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Court: Congress can regulate "mental activity"
https://gladerebooted.net/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=5556
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Author:  Dash [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 8:36 am ]
Post subject:  Court: Congress can regulate "mental activity"

Under the commerce clause:

http://spectator.org/blog/2011/02/22/fe ... congress-c

Quote:
A federal judge has upheld the national health care law, making it the fifth ruling on the merits of the legal challenges to the individual mandate.

The ruling by the Clinton appointee, U.S. District Court Judge Gladys Kessler of the District of Columbia continues the pattern of Democratic-appointed judges siding with the Obama administration and Republican judges siding with the plaintiffs in ruling the mandate unconstitutional. Kessler's ruling comes in a case brought by individual plaintiffs, where as the two decisions striking down the mandate have come in cases brought by 27 states, based in Virginia and Florida.

Like the other decisions upholding the law, the logic of Kessler's ruling demonstrates how broadly one has to interpret congressional powers to find the mandate constitutional. In something right out of Harrison Bergeron, Kessler notes that Washington has the authority to regulate "mental activity":

Quote:
As previous Commerce Clause cases have all involved physical activity, as opposed to mental activity, i.e. decision-making, there is little judicial guidance on whether the latter falls within Congress’s power...However, this Court finds the distinction, which Plaintiffs rely on heavily, to be of little significance. It is pure semantics to argue that an individual who makes a choice to forgo health insurance is not “acting,” especially given the serious economic and health-related consequences to every individual of that choice. Making a choice is an affirmative action, whether one decides to do something or not do something. They are two sides of the same coin. To pretend otherwise is to ignore reality.


It is worth noting, however, that even Kessler concedes that "there is little judicial guidance" on this question.

Also, Kessler joined the other four judges in dismissing the Obama administration's fallback argument that the mandate was justified under Congress's taxing power, ruling "that Congress did not intend the mandatory payment...to act as a revenue-raising tax, but rather as a punitive measure." Given that even those judges sympathetic to the Commerce Clause argument have rejected the taxation argument, I wonder if the administration will eventually abandon it as the case moves up the food chain.

Author:  Kaffis Mark V [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 9:02 am ]
Post subject: 

Wow.

So Congress gets to now make laws to dictate your decisions. Go free society!

Author:  Arathain Kelvar [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:07 am ]
Post subject: 

So Congress has the authority to regulate interstate commerce, and interstate non-commerce.

Author:  Khross [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Court: Congress can regulate "mental activity"

Hmmmms ...

Author:  Elmarnieh [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re:

Arathain Kelvar wrote:
So Congress has the authority to regulate interstate commerce, and interstate non-commerce.


Its been told it has this authority since Wickard.

Author:  Talya [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:25 am ]
Post subject: 

This is just prepation for the day when it becomes technologically feasible for the RIAA/MPAA lobby to bill you every time you think about one of their intellectual properties.

Author:  Hopwin [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 12:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:

Talya wrote:
This is just prepation for the day when it becomes technologically feasible for the RIAA/MPAA lobby to bill you every time you think about one of their intellectual properties.

Is the RIAA or MPAA doing anything as of late? It's been two-three years since I heard a peep about them taking folk to court.

Author:  Talya [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 12:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Re:

Hopwin wrote:
Talya wrote:
This is just prepation for the day when it becomes technologically feasible for the RIAA/MPAA lobby to bill you every time you think about one of their intellectual properties.

Is the RIAA or MPAA doing anything as of late? It's been two-three years since I heard a peep about them taking folk to court.

They are still busy protecting their "intellectual property." They just realized the bad press from suing apparently random people was hurting their cause, so officially stopped it a couple years ago. They still issue cease-and-desist orders, but instead are focusing on banning the technologies that enable sharing.

Author:  Lex Luthor [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:

Talya wrote:
This is just prepation for the day when it becomes technologically feasible for the RIAA/MPAA lobby to bill you every time you think about one of their intellectual properties.


Won't ever happen, people don't tolerate things like this (yes I know you're exaggerating). Law follows culture.

Author:  Hopwin [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Re:

Talya wrote:
They are still busy protecting their "intellectual property." They just realized the bad press from suing apparently random people was hurting their cause, so officially stopped it a couple years ago. They still issue cease-and-desist orders, but instead are focusing on banning the technologies that enable sharing.


Who'd they hit last year? :(

Author:  Xequecal [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 2:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:

Kaffis Mark V wrote:
Wow.

So Congress gets to now make laws to dictate your decisions. Go free society!


Well, yes. Unless you think conspiracy laws are also all unconstitutional.

Author:  Dash [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 2:48 pm ]
Post subject: 

So what about people who dont exercise. Arent they actively choosing not to do so and doesnt that have a "serious economic and health-related consequences to every individual of that choice"

Author:  Kaffis Mark V [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 3:05 pm ]
Post subject: 

Conspiracy requires demonstrating that planning occurred. Doing so is really criminalizing the preparation and/or collusion between individuals, all of which is more than a mere decision.

Author:  Khross [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Court: Congress can regulate "mental activity"

Conspiracy statutes are unconstitutional.

Author:  Wwen [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 3:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Re:

Hopwin wrote:
Talya wrote:
This is just prepation for the day when it becomes technologically feasible for the RIAA/MPAA lobby to bill you every time you think about one of their intellectual properties.

Is the RIAA or MPAA doing anything as of late? It's been two-three years since I heard a peep about them taking folk to court.

You're not paying attention to the right places. Technology sites like arstechnica still has RIAA/MPAA news frequently.

Author:  Xequecal [ Wed Feb 23, 2011 3:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:

Kaffis Mark V wrote:
Conspiracy requires demonstrating that planning occurred. Doing so is really criminalizing the preparation and/or collusion between individuals, all of which is more than a mere decision.


You can be convicted of conspiracy even if you don't involve anyone else. The health care decision requires a similar level of forethought and weighing the pros and cons than deciding to commit a crime does.

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