, composition, style, etc., "but I can't deny the painter's skill"? I.e. the way the painting is executed -- the painter's mastery of the medium and technique. It isn't so much that it's an inside joke for art freaks, though you might need to be really into painting in order to appreciate it.

My understanding of Ulysses is that it may be a painting of a cow taking a **** in outer space, but it's a really well-executed painting of a cow taking a **** in outer space.

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Sail forth! steer for the deep waters only!
Reckless, O soul, exploring, I with thee, and thou with me;
For we are bound where mariner has not yet dared to go,
And we will risk the ship, ourselves and all.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:14 am 
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Stathol wrote:
My understanding of Ulysses is that it may be a painting of a cow taking a **** in outer space, but it's a really well-executed painting of a cow taking a **** in outer space.



LOL....okay, that was nice...

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me

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