The Glade 4.0

"Turn the lights down, the party just got wilder."
It is currently Mon Nov 25, 2024 7:28 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 46 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:44 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:03 am
Posts: 4922
http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/201 ... ankle.html

Quote:
A security guard says she suffered a broken ankle after being arrested for not helping cops subdue a suspect - even though she told police she couldn't leave her post.

The NYPD and Civilian Complaint Review Board are investigating the allegations by Anyeris Reyes, 22, a guard at an Audubon Ave. apartment complex in Washington Heights.

Reyes said that on March 19 around 8 p.m., two plainclothes narcotics cops struggled to subdue a suspect right outside of the building she was guarding. After additional cops helped get the man under control, officers berated Reyes for not lending a hand.

Reyes said a cop scolded her, "You stupid b---h, why didn't you help me?"

Reyes, who says she's not allowed to leave her post, told the cop: "I'm not a police officer, just a security guard. ... I'm not even allowed to step out of the building."

Five minutes later, Reyes said a sergeant walked in and told her, "Yo, b---h, get up. You're coming with us," before cuffing her hands behind her back and placing her under arrest.

The 5-foot-7, 255-pound Reyes said that when she told a cop she was "too short and too heavy" to get up into the police van, an officer told her: "B---h, why should we help you if you didn't help one of our guys?"

Then Reyes said the cop told her to lean on his shoulder and step into the van, only to move out of the way so she fell to the ground.

"He just let me fall. He was just laughing at me. I got up, and they threw me in the wagon," she said.

Her ankle swelling, Reyes said she was forced to watch cops strip-search male prisoners at the 33rd Precinct, where her supervisor told cops that she was not allowed to step out of the building.

"We don't wear bulletproof vests, we don't have weapons. We're not cops," said Reyes, who was issued a desk appearance ticket and charged with "refusing to aid a peace or a police officer," a class B misdemeanor.

Her court date is April 20.

Meanwhile, Reyes said she was in pain. EMTs called to the stationhouse took her to nearby New York-Presbyterian Hospital Columbia, where X-rays showed she had a fractured ankle.

"The doctor said I'm going to have long-term pain standing and walking," said Reyes. The Civilian Complaint Review Board confirmed Reyes filed a complaint March 24.

A police spokesman would not comment, except to say the chief of department's office also has launched an investigation.


Cops can't order you to subdue someone. This is ridiculous.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:04 pm 
Offline
Home of the Whopper
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:51 am
Posts: 6098
I'm not touching this one. I'd love to hear what DE has to say, though.

_________________
"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:12 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 7:59 pm
Posts: 9412
Wait, "refusing to aid a peace or a police officer" is a class B misdemeanor? WTF?

_________________
"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:18 pm 
Offline
Rihannsu Commander

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:31 am
Posts: 4709
Location: Cincinnati OH
http://law.onecle.com/new-york/penal/PE ... 95.10.html

Quote:
§ 195.10 Refusing to aid a peace or a police officer.
A person is guilty of refusing to aid a peace or a police officer
when, upon command by a peace or a police officer identifiable or
identified to him as such, he unreasonably fails or refuses to aid such
peace or a police officer in effecting an arrest, or in preventing the
commission by another person of any offense.
Refusing to aid a peace or a police officer is a class B misdemeanor.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:08 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 6:49 pm
Posts: 330
That is the dumbest law ever. Disregarding that from the story they never actually asked for her help and if she was inside the whole time how could she hear them anyway. So if a cop says charge that suspect while I provide cover fire you can get arrested if you don't (I know extreme silly argument but that is essentially what the law says.)

I could see so many issues with this, a cop struggling with a suspect asks for help and the person helping kills the suspect either on purpose or accidentally who is liable? Who pays for the legal costs when the persons family sues? As the supervisor said they do not have the training or weapons or anything else to help, and could make the situation worse. I guarantee they would have been just as pissed off if she had tried to help and made it worse and the guy got away, so a no win situation there.

A long time ago when I was younger a police chase ended on my street with a crash. I looked through the window and saw a guy running and a fat cop trying to chase him. The guy ran right by my apartment door (there was a fence on the other side) I was standing at the door when he ran by. I stuck my foot out and tripped him and he went flying. I would not do the same thing today. Too much liability trying to help. If I saw someone was in danger then I would probably push past that but it would take a lot more these days for me to "help"

_________________
I met this six-year-old child, with this blank, pale, emotionless face and, the blackest eyes... the devil's eyes. I spent eight years trying to reach him, and then another seven trying to keep him locked up because I realized what was living behind that boy's eyes was purely and simply... evil


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:20 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:36 am
Posts: 3083
Killuas wrote:
I could see so many issues with this, a cop struggling with a suspect asks for help and the person helping kills the suspect either on purpose or accidentally who is liable?

Everyone gets sued:
Three strangers from South Jersey became good Samaritans for a few frantic minutes outside a Wawa last year when they helped a police officer subdue a man in the parking lot. That man, Keith Briscoe, apparently had done nothing wrong, though, and died beneath a pile of civilians and police officers. Now, the Winslow Township officer who initiated the arrest is no longer on the force, and he, those "good Samaritans" and four current officers are defendants in a $25 million civil lawsuit filed on behalf of Briscoe's family.

In this case, apparently, the cop didn't ask for help, so that may impact the final result, but still, the basic principle holds - everyone gets sued.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:27 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 6:49 pm
Posts: 330
RangerDave wrote:
Killuas wrote:
I could see so many issues with this, a cop struggling with a suspect asks for help and the person helping kills the suspect either on purpose or accidentally who is liable?

Everyone gets sued:
Three strangers from South Jersey became good Samaritans for a few frantic minutes outside a Wawa last year when they helped a police officer subdue a man in the parking lot. That man, Keith Briscoe, apparently had done nothing wrong, though, and died beneath a pile of civilians and police officers. Now, the Winslow Township officer who initiated the arrest is no longer on the force, and he, those "good Samaritans" and four current officers are defendants in a $25 million civil lawsuit filed on behalf of Briscoe's family.

In this case, apparently, the cop didn't ask for help, so that may impact the final result, but still, the basic principle holds - everyone gets sued.



So now they have to pay a lawyer to defend themselves which could be financially ruinous even if they don't lose, and if they do lose then what?

_________________
I met this six-year-old child, with this blank, pale, emotionless face and, the blackest eyes... the devil's eyes. I spent eight years trying to reach him, and then another seven trying to keep him locked up because I realized what was living behind that boy's eyes was purely and simply... evil


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:31 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:03 am
Posts: 4922
Basically if you're anywhere near a crime scene, you're screwed.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:37 pm 
Offline
Commence Primary Ignition
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am
Posts: 15740
Location: Combat Information Center
Lex Luthor wrote:
Basically if you're anywhere near a crime scene, you're screwed.


Not at all. The statute says unreasonably fails. This is similar to the Ohio law on the subject, just phrased more vaguely. Here is the Ohio law:

ORC 2921.23 wrote:
(A) No person shall negligently fail or refuse to aid a law enforcement officer, when called upon for assistance in preventing or halting the commission of an offense, or in apprehending or detaining an offender, when such aid can be given without a substantial risk of physical harm to the person giving it.

(B) Whoever violates this section is guilty of failure to aid a law enforcement officer, a minor misdemeanor.


In other words, you do not have to assist a law enforcement officer when it puts you at risk of physical harm.

The New York law is less explicit because it replaces the underlined portion with "unreasonably fails or refuses to aid", but it is hardly reasonable to expect a person to put themselves at physical risk to make an arrest; that is the reason we have police in the first place.

In this woman's case, she is a security guard, which would make her refusal mildly more unreasonable, but that probably won't matter since the incident was apparently taking place outside (although very close) the area she was supposed to be guarding, and therefore she really is no different from any other citizen. Had it happened inside her building, it might be unreasonable for her not to assist by virtue of her being a security guard, but that is debatable, and since it wasn't the case, relatively unimportant.

_________________
"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:49 pm 
Offline
Not a F'n Boy Scout
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:10 pm
Posts: 5202
I would just like to point out that any time an armed, and trained police officer requires help to apprehend, subdue, or otherwise detain a suspect; it has trancended the abilities of trained law enforcement and is then by definition a substantial risk to an untrained and unarmed bystander.

_________________
Quote:
19 Yet she became more and more promiscuous as she recalled the days of her youth, when she was a prostitute in Egypt. 20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

Ezekiel 23:19-20 


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:52 pm 
Offline
Commence Primary Ignition
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am
Posts: 15740
Location: Combat Information Center
Rynar wrote:
I would just like to point out that any time an armed, and trained police officer requires help to apprehend, subdue, or otherwise detain a suspect; it has trancended the abilities of trained law enforcement and is then by definition a substantial risk to an untrained and unarmed bystander.


That is not necessarily true. This can also refer to help that has nothing to do with physically confronting the subject. For example, if you own a large building and a suspect flees into it, the cops might need your help in identifying who the actual workers there are, where the exists are, what the floor plan is, etc.

You are correct if you're referring to the actual physical confrontation portion of it.

_________________
"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:55 pm 
Offline
Not a F'n Boy Scout
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:10 pm
Posts: 5202
Diamondeye wrote:
Rynar wrote:
I would just like to point out that any time an armed, and trained police officer requires help to apprehend, subdue, or otherwise detain a suspect; it has trancended the abilities of trained law enforcement and is then by definition a substantial risk to an untrained and unarmed bystander.


That is not necessarily true. This can also refer to help that has nothing to do with physically confronting the subject. For example, if you own a large building and a suspect flees into it, the cops might need your help in identifying who the actual workers there are, where the exists are, what the floor plan is, etc.

You are correct if you're referring to the actual physical confrontation portion of it.


I'm speaking as it applies to this particular instance, in which the confrontation was physical.

_________________
Quote:
19 Yet she became more and more promiscuous as she recalled the days of her youth, when she was a prostitute in Egypt. 20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

Ezekiel 23:19-20 


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:42 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:08 am
Posts: 6465
Location: The Lab
Something tells me that if she had helped, we'd be seeing headlines along the lines of...

"300lb security guard detains supsect who escaped NYC Police... charged with assault..."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:47 pm 
Offline
Commence Primary Ignition
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am
Posts: 15740
Location: Combat Information Center
Rynar wrote:
Diamondeye wrote:
Rynar wrote:
I would just like to point out that any time an armed, and trained police officer requires help to apprehend, subdue, or otherwise detain a suspect; it has trancended the abilities of trained law enforcement and is then by definition a substantial risk to an untrained and unarmed bystander.


That is not necessarily true. This can also refer to help that has nothing to do with physically confronting the subject. For example, if you own a large building and a suspect flees into it, the cops might need your help in identifying who the actual workers there are, where the exists are, what the floor plan is, etc.

You are correct if you're referring to the actual physical confrontation portion of it.


I'm speaking as it applies to this particular instance, in which the confrontation was physical.


Fair enough.

_________________
"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:38 pm 
Offline
pbp Hack
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 8:45 pm
Posts: 7585
She'll have her day in court. I hope it goes well for her. I think she can likely prove that she was not asked for help or that it was unreasonable for her to help.

_________________
I prefer to think of them as "Fighting evil in another dimension"


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:55 pm 
Offline
Bull Moose
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 7:36 pm
Posts: 7507
Location: Last Western Stop of the Pony Express
Was she ever ordered to help the officer? From the reading it seems like he got upset that she didn't but it never says he asked or commanded her to help.

Police brutality aside it does not seem like it will hold up in court - from that report.

As far as her injuries go, she may have an early well paid retirement from this. From the report the cops were definitely out of line.

_________________
The U. S. Constitution doesn't guarantee happiness, only the pursuit of it. You have to catch up with it yourself. B. Franklin

"A mind needs books like a sword needs a whetstone." -- Tyrion Lannister, A Game of Thrones


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:19 pm 
Offline
Commence Primary Ignition
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am
Posts: 15740
Location: Combat Information Center
I'm completely buying her story that she didn't help and then was arrested (regardless of if she was asked or not).

I'm really not buying her claims of abuse. I thin she got arrested, fell getting into the police vehicle because she's fat, and figured "hey, I'm embellish the story with all sorts of claims of abuse so I can get some money out of this as well as getting off on the charges."

Don't get me wrong, I think the charge and arrest were unjustified, but all the "icing ont he cake" just reeks to me of trying to get a big settlement out of it.

_________________
"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 4:14 am 
Offline
Peanut Gallery
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 9:40 pm
Posts: 2289
Location: Bat Country
What a bunch of assholes. Is it also considered professional to call people names? DE (or is it just Monde?) has a point about the embellishment though.

_________________
"...the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?" -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:36 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:22 pm
Posts: 5716
Diamondeye wrote:
I'm completely buying her story that she didn't help and then was arrested (regardless of if she was asked or not).

I'm really not buying her claims of abuse. I thin she got arrested, fell getting into the police vehicle because she's fat, and figured "hey, I'm embellish the story with all sorts of claims of abuse so I can get some money out of this as well as getting off on the charges."

Don't get me wrong, I think the charge and arrest were unjustified, but all the "icing ont he cake" just reeks to me of trying to get a big settlement out of it.


It may be embellished, but I believe the police have at least some level of responsibility for injuries she sustains while cuffed and in their custody.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:46 am 
Offline
Grrr... Eat your oatmeal!!
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:07 pm
Posts: 5073
Wrong thread

_________________
Darksiege
Traveller, Calé, Whisperer
Lead me not into temptation; for I know a shortcut


Last edited by darksiege on Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:49 am 
Offline
adorabalicious
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:54 am
Posts: 5094
Yup they committed the federal crime of official oppression.

_________________
"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:45 am 
Offline
Has a plan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 2:51 pm
Posts: 1584
Its New York. Not suprising. Go go democratic nanny state stronghold.

_________________
A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. ~ John Stuart Mill


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:46 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:36 am
Posts: 3083
Pretty common in other states too, Hannibal.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:56 am 
Offline
Grrr... Eat your oatmeal!!
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:07 pm
Posts: 5073
because the cops fail... if they are unable to do the job themselves, call in backup, tase the person, **** shoot them even. But if you are requiring civilian help, and not legally protecting them from the consequences of helping... you fail and should not have a badge.

_________________
Darksiege
Traveller, Calé, Whisperer
Lead me not into temptation; for I know a shortcut


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 11:05 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:03 am
Posts: 4922
Spoiler:
Image

Not too relevant.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 46 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 54 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group