The Glade 4.0

That's pretty poor reporting, since it doesn't say which lawsuit was dismissed. There are still several pending, one of which was granted a hearing in January.

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And because he simply dismissed it, we're constantly going to hear the nattering from here to eternity.

*sigh* This is the Right's "Bush stole the election," isn't it?

FarSky:

It's not an issue of Right or Left or a stolen election. The issue was a non-issue until Obama's lawyers said in Court, "No Citizen of the United States has standing to challenge the eligibility of a sitting president." Then it became a major issue. Orly Taitz is a hack and a whack job. Most of the people who are "birthers" are hacks and whack jobs. But the standing issue is something else entirely.

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An excellent summation; one that will sadly be lost on those most needing to understand the issue.

That said, the basic question of whether Obama was born in this country is almost as silly as claiming that Bush somehow engineered the 2000 election to come down to a few counties in Florida and then arranged for those counties to go his way.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

I fully believe that is the crux of the issue for you, and for many who have a deeper understanding of politics. I just don't believe that's the prevailing sentiment behind the vast majority of people pushing the issue.

[Note: I also don't believe it has anything (well, for most) to do with race. I think it's just a matter of "Hey, a loophole! Let's get this guy we don't agree with kicked out of office on a technicality!"]

I obviously disagree with Khross and FarSky. For Khross, I see his lawyers argument as the argument they must make. When you are an attourney, you don't just make the arguments people might want to hear. If standing is in question, according to the law, then you make that argument first. As for Race, I think that has a *great deal* to do with it.

We can't seperate what Khross refers to as the bigger question from the basic question being put forth by those going to court. They are claiming that the President has committed fraud and that he was not born in this country. That basic case is absolutely essential to the overall question. Without it, there is no other question.

The people bringing up these suits, in my opinion, are doing so at least in part because Barak Obama is black. Also, because he is a liberal. Also, because he is a very popular liberal democrat. However, I do not think you can entirely ignore the racial element. The core message is that Obama is "The Other" - that he's from Kenya, that he's not a "Real American" (as Palin said during the campaign).

This racial element, in fact, was prevalent throughout the presidential campaign and even the primary season. They first tried to say he was a muslim, that his wife was a radical black militant, among several other clearly racist stereotypes.

It hasn't stopped since the election. Now they are claiming he's not American at all, that he's from Kenya. The protesters at the tea party events had a ton of signs and slogans that were overtly and not quite so overtly racist.

We need to face facts - racism plays a part in the opposition to this president. No, it does not play a part for everyone who opposes him, nor does it have the same level of contribution across the boards. But it *does* play a part. Hate group involvement is up, racial violence is up, threats against the president have increased, and racial tensions are pretty high right now. I think it's an act of blindness to ignore that.

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It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show

Funny how it doesn't play a part in the support for him either. Or at least, according to some.

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"It's real, grew up in trife life, the times of white lines
The hype vice, murderous nighttimes and knife fights invite crimes" - Nasir Jones

Why does disagreeing with the President and his politics always seem to come back to an issue of race?
I notice this stuff in regular life too...in certain circles you have to be careful who you disagree with because it will be misconstrued as racism. Consequently, in some arenas, you dare not disagree at all for fear of being labeled a rascist by default....just because you have a different opinion than a black person does not make you racist!!!
I deal with this in the South every. single. day. It's incredibly annoying.

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"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth

I'd love to see the statistics that establish any of these various race-related ills are "up".

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

None can be provided because he is making **** up

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Darksiege
Traveller, Calé, Whisperer
Lead me not into temptation; for I know a shortcut

I don't really understand what that has to do with anything being discussed here. Is it racist for white voters to vote for white candidates?

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It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show

Who said that it does?

No one is saying that every disagreement with the president is racism, except fake news outlets and commentators that want to try and avoid responsibility for their *actual* racism. However, there is clearly a racist element in a lot of the criticism of the president, especially the most vitrioloic and intense criticism. I've seen it first hand, I've witnessed it at Tea Party rallies (the last one I meandered through I counted the N word used by angry white people no less than 14 times. The number of overtly and subvertly racist signs was kind of alarming, as well).

The election of a black president has really brought the racists up out of the shadows. That doesn't mean that any criticism is racism. *This* attack - the conspiracy theories that drive the so-called Birther movement, however, are driven at least in part by his race, IMO.



And I encountered actual racism in the south with alarming frequency (and outside the south, for that matter). That hasn't changed since the time I was a kid living in TN with my father. It's still something I encounter in Texas (anti black and anti hispanic being the most common thing to hear).

As for those who believe that hate groups are not on the rise, that radicalism is not increasing, etc, please feel free to go to http://www.splcenter.org/index.jsp and see for yourself.

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It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show

Well, considering you're the one inventing new definitions for racist around here, I think you're the more useful person to answer this question. The rest of our answers could be answered with a dictionary and some common sense. You, on the other hand, I have no idea how you would answer this question.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

Why is this your opinion? What do you see that causes you to derive this conclusion?

How do you tell racist motivations from non-racist motivations?

I'm eager for you to impart upon me the wisdom, so that I, too, can divine the minds of men around me.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

If it's based on the colour of his skin, yes, just as it's racist for black voters to vote for black candidates purely cause he's black.

Racial tension is high simply because you chose to put race into everything. Don't agree with what he's doing? RACIST! Want to see the issue of his birth certificate go to court? RACIST! Criticizing the president in media? RACIST! Seriously that’s skewing your statistics on the issue. >.<

You want to stop the racial tension? then stop labelling him by the title "The first BLACK president". Let him not be judged by the color of his skin but by the content of charecter.

Well said, Lydiaa. Bravo!

Yes, Lydiaa proves it is common sense that prevails on the issue, even for someone who isn't a citizen.

Yet, when that point is made about Othering him (thanks, Khross) by using such a label, people scream and whine about the historic precedent it sets. But this is circular logic, because it's only precedent if you first concede that color is such a significant factor.

You'd know what would be really historic? A president who upheld his Oath to defend The Constitution.

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"It's real, grew up in trife life, the times of white lines
The hype vice, murderous nighttimes and knife fights invite crimes" - Nasir Jones

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine