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Don't fly the flag in Haiti.
https://gladerebooted.net/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2258
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Author:  Uncle Fester [ Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Don't fly the flag in Haiti.

Apparently it sends the wrong idea...

http://www.armytimes.com/news/2010/03/g ... ag_031510/

Quote:
Flap flies in Haiti over U.S. flag absence

By Alan Gomez and Oren Dorell - USA Today
Posted : Monday Mar 15, 2010 15:35:11 EDT

The many nations helping Haiti recover from the devastating earthquake that struck there have set up their own military compounds and fly their flags at the entrances.

France's tricolor, Britain's Union Jack and even Croatia's coat of arms flap in the breeze.

But the country whose contributions dwarf the rest of the world's — the United States — has no flag at its main installation near the Port-au-Prince airport.

The lack of the Stars and Stripes does not sit well with some veterans and servicemembers who say the U.S. government should be proud to fly the flag in Haiti, given the amount of money and manpower the U.S. is donating to help the country recover from the Jan. 12 quake.

The Obama administration says flying the flag could give Haiti the wrong idea.

"We are not here as an occupation force, but as an international partner committed to supporting the government of Haiti on the road to recovery," the U.S. government's Haiti Joint Information Center said in response to a query about the flag.

The absence of the American flag bothers former Navy man Arthur Herriford, national president of the Pearl Harbor Survivors Association.

"It's very improper," Herriford said. "Our military people always engage and function under the American colors — always have and always will."

The U.S. flag has flown in Haiti under circumstances that were not always friendly.

In 1915, Marines invaded Haiti to restore stability after several coups. In 1986, President Ronald Reagan pressured dictator Jean-Claude "Baby Doc" Duvalier to renounce his rule and leave. In 1994, President Bill Clinton sent troops to prop up President Jean-Bertrand Aristide. In 2004, President George W. Bush's administration eased Aristide out of office amid a brutal civil war.

France, the former colonizer of the country, has its flag up at its base in Port-au-Prince. The Haiti flag is based on the French flag, turned on its side with the white stripped out.

Army Col. Billy Buckner, spokesman for Joint Task Force-Haiti, a group representing various Obama administration agency heads, said the decision not to fly the American flag was made out of respect as guests of the government of Haiti.

"It is no mystery that U.S. forces are on the ground, and we proudly wear an American flag on our right sleeve," he said.

U.S. Air Force air operations specialists and FAA air-traffic controllers manage air traffic at Haiti's main airport, where millions of dollars in aid from the United States has been arriving for weeks. More than 12,000 U.S. military personnel support relief operations.

"Our commanders are smart and intuitively understand their mission here in Haiti, and clearly the sensitivities that come with supporting the mission," Buckner said.A U.S. flag went up at a temporary consular station set up in the first few days on the airport tarmac, according to Charles Luoma-Overstreet, a State Department spokesman in Haiti.

"Apparently, the prime minister (Jean-Max Bellerive) saw this" and thought it appeared as if the United States were taking over the airport, Luoma-Overstreet said.

He said Bellerive said something to U.S. Ambassador Kenneth Merten, who agreed that flying the flag wasn't a good idea and told the consular officials to take it down.

The decision is not unprecedented, noted Joe Davis, spokesman for the Veterans of Foreign Wars, who says he is not bothered by the flag's absence.

During the Gulf War in 1991, U.S. forces took control of the main airport in Kuwait and briefly flew the American flag over their installation, Davis said, but higher-ups ordered it taken down to avoid an impression that U.S. forces were conquerors.

The missing American colors at Port-au-Prince airport were no problem to Don Hollenbaugh, a former Army Delta Force operator who received the Distinguished Service Cross for actions in Fallujah, Iraq, in 2004.

"Everybody in the world knows the U.S. is there," Hollenbaugh said. "So by not flying the flag, we're not changing anyone's mind about anything."

Author:  Lydiaa [ Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:38 pm ]
Post subject: 

We could totally send you a flag to fly if you'd like... we don't mind if people have the wrong idea about us... Now please kindly give me the address for said flag sending ^-^

Not to poke at a sore issue.. but you guys sure he's American?

Author:  Diamondeye [ Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Don't fly the flag in Haiti.

Anyone who would seriously think we were there as conquerors because we're flying a flag is either A) a moron B) just hates the U.S. and will find fault with whatever we do or C) is purposefully finding fault with us for their own ends.

Author:  Taskiss [ Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:49 pm ]
Post subject: 

As long as we're appreciated, I don't care. Those folks need help more than some clown needs to worry about what is and isn't flappin' in the wind.

Author:  Diamondeye [ Tue Mar 16, 2010 6:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:

Taskiss wrote:
As long as we're appreciated, I don't care. Those folks need help more than some clown needs to worry about what is and isn't flappin' in the wind.


Exactly. The default condition for us, and everyone else, would be to fly a flag there if for no other reason than so that passersby know who is there at a glance.

Some ****, however, have bought into the nonsense that while every other country is there because they're benevolent loving world community members, the U.S. is there to take over Haiti because we like taking over shitholes for no apparent reason, which they know because well, IRAQ!! DAMNIT!!!11!!!!ONEHUNDREDELEVEN!!

Author:  Lydiaa [ Tue Mar 16, 2010 6:22 pm ]
Post subject: 

Quote:
He said Bellerive said something to U.S. Ambassador Kenneth Merten, who agreed that flying the flag wasn't a good idea and told the consular officials to take it down.


the problem isn't a moron saying something, the problem is an ambassador agreeing with him >.<

Author:  Rorinthas [ Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Don't fly the flag in Haiti.

Diamondeye wrote:
Anyone who would seriously think we were there as conquerors because we're flying a flag is either A) a moron B) just hates the U.S. and will find fault with whatever we do or C) is purposefully finding fault with us for their own ends.


what about B and C. I don't think he's a moron, I think everything he does is very calculated and makes sense in the way he percieves the world.

Author:  Diamondeye [ Tue Mar 16, 2010 9:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Don't fly the flag in Haiti.

Rorinthas wrote:
Diamondeye wrote:
Anyone who would seriously think we were there as conquerors because we're flying a flag is either A) a moron B) just hates the U.S. and will find fault with whatever we do or C) is purposefully finding fault with us for their own ends.


what about B and C. I don't think he's a moron, I think everything he does is very calculated and makes sense in the way he percieves the world.


I'm talking about douchebags in general, not any specific douchebag. The douchebags in question here may very well conform to B, C, or both, or some varient on either or both.

Author:  Rynar [ Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:56 pm ]
Post subject: 

I'm gonna go ahead and file this one under: "Things that don't concern me even a little bit."

Author:  FarSky [ Wed Mar 17, 2010 1:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re:

Rynar wrote:
I'm gonna go ahead and file this one under: "Things that don't concern me even a little bit."

Yeah, this. Very few news stories posted here in the decade I've been around have held less importance, impact, or interest than this.

Author:  Hopwin [ Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re:

Rynar wrote:
I'm gonna go ahead and file this one under: "Things that don't concern me even a little bit."

Pretty much.

Author:  Rafael [ Wed Mar 17, 2010 7:59 pm ]
Post subject: 

Why should be preemtively apologetic for an action that has nothing to do with perceived and ill informed (and probably manufactured for one agenda or another) opinion about why have sent US personnel to Haiti?

Yea, we are doing good there, and we shouldn't stop, but just because people might be offended we fly our flag doesn't mean we shouldn't appease their stupid and unreasonable sensibilities.

It's the same thing when the kid shot up Virginia Tech. The Republic of Korea asked Koreans to fast as a sign of shame for what he did and issued apologies on behalf of Koreans and spread public concern about Korean people living in America. That pissed me off to no end; there's no reason to bring his nationality into it, only send your regards as another concerned nation.

They make a bigger **** problem out of it by trying not to.

Author:  Diamondeye [ Wed Mar 17, 2010 8:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:

Rafael wrote:
Why should be preemtively apologetic for an action that has nothing to do with perceived and ill informed (and probably manufactured for one agenda or another) opinion about why have sent US personnel to Haiti?

Yea, we are doing good there, and we shouldn't stop, but just because people might be offended we fly our flag doesn't mean we shouldn't appease their stupid and unreasonable sensibilities.

It's the same thing when the kid shot up Virginia Tech. The Republic of Korea asked Koreans to fast as a sign of shame for what he did and issued apologies on behalf of Koreans and spread public concern about Korean people living in America. That pissed me off to no end; there's no reason to bring his nationality into it, only send your regards as another concerned nation.

They make a bigger **** problem out of it by trying not to.


I can't speak to Korea, although I think cultural ideas about shame are somewhat different in that culture. In our case, though, we're trying to pre-emptively prevent the sort of propaganda attack that some people would make if we had a flag up.. the same as everyone else.

By pre-empting it, however, we actualy lend legitimacy to this line of nonsense, the worst aspect of which is that it wastes time on total nonsense.

Author:  Rafael [ Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:11 pm ]
Post subject: 

That's pretty much what I felt about the reaction to the shooting, too. By enacting a sense of guilt and shame, none of which had any legitimate bearing on reality, they simply made matters worse.

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