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 Post subject: Racism & Our Kids....
PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2010 6:24 pm 
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Got a call from my son's dad after he had dropped him back off last night. He wanted to tell me that our son got into time-out at the park for disobeying him.
Apparently, my son was playing on the playground with a group of 10 black kids with the oldest being 12 years old. My boy is 8. According to his father, the boys all got into a little fight and it wound up with our son on the bottom of the pile "because he's the white kid."
His dad told him to stay away from large groups of black kids because he will be singled out and ganged upon anytime a fight or disagreement breaks out.
A little while later, he was back in the group and they all went to the bathroom to have a "boys club meeting no girls allowed" and when his father tried to open the door, it had been locked. Nothing bad happened in there, but he was concerned and put our son in time out because he just did not seem to understand why his dad didn't want him hanging out on the playground with a large group of black boys.
He wanted me to explain this to the boy "without sounding racist."
I tried telling my son where his dad was coming from...."he just wants to protect you...he doesn't want you to get beat up for being the different one....if you were black and they were all white he'd say the same thing"
And my son kept defending them and saying "But mom, that's racist!!"

I'm inclined to agree with my son, but I also understand where his dad is coming from in wanting to teach him how to keep himself safe and not put himself into a dangerous position.

Please keep in mind that we live in po'town Mississippi where there is a huge economic gap...we are not talking clean cut children, we are talking wild kids who cuss and threaten to cut other kids heads off with a knife and stuff on the playground while their parents sit in their cars in the parking lot talking on their cell phones. (I'm not exaggerating, this is how it is.)

Parents, how would you handle this one?

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2010 6:36 pm 
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Politely tell the father that your son can play with who he sees fit. Racist behavior is learned, not inborn, and your son unfortunately just had his first lesson. From here on out, he'll never be colorblind again, and you have an idiot father to thank for it.

My 2 cp.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2010 6:55 pm 
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Yes it is racist that they all piled on the white kid there, and thats why he should stay away from them.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2010 7:05 pm 
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Yeah, I found myself saying "your dad says" and "your dad is just trying to..."
I know things are different down here, I get that, but that was a tough conversation to have....I think my son should be allowed to play with anyone regardless of color, but I'm also supposed to back the other parent up, right?

Race issues are so damn complicated.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2010 7:17 pm 
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Instead of focusing on the fact that these kids are black, focus on the fact that they live in bad neighborhoods and weren't brought up with the same manners your son was raised with. Teach your child to be a winner, and to surround himself with winners.

Change the wording as you see fit.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2010 7:21 pm 
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I think you were right to try and explain his dad's perspective in a way that doesn't make his dad out to be a bad person. Going forward, though, I'd suggest encouraging your son to make decisions about who to hang out with based on the personalities of the kids involved, and I'd strongly encourage his dad to explain any such decisions to your son without referencing race as a factor. If that particular group of kids are trouble-makers, it's totally fine to tell your son not to play with them because they're trouble-makers. Telling him that it's in any way because of their race is just going to set the wrong kinds of assumptions in his 8-year old view of the world. On the other hand, if your son brings up the idea that he was being picked on because he was white, or if his father keeps saying that, I'd tell your son that's possible, but if so, that's just another example of why these particular kids are not nice boys, not that it's a bad idea for him to hang out with black kids in general.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2010 7:41 pm 
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What I did was explain to my son to not look at it in terms of color, but how the boys behave...I said if you see a big group of boys who are talking about hitting, knifing, or hurting others...don't play with them.

If you are in a big group of boys and everyone is relatively nice (as nice as boys can be at play, haha) then don't worry about it.

I tried to explain that his dad wasn't being racist and did my best to explain it but I think my son walked away with the bottom line being: "At dad's house I can't play with those black kids and at mom's house I can."

I don't really like him thinking like that, but I told him that he has to respect and obey his father whether he disagrees with him or not, unless his dad asks him to hurt other people.
Its just that his dad has lived here his whole life and 9 times out of 10 (due to socio-economic factors) its the black kids that beat up the white kids.

It would literally take days to explain how complicated the socio-economic differences are down here, but you just have to take my word for it....so I can see where his dad is coming from....but like my son says, in its purest form it seems like racism.

I'm of the mind that we should be watching our boy at the playground (not sitting in our cars talking on the phone) and watching to see what lessons they are learning from other's behavior.

I think I may have to have another talk with his dad.

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2010 9:22 pm 
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LadyKate wrote:
[...] but I think my son walked away with the bottom line being: "At dad's house I can't play with those black kids and at mom's house I can."
I don't really like him thinking like that, [...]


Why not?

To me, and IANAP, it would be better for him to think his father a racist and dislike that than to become a racist himself.


LK wrote:
[...]but I told him that he has to respect and obey his father whether he disagrees with him or not, unless his dad asks him to hurt other people.


This is still good advice though, even if he ends up thinking his father a racist. Respecting one's parents is important when you're a child.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:19 pm 
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LadyKate wrote:
What I did was explain to my son to not look at it in terms of color, but how the boys behave...I said if you see a big group of boys who are talking about hitting, knifing, or hurting others...don't play with them.


You don't need advice. You should give it.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 6:44 am 
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I always second guess myself, Ry. Plus, I felt like I was disregarding his dad's parental instructions and I think being on the same page with your kids when the parents aren't together is absolutely vital for a healthy relationship for the child, kwim?
Just wanted to make sure I was doing the right thing. Thanks.

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 8:21 am 
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Lenas wrote:
Instead of focusing on the fact that these kids are black, focus on the fact that they live in bad neighborhoods and weren't brought up with the same manners your son was raised with. Teach your child to be a winner, and to surround himself with winners.

Change the wording as you see fit.

So winners = white kids? Got it. I'm glad we're friends.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 8:02 pm 
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Oh shut up. You're smarter than that.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 8:34 pm 
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Yeah, Asians tend to qualify, too.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 10:12 pm 
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I think you have the jist of it. If these kids are bad kids, then that's that and your son shouldn't hang with them. Color is irrelevant to that determination.

As for his Dad, while I agree blanket racism is ignorant, I also think a lot of times there is a reason people feel how they do. They are either inherently afraid of other ethnicities and paranoid, or perhaps they have an overwhelmingly negative personal experience with that particular group. Be it blacks, whites, Asians... Irish, Italians, Russians. If you live in a bad part of town where it happens to be a lot of Russian immigrants, and thus the good and bad are from that group, he might tell his kid to stay away from the Russian children. =

I would make sure my son knows it's not that they are black, it's that they are d-bags (if that's indeed the case). I'd make sure my son knew his dad just wants him safe, he's right about not hanging out with these kids because they are a bad element, but he's wrong to extend that to "all black people".

You can tell him that yes that is racist to extend it to all black people, but he should still respect his father despite this flaw.

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 8:33 am 
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Lenas wrote:
Oh shut up. You're smarter than that.

You're just pissed because you're racist.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 8:34 am 
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That pretty much sums the whole situation up exactly, Dash. Thanks. :)

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 11:46 am 
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If the kids piled on him because he was white, they are racist.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 3:57 pm 
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Avenue Q wrote:
Princeton:
Say, Kate, can I ask you a question?

Kate Monster:
Sure!

Princeton:
Well, you know Trekkie Monster upstairs?

Kate Monster:
Uh huh.

Princeton:
Well, he's Trekkie Monster, and you're Kate Monster.

Kate Monster:
Right.

Princeton:
You're both Monsters.

Kate Monster:
Yeah.

Princeton:
Are you two related?

Kate Monster:
What?! Princeton, I'm surprised at you! I find that racist!

Princeton:
Oh, well, I'm sorry! I was just asking!

Kate Monster:
Well, it's a touchy subject.
No, not all Monsters are related.
What are you trying say, huh?
That we all look the same to you?
Huh, huh, huh?

Princeton:
No, no, no, not at all. I'm sorry,
I guess that was a little racist.

Kate Monster:
I should say so. You should be much more
careful when you're talking about the
sensitive subject of race.

Princeton:
Well, look who's talking!

Kate Monster:
What do you mean?

Princeton:
What about that special Monster School you told me about?

Kate Monster:
What about it?

Princeton:
Could someone like me go there?

Kate Monster:
No, we don't want people like you-

Princeton:
You see?!

You're a little bit racist.

Kate Monster:
Well, you're a little bit too.

Princeton:
I guess we're both a little bit racist.

Kate Monster:
Admitting it is not an easy thing to do...

Princeton:
But I guess it's true.

Kate Monster:
Between me and you,
I think

Both:
Everyone's a little bit racist
Sometimes.
Doesn't mean we go
Around committing hate crimes.
Look around and you will find
No one's really color blind.
Maybe it's a fact
We all should face
Everyone makes judgments
Based on race.

Princeton:
Now not big judgments, like who to hire
or who to buy a newspaper from -

Kate Monster:
No!

Princeton:
No, just little judgments like thinking that Mexican
busboys should learn to speak goddamn English!

Kate Monster:
Right!

Both:
Everyone's a little bit racist
Today.
So, everyone's a little bit racist
Okay!
Ethinic jokes might be uncouth,
But you laugh because
They're based on truth.
Don't take them as
Personal attacks.
Everyone enjoys them -
So relax!

Princeton:
All right, stop me if you've heard this one.

Kate Monster:
Okay!

Princeton:
There's a plan going down and there's only
one paracute. And there's a rabbi, a priest...

Kate Monster:
And a black guy!

Gary Coleman:
Whatchoo talkin' 'bout Kate?

Kate Monster:
Uh...

Gary Coleman:
You were telling a black joke!

Princeton:
Well, sure, Gary, but lots of people tell black jokes.

Gary Coleman:
I don't.

Princeton:
Well, of course you don't - you're black!
But I bet you tell Polack jokes, right?

Gary Coleman:
Well, sure I do. Those stupid Polacks!

Princeton:
Now, don't you think that's a little racist?

Gary Coleman:
Well, damn, I guess you're right.

Kate Monster:
You're a little bit racist.

Gary Coleman:
Well, you're a little bit too.

Princeton:
We're all a little bit racist.

Gary Coleman:
I think that I would
Have to agree with you.

Princeton/Kate Monster:
We're glad you do.

Gary Coleman:
It's sad but true!
Everyone's a little bit racist -

All right!

Kate Monster:
All right!

Princeton:
All right!

Gary Coleman:
All right!
Bigotry has never been
Exclusively white

All:
If we all could just admit
That we are racist a little bit,
Even though we all know
That it's wrong,
Maybe it would help us
Get along.

Princeton:
Oh, Christ do I feel good.

Gary Coleman:
Now there was a fine upstanding black man!

Princeton:
Who?

Gary Coleman:
Jesus Christ.

Kate Monster:
But, Gary, Jesus was white.

Gary Coleman:
No, Jesus was black.

Kate Monster:
No, Jesus was white.

Gary Coleman:
No, I'm pretty sure that Jesus was black-

Princeton:
Guys, guys...Jesus was Jewish!

Brian:
Hey guys, what are you laughing about?

Gary Coleman:
Racism!

Brian:
Cool.

Christmas Eve:
BRIAN! Come back here!
You take out lecycuraburs!

Princeton:
What's that mean?

Brian:
Um, recyclables.
Hey, don't laugh at her!
How many languages do you speak?

Kate Monster:
Oh, come off it, Brian!
Everyone's a little bit racist.

Brian:
I'm not!

Princeton:
Oh no?

Brian:
Nope!

How many Oriental wives
Have you got?

Christmas Eve:
What? Brian!

Princeton:
Brian, buddy, where you been?
The term is Asian-American!

Christmas Eve:
I know you are no
Intending to be
But calling me Oriental -
Offensive to me!

Brian:
I'm sorry, honey, I love you.

Christmas Eve:
And I love you.

Brian:
But you're racist, too.

Christmas Eve:
Yes, I know.
The Jews have all
The money
And the whites have all
The power.
And I'm always in taxi-cab
With driver who no shower!

Princeton:
Me too!

Kate Monster:
Me too!

Gary Coleman:
I can't even get a taxi!

All:
Everyone's a little bit racist
It's true.
But everyone is just about
As racist as you!
If we all could just admit
That we are racist a little bit,
And everyone stopped being
So PC
Maybe we could live in -
Harmony!

Christmas Eve:
Evlyone's a ritter bit lacist!


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 7:34 pm 
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http://www.komonews.com/news/local/103483959.html

Quote:
SEATTLE -- King County prosecutors have accused two men of committing a hate crime in the robbery and beating of West Seattle teenager earlier this year.

Ahmed Y. Mohamed, 22, who is black, and Jonathan Neil Baquiring, 21, who is Asian, have each been charged with first-degree robbery and malicious harassment, the state's hate crime statute.

King County Jail records indicate that Baquiring was booked into jail Tuesday evening. Mohamed is at large and officials have issued a warrant for his arrest.

The victim, 16-year-old Shane McClellan, said he was held hostage and beaten for hours and was attacked because he is white.

The incident happened as Shane was walking home from a birthday party at a friend's house Tuesday around 2 a.m. on May 25.

Shane said two men called to him from the top of a staircase near the intersection of 14th Avenue SW and SW Holden Street. The men asked for a light, and when Shane walked over to oblige, they knocked him to the ground and started kicking him.

The two men knocked the frightened teen around on the staircase, making racially charged remarks.

"They started bringing up the past - like slavery - being like, white people did this," Shane said.

The attackers stripped off McClellan's belt and started whipping his back.

"They said, 'This is for what your people did to our people.' They were like whipping me with my belt, my studded belt," Shane recounts.

According to charging documents, Shane told investigators that the men said "the white man has kept us down," during the beating.

One of the men held a gun against the back of his head and burned his neck with cigarettes, Shane said.

At one point they shoved McClellan's face into a hole with the gun against his head. They also urinated on him and poured beer over him.

"What he told me, when they were beating him with the belt, they were saying, 'I don't like white people,'" said Shane's father, Tim McClellan.

Shane recalled, "They're like, 'Aw, white boy, what are you doing? You can't hang out this late. What are you doing around here?' They're like, 'White boy has no belonging - being out here at 2 a.m.'"

"They targeted me for being white, and they made it very clear thats why they were assaulting me," Shane said.

The victim's father said the attack was nothing short of hours of torture.

"Put a gun to the back of his head and told him if he said anything they were going to blow his head off while they sat there and burned him with cigarettes on the back of the neck," he says.

The two assailants held the teen on the ground for some time, and he eventually passed out.

When he regained consciousness, the attackers were gone. They had taken his money, a coat and an MP3 player.

A police officer found the two suspects a short time later, and they had dried blood on their bodies and a pack of cigarettes that matched the type found near the scene where Shane was attacked.

According to court documents, the dried blood samples taken from Mohamed and Baquiring matched Shane's blood.

Officials said Mohamed has prior conviction for carrying concealed weapon, and Baquiring has no known criminal history.

Prosecutors said they would ask that both be held on $500,000 bail.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 10:59 am 
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Uncle Fester wrote:
A police officer found the two suspects a short time later, and they had dried blood on their bodies and a pack of cigarettes that matched the type found near the scene where Shane was attacked.

According to court documents, the dried blood samples taken from Mohamed and Baquiring matched Shane's blood.

Officials said Mohamed has prior conviction for carrying concealed weapon,


Quote:
Mohamed is at large and officials have issued a warrant for his arrest.


Aaaaaahhhhhh WTF!!!

What the hell does it take??


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 12:30 pm 
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But, but, but... Only whites can commit hate crimes

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