The Glade 4.0 :: View topic - What do you do in this situation?

Human suck, and need to die off ASAP.

Sam wrote:

Human suck, and need to die off ASAP.

Great idea. You go first.

stuff...Follow policy and don't get sued, even if it is at the expense of a 13 year old's life under my supervision... more stuff.

/troll off

Sam wrote:

stuff...Follow policy and don't get sued, even if it is at the expense of a 13 year old's life under my supervision... more stuff.

Do not follow Policy, get sued... lose job, lose however many years of tenure you have at the job. Potentially be unable to support your family and end up in a shittier situation. It is a shitty turnabout no matter how you look at it.

Also consider the harm the bus driver could do if he tries to interact with the child and has no emergency medical training. Then he tries to help, and suddenly the parents of the kid who was beaten up end up suing as well. And you potentially cause even worse damages to the kid if you do not know what you are doing...

/troll back on

I believe I would not be capable of standing by. Anyone who makes the decision not to intervene under the basis that it is "unsafe", well, I cannot second-guess them. Anyone who makes the decision not to intervene under the fear that they will be punished or sued is a bloody coward.

Cowardice and pragmatism are often the same thing. Don't like it? Don't live in a society that creates incentives for cowardice. Then pragmatism would swing towards helping the kid.

If someone, like Arathin, wants to be "**** the consequences" that's fine, but I don't blame him (the driver) for not wanting to and he shouldn't be held legally liable for not doing so in light of school policy.

You try to help. If you **** it up, you **** it up, but you try to help.

Arathain Kelvar wrote:

You try to help. If you **** it up, you **** it up, but you try to help.

Nope. I ain't losin my job for that ****. If I'm told to call for help and not intervene, then that's exactly what I'm doing.

I don't care if he's a kid, his life is not inherently more valuable than mine. Especially to me.

According to Pinellas school bus driver policy the driver's first duty is to call dispatch, and only has to step in if they think it's safe. They're not required to intervene.

Author:	Nitefox [ Sat Aug 03, 2013 6:43 pm ]
Post subject:	What do you do in this situation?
http://www.wfla.com/story/22958589/new- ... bus-attack Should the driver have done something to stop them? The rules on what he can/can't do seem pretty crappy. Kid is getting beat like a rented mule and it seems nothing can be done. Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson unavailable for comment.

Author:	Raltar [ Sat Aug 03, 2013 7:05 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
I probably wouldn't have intervened, either. These are school children and as an adult, I could get sued just for touching them. Even worse is that these kids were black and I would be labeled a racist for trying to step in. If the rules were different, I would like to think I would have stepped in, but I don't know for sure because regardless of my adult status, I don't know how old these pieces of trash were and a three on one isn't a situation you want to be on even if they were a couple of young teens(they could have weapons, even). This really is a situation where you are damned if you do and damned if you don't and something needs to be changed here. I certainly would have checked on the victim after the thugs left, though, which apparently this bus driver didn't do. That's a pretty scumbag move, I'll admit. Still, policy is pretty clear and I don't think he should be punished at all.

Author:	Rorinthas [ Sat Aug 03, 2013 8:51 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
It sounds like he followed the rules and the policy. I don't advocate the untrained getting in the middle of a fight. I've been told in Indiana, where my Youth Pastor used to drive schoolbus, any fight is an affair for the local police, stop the bus immediately and call them. However it does seem like in Florida you can't win for losing.

Author:	Jasmy [ Sat Aug 03, 2013 11:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
Personally, if I was a school bus driver, and knowing what I know, I would have a baseball bat next to me at all times. Those punks would be backpedaling as the police were on their way. There would be no escape...doors would be on lockdown until the police and ambulance were on scene. As a mother and as a human being, I would not tolerate that **** even if it meant I would get sued. They can always try to get blood from a turnip...they may not succeed.

Author:	Aizle [ Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:46 am ]
Post subject:
I would have intervened. This is also why I haven't looked at getting into education. I would be fired fairly quickly. We as the public have only ourselves to blame. It's never our kids that are the problem. Always it's the teachers or the schools. That attitude has allowed the lawsuits that have created the types of policies shown in that article.

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Author:	LadyKate [ Sun Aug 04, 2013 9:17 am ]
Post subject:
From a realistic standpoint, I'm with Raltar in that the bus driver would be in more trouble had he stepped in and touched any of those kids, even the victim just to check on him. It's sad, but that's just the way it is.

Author:	DFK! [ Sun Aug 04, 2013 12:02 pm ]
Post subject:
In our society, litigious as it is, I would not have stepped in.

Author:	Foamy [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:50 am ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
The bus driver seems to be in a "Damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation" Had he laid hands on the POS attackers, there would be three sets of parents who would likely be suing him for touching them. Had he done nothing...well, we see where that is getting him now. Hmmm, I wonder why Obama isn't commenting that any one of those three thugs looks like the son he would have. I hope they throw the book at those attackers and call it a hate crime. I shudder to think of what I would likely do if that were my child on the receiving end of a cowardly beating like that.

Author:	Diamondeye [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:13 am ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
They probably would aim the real lawsuit at the school district, not him. It would go where the deep pockets were. Also, being able to file a lawsuit and being able to win one are two different things. I don't know if he has a union or not, but he might have been able to get a lawyer through them if he did.

Author:	Numbuk [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:51 am ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
My reactions: 1. I know that school district. 2. Three 15 year-olds beating a 13 year-old? The physical difference between those two ages are massive. Those kids are **** cowards. 3. The driver followed policy, yet just as always, society wants to blame anything or anyone they can. Anything but "the children."

Author:	Arathain Kelvar [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:50 pm ]
Post subject:
I believe I would not be capable of standing by. Anyone who makes the decision not to intervene under the basis that it is "unsafe", well, I cannot second-guess them. Anyone who makes the decision not to intervene under the fear that they will be punished or sued is a bloody coward.

Author:	Sam [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 5:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
Some of the answers in this thread support my views on humans. Follow policy and don't get sued, even if it is at the expense of a 13 year old's life under my supervision........ The disconnect I feel for some people on this board is at times unbelievable. But it's no different than how I feel for the rest of the world. Human suck, and need to die off ASAP.

Author:	Hopwin [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:11 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
Sam wrote: Human suck, and need to die off ASAP. Despite the hilarity of the double standard in your post, I would like to subscribe to this portion of your newsletter.

Author:	darksiege [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:19 pm ]
Post subject:
but those three were obviously fine upstanding students... and that kid could have hurt their writing hands. So obviously he was at fault. KILL WHITEY!

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Author:	Diamondeye [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:48 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
Sam wrote: Human suck, and need to die off ASAP. Great idea. You go first.

Author:	Müs [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 7:26 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
Diamondeye wrote: Sam wrote: Human suck, and need to die off ASAP. Great idea. You go first. Nah, we can probably start with the lowest common denominator. Y'know, those people that commit violence against people, and watch Honey Boo Boo. I think they should go first.

Author:	darksiege [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 8:02 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
/troll off Sam wrote: stuff...Follow policy and don't get sued, even if it is at the expense of a 13 year old's life under my supervision... more stuff. Do not follow Policy, get sued... lose job, lose however many years of tenure you have at the job. Potentially be unable to support your family and end up in a shittier situation. It is a shitty turnabout no matter how you look at it. Also consider the harm the bus driver could do if he tries to interact with the child and has no emergency medical training. Then he tries to help, and suddenly the parents of the kid who was beaten up end up suing as well. And you potentially cause even worse damages to the kid if you do not know what you are doing... There is no good way around this. 3 douchebag kids decided to assault a younger child and now this dude is in the **** for it. /troll back on

Author:	DFK! [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 8:48 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: What do you do in this situation?
darksiege wrote: /troll off Sam wrote: stuff...Follow policy and don't get sued, even if it is at the expense of a 13 year old's life under my supervision... more stuff. Do not follow Policy, get sued... lose job, lose however many years of tenure you have at the job. Potentially be unable to support your family and end up in a shittier situation. It is a shitty turnabout no matter how you look at it. Also consider the harm the bus driver could do if he tries to interact with the child and has no emergency medical training. Then he tries to help, and suddenly the parents of the kid who was beaten up end up suing as well. And you potentially cause even worse damages to the kid if you do not know what you are doing... /troll back on Don't forget that to stop the fight you would probably have to physically intervene, opening you to assault charges against a minor, during trial for which you'd probably get ass-raped in jail numerous times, so that even if found not-guilty you have the joy of many carnal violations. Arathain Kelvar wrote: I believe I would not be capable of standing by. Anyone who makes the decision not to intervene under the basis that it is "unsafe", well, I cannot second-guess them. Anyone who makes the decision not to intervene under the fear that they will be punished or sued is a bloody coward. Cowardice and pragmatism are often the same thing. Don't like it? Don't live in a society that creates incentives for cowardice. Then pragmatism would swing towards helping the kid.

Author:	Arathain Kelvar [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 8:48 pm ]
Post subject:
You try to help. If you ** it up, you ** it up, but you try to help.

Author:	Rorinthas [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 8:54 pm ]
Post subject:
Yeah it sucks to be that situation, but it's not one of his creating, other than he chose to be a bus driver knowing the rules. The ones who should be going to court over this are the attackers. They're old enough to know better and contemplate the consequences of their actions in JDC. If someone, like Arathin, wants to be "**** the consequences" that's fine, but I don't blame him (the driver) for not wanting to and he shouldn't be held legally liable for not doing so in light of school policy.

Author:	Rorinthas [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:01 pm ]
Post subject:
Personally I have no martial training and those boys are probably a lot closer to their physical prime than I am. Everyone's probably better served by me being a good witness, keeping other students calm, and reporting to the authorities. I don't think that makes me a coward or uncaring. It's just a valid, honest analysis of my limitations versus the situation.

Author:	Arathain Kelvar [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:13 pm ]
Post subject:	Re:
Rorinthas wrote: If someone, like Arathin, wants to be "**** the consequences" that's fine, but I don't blame him (the driver) for not wanting to and he shouldn't be held legally liable for not doing so in light of school policy. To be honest, the consequences of not intervening are far worse. I would relive that moment over and over forever. I think I would lose a great deal of respect for myself. How could I look my son in the eye, or my father? How would I ever be able to convince my wife that I would be willing to protect our children? I'd gladly take a lawsuit over that nightmare.

Author:	Müs [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:18 pm ]
Post subject:	Re:
Arathain Kelvar wrote: You try to help. If you ** it up, you it up, but you try to help. Nope. I ain't losin my job for that **. If I'm told to call for help and not intervene, then that's exactly what I'm doing. I don't care if he's a kid, his life is not inherently more valuable than mine. Especially to me.

Author:	Sam [ Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:29 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Re:
Müs wrote: Arathain Kelvar wrote: You try to help. If you ** it up, you it up, but you try to help. Nope. I ain't losin my job for that . If I'm told to call for help and not intervene, then that's exactly what I'm doing. I don't care if he's a kid, his life is not inherently more valuable than mine. Especially to me. From the article: Quote:** According to Pinellas school bus driver policy the driver's first duty is to call dispatch, and only has to step in if they think it's safe. They're not required to intervene. So, by their policy, they are not restricted from intervening. I would expect a Christian like AK to want to step in regardless of the fallout, because it's pretty apparent his God doesn't care about his money but his actions, and helping a 13 year old vs 3 older attackers on the driver's watch is the right thing to do. As a non-religious person, I know it's the right thing to do because I don't suck.