International evidence and comparisons have long been offered as proof of the mantra that more guns mean more deaths and that fewer guns, therefore, mean fewer deaths. Unfortunately, such discussions are all too often been afflicted by misconceptions and factual error and focus on comparisons that are unrepresentative. It may be useful to begin with a few examples. There is a compound assertion that(a) guns are uniquely available in the United States compared with other modern developed nations, which is why (b) the United States has by far the highest murder rate. Though these assertions have been endlessly repeated, statement (b) is, in fact, false and statement (a) is substantially so.

Particularly corrosive to the mantra are the facts as to rural African‐Americans gun ownership. Per capita, rural African‐Americans are much more likely to own firearms than are urban African‐Americans. Yet, despite their greater access to guns, the firearm murder rate of young rural black males is a small fraction of the firearm murder rate of young urban black males

It would definitely reduce suicide though. The vast majority of suicide attempts fail, but gun suicides usually succeed. If you take guns away as an option all the potential suiciders will have to fall back on less-reliable options.

Citation please?

In the US, the NIMH reports there are 11 nonfatal suicide attempts for every suicide death.[1] The American Association of Suicidology reports higher numbers, stating that there are 25 suicide attempts for every suicide completion.[2] By these numbers, approximately 92-96% of suicide attempts end in survival.

Some suicide methods have higher rates of lethality than others. The use of firearms results in death 90% of the time. Wrist-slashing has a much lower lethality rate, comparatively. 75% of all suicide attempts are by self-poisoning, a method that is often thwarted because the drug is nonlethal or is used at a nonlethal dosage. These people survive 97% of the time.[4]

A nonfatal suicide attempt is the strongest known clinical predictor of eventual suicide.

As I said, many countries where citizens can't get guns have higher suicide rates.

Okay, but surely these other countries also have other attributing factors in someone's decision to kill themselves, right? Like maybe they live in slums, have a lack of freedoms, or are extremely overworked and underpaid? We don't exactly have people jumping out of high rise buildings on the regular like Foxconn does.

Why are we comparing suicide rates in other countries where guns are banned with suicide rates in the US? That's just introducing a lot of confounding variables, and there's no point. We can just look within the US. Some households have guns, some don't. Do the ones with guns have higher suicide rates? The answer is a resounding yes.

Sure, there are probably some confounding variables at work here, but they're a lot easier to deal with than comparing different countries with completely different cultures.

This page has a pretty good summary of all the info: https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matt ... tter/risk/

Okay, but surely these other countries also have other attributing factors in someone's decision to kill themselves, right? Like maybe they live in slums, have a lack of freedoms, or are extremely overworked and underpaid? We don't exactly have people jumping out of high rise buildings on the regular like Foxconn does.

Why are we comparing suicide rates in other countries where guns are banned with suicide rates in the US? That's just introducing a lot of confounding variables, and there's no point.

So not having a gun might prevent those who aren't so committed from succeeding?

Lets's look at just suicide.

According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_in ... ted_States in 2009 there were ~40,000 suicides in a year. Approximately half (20,000) were done with guns. Lets assume we save every one of those people, and they don't try to kill themselves some other Ok, we ban guns and save 20k lives. Why stop there?

According to the cdc (http://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_statist ... _mortality) Second hand smoke could be responsible for as many as 49,000 deaths every year. Ooops, its got to go too. Way worse, and those people aren't even trying to kill themselves. You don't have a constitutional right to tobacco either.

Shall I go on?

Banning firearms to reduce murder and suicide would be just about as effective as banning trolling has been on this message board.

What guns do to promote suicide is provide a convenient method. Now, that is specific to handguns. People don't generally kill themselves with rifles and shotguns. Yes, I know Kurt Cobain swallowed the barrel of a 12-gauge, and he is an exception. Killing yourself with a rifle or shotgun is very cumbersome. The appeal of suicide by gun is that it's quick and convenient. That means pistols. I want to put the barrel to my temple or mouth and pull the trigger, I don't want to have to figure out how to get my toe through the trigger guard because my arm isn't long enough to reach while I've got the barrel in my mouth.

This goes further. Something else that has been observed was the effect of proper firearm safety on deterring suicides. Most gun control advocates are unaware that various state and federal laws prohibit the transportation of loaded firearms. If you're taking a firearm across state lines, you have to transport the weapon and the ammunition in separate containers. Firearm safety goes a step further. I don't know how it is for other states, but Missouri Hunter Education training on firearm safety states that firearms should never be loaded in storage. Ammunition should be removed from the chambers and magazines, returned to the box, and stored in a separate safe or closet, or at the very least on a separate shelf. This safety protocol is older than I am. It was added to address concerns of children hurting themselves with Dad's rifle long before gun control advocates ever got up in arms about children accidentally shooting themselves.

Remember when I said the allure of gun suicide was convenience? The simple act of having to put a bullet in the chamber deters the majority of would-be gun suicides. I'm feeling worthless and low, like the world would be better off without me, and I reach into my nightstand for the pistol so that I can end it all. That's how gun suicide works. It is a momentary thought that is able to be carried out because it only takes a moment. If you have to load the gun, you are likely to change your mind.

In the time it takes me to get out the box of ammunition, open it up, and take out a bullet, the thought has passed. I no longer want to kill myself.