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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 8:59 am 
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Not that this is going to change anyone's opinion here, but...

http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/europe/07 ... tml?hpt=T1

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London, England (CNN) -- An independent report released Wednesday into the leaked "Climategate" e-mails found no evidence to question the "rigor and honesty" of scientists involved.

The scandal fueled skepticism about the case for global warming just weeks before world leaders met to agree a global deal on climate change at a United Nations conference in Copenhagen last December.

The seven-month review, led by Muir Russell, found scientists at the University of East Anglia's Climatic Research Unit (CRU) did not unduly influence reports detailing the scale of the threat of global warming produced by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC).

"We went through this very carefully and we concluded that these behaviors did not damage our judgment of the integrity, the honesty, the rigor with which they had operated as scientists," Russell said.

The 160-page report did however find that the CRU scientists had failed to display "the proper degree of openness" when it came to dealing with public requests for information.

"They had not shown sufficient openness in the way in which they responded to requests for information about what they were doing, about the data that they were processing, about the stations that they were analyzing, so on," he said.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 9:01 am 
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Except, that's a nice piece of spin on the situation. Are we going to be allowed to peer review their work or examine the "lost" original data yet?

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:22 am 
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Khross wrote:
Except, that's a nice piece of spin on the situation. Are we going to be allowed to peer review their work or examine the "lost" original data yet?


Of course not.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 11:21 am 
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Aizle wrote:
Not that this is going to change anyone's opinion here, but...

http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/europe/07 ... tml?hpt=T1

Quote:
London, England (CNN) -- An independent report released Wednesday into the leaked "Climategate" e-mails found no evidence to question the "rigor and honesty" of scientists involved.

The scandal fueled skepticism about the case for global warming just weeks before world leaders met to agree a global deal on climate change at a United Nations conference in Copenhagen last December.

The seven-month review, led by Muir Russell, found scientists at the University of East Anglia's Climatic Research Unit (CRU) did not unduly influence reports detailing the scale of the threat of global warming produced by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC).

"We went through this very carefully and we concluded that these behaviors did not damage our judgment of the integrity, the honesty, the rigor with which they had operated as scientists," Russell said.

The 160-page report did however find that the CRU scientists had failed to display "the proper degree of openness" when it came to dealing with public requests for information.

"They had not shown sufficient openness in the way in which they responded to requests for information about what they were doing, about the data that they were processing, about the stations that they were analyzing, so on," he said.

You're welcome for the help.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 11:44 am 
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And just what help do you think you provided?

I have always agreed that there should be peer reviews and openness.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 11:54 am 
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Which amounts to bad science. You can be an honest bad scientist.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 11:58 am 
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I believe that the jury is still out on whether the science is accurate or not. All the article or I were trying to share was that this panel has determined that there wasn't any kind of liberal conspiracy to fake numbers to support their argument.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 12:11 pm 
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Aizle wrote:
I believe that the jury is still out on whether the science is accurate or not. All the article or I were trying to share was that this panel has determined that there wasn't any kind of liberal conspiracy to fake numbers to support their argument.
Well, see ... that's the problem. The article you link indicates they haven't been sufficiently open to peer review and verifiable repetition. Consequently, until such a point as we can re-establish the credibility of their baseline data and verify said data with repeatable manipulations, experiments, etc.: it's all still hogwash ... scientifically speaking.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:09 pm 
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Nice predjudice there Khross. It isn't so much "hogwash" as it is un-verified.

But yes, they need to open up their findings to peer review. I suspect that given this report and the various mounting pressures for that we will see that happen.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:17 pm 
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absense of evidence is not evidence of absense


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:19 pm 
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Aizle wrote:
Nice predjudice there Khross. It isn't so much "hogwash" as it is un-verified.



That's not how science works.


So while "hogwash" is loaded language, "un-verified" is loaded the other direction. "Bad science" is probably the most neutral term.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:20 pm 
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TheRiov wrote:
absense of evidence is not evidence of absense


It generally is, actually.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:35 pm 
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Lol. No it isn't. I have no evidence that there is a God. It is not evidence that there is not one however.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:39 pm 
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TheRiov wrote:
Lol. No it isn't. I have no evidence that there is a God. It is not evidence that there is not one however.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:02 pm 
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Aizle wrote:
But yes, they need to open up their findings to peer review. I suspect that given this report and the various mounting pressures for that we will see that happen.

Well, that's going to be a problem, since they claim the original data has been lost, meaning there is currently no method by which to check their work, verify their "adjustments, also known as the "trick", etc.

So, calling their conclusions "hogwash" is pretty accurate.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:56 pm 
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So the original information is still not available, but you continue to want to subscribe to it. Great I have a un-available study proving liberalism to psychotic behavior. You can not peer review it or look at the information, but trust me, its valid!

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 3:23 pm 
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Uncle Fester wrote:
So the original information is still not available, but you continue to want to subscribe to it. Great I have a un-available study proving liberalism to psychotic behavior. You can not peer review it or look at the information, but trust me, its valid!


Can you show me where I said here that I subscribe to all the findings of this particular report? Yeah, didn't think so.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 3:24 pm 
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Uncle Fester wrote:
So the original information is still not available, but you continue to want to subscribe to it. Great I have a un-available study proving liberalism to psychotic behavior. You can not peer review it or look at the information, but trust me, its valid!


I could get behind THAT actually... I could also get behind Liberalism being a mental disease.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 3:31 pm 
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Aizle wrote:
Uncle Fester wrote:
So the original information is still not available, but you continue to want to subscribe to it. Great I have a un-available study proving liberalism to psychotic behavior. You can not peer review it or look at the information, but trust me, its valid!


Can you show me where I said here that I subscribe to all the findings of this particular report? Yeah, didn't think so.


That was not aimed at you, but if you feel it was, oh well. But to those who believe that the institution in question was producing reliable scientific evidence. If you feel that way, then yes it was aimed at you.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 4:19 pm 
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Uncle Fester wrote:
Aizle wrote:
Uncle Fester wrote:
So the original information is still not available, but you continue to want to subscribe to it. Great I have a un-available study proving liberalism to psychotic behavior. You can not peer review it or look at the information, but trust me, its valid!


Can you show me where I said here that I subscribe to all the findings of this particular report? Yeah, didn't think so.


That was not aimed at you, but if you feel it was, oh well. But to those who believe that the institution in question was producing reliable scientific evidence. If you feel that way, then yes it was aimed at you.


You posted an article (and created your own title) absolving them of motive, when there is nothing in your article which absolves them of said motive.

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19 Yet she became more and more promiscuous as she recalled the days of her youth, when she was a prostitute in Egypt. 20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

Ezekiel 23:19-20 


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 4:23 pm 
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TheRiov wrote:
Lol. No it isn't. I have no evidence that there is a God. It is not evidence that there is not one however.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 5:15 pm 
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Khross wrote:
Except, that's a nice piece of spin on the situation. Are we going to be allowed to peer review their work or examine the "lost" original data yet?


The Glade never fails to disappoint.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 5:58 pm 
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Monte wrote:
Khross wrote:
Except, that's a nice piece of spin on the situation. Are we going to be allowed to peer review their work or examine the "lost" original data yet?


The Glade never fails to disappoint.


exhibit A to M

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 5:59 pm 
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Monte wrote:
Khross wrote:
Except, that's a nice piece of spin on the situation. Are we going to be allowed to peer review their work or examine the "lost" original data yet?


The Glade never fails to disappoint.


Perhaps, rather than cutting the fool, you would like to explain why peer review, or reexamination of "lost" data points would be a bad thing?

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19 Yet she became more and more promiscuous as she recalled the days of her youth, when she was a prostitute in Egypt. 20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

Ezekiel 23:19-20 


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 6:46 pm 
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Because it would show something other then which he has agreed too...duh!

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