RangerDave wrote:
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
So, as I said, he can't discredit the statements, so he's attempting to discredit the source.
Just so I understand - you think questioning a source's judgment based on the track record of their prior judgments is "attempting to discredit the source" and is thus not a persuasive point? Yes?
So let's say that you, Taly and I are all discussing hockey. I cite a bunch of stats and make a prediction about who will win the Stanley Cup this year. Taly disagrees with my prediction, and tries to convince you that I'm wrong. Obviously, my prediction is derived from three things - the raw stats themselves, my analysis of those stats, and my judgment as to what conclusion should then be drawn. Taly doesn't object to the stats that I cited, but she does think my analysis and judgment are flawed. In making her argument to you, therefore, she concedes the accuracy of the stats, offers her contrary analysis of those stats, and points out that I have a long history of poor judgment and crappy conclusions (i.e., I can't pick a winner to save my life).
That would be argumentum ad hominem.
If, however, objective failure rates and objective information was presented to discredit your "analysis and projections," that would not be ad hom. It would just be factually discrediting you. Theoretically, this is also an appeal to history, but that's a pretty weak fallacy to use against an argument, in my opinion, unless we believe past behaviors don't predict future behaviors.
That isn't what this author has done against Woodward, instead presenting only subjective material without disputing the underlying facts. Furthermore, because the author is presenting a contrasting book/viewpoint, the author himself is subject to bias.
A bias and a fallacy in making an argument generally make me discredit something entirely.
RD wrote:
Consider another scenario, this time involving dishonesty. If some salesman has cheated you multiple times in the past, and your friend argues against his latest offer by citing those prior examples of dishonesty, is that an unpersuasive attack on the source? Should he restrict his argument to a clean-slate evaluation of the current offer? Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice...shame on you again because I shouldn't hold your prior dishonesty against you?
It depends. This would technically be an appeal to history again, but I'm not sure I'd consider it wrong for the same reason mentioned above.