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 Post subject: Shooting at Ft. Hood
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:54 pm 
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Nobody here has mentioned this yet? I'm shocked.

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blog ... 48666.aspx

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Update 5:30: ABC News has identified the Ft. Hood shooter.



The suspected gunman was identified by ABC News as Major Malik Nadal Hasan.

The shooter was killed and two other suspects, who are also soldiers, have been apprehended, Lt. Gen. Robert W. Cone said.

Update 5:25: President Barack Obama made a statement on the Fort Hood shooting. The transcript:

"My immediate thoughts and prayers are with the wounded and with the families of the fallen and with those who live and serve at Fort Hood. These are men and women who have made the selfless and courageous decision to risk and at times give their lives to protect the rest of us on a daily basis.

It’s difficult enough when we lose these brave Americans in battles overseas. It is horrifying that they should come under fire at an army base on American soil.

I’ve spoken to secretary Gates, the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, Admiral Mike Mullen, and I will continue to receive a constant stream of updates as new information comes in. We are working with the Pentagon, the FBI, the department of homeland security all to ensure that Fort Hood is secure and we will continue to support the community with the full resources of the federal government. In the meantime, I would ask all Americans to keep the men and women of Fort Hood in your thoughts and prayers. We will make sure that we get answers to every single question about this horrible incident and I want all of you to know that as commander
in chief, there’s no greater honour but also no greater responsibility for me than to make sure that the extraordinary men and women in uniform are properly cared for and that their safety and security when they’re at home is provided for.”

Update 5:20: The Reuters story has been updated with the latest news.

Update 5:15: More from General Bob Cone's press conference:

“We’ve had a terrible tragedy here at Fort Hood today. The situation is ongoing although I think we have positive news that we’re very close to a resolution. At approximately 13:30 hours today, a shooter entered what we call a soldier readiness facility where soldiers who are preparing to deploy go for last minute medical checkups and dental treatment, etc. A shooter opened fire and due to the quick response of the police forces was killed.

At this time the numbers that we’re looking at are 12 dead and 31 wounded and they are dispersed among the local hospitals here in the central Texas area. The extent of injuries varies significantly and again, we’re getting great cooperation from the central Texas medical facillities. The shooter was killed. He was a soldier. We since then have apprehended two additional soldiers that are suspects. I would go into the point that there were eyewitness accounts that there may have been more than one shooter. They tracked the suspected individuals to an adjacent facility and they were apprehended. They are soldiers, but again they are suspects at this time and we’re looking into that."


Update 5:05: General Bob Cone, the commanding officer at Ft. Hood calls the shooting a "terrible tragedy. It's stunning."

President Barack Obama made a statement regarding the shooting. "It is horrifying that these men and women should come under fire at an American base on U.S. soil."

Update 4:52 p.m.: According to a U.S. Army statement the death toll at the Fort Hood shooting has risen to 12 dead and 31 wounded.

The gunman was among the dead and according to a press conference the victims were all shot at the soldier readiness facility, a series of buildings used to ready soldiers for deployment.

Eyewitness accounts say there may have been more than one shooter and authorities have apprehended two suspects. The gunman and the two suspects are all soldiers. One of the 12 victims was a Fort Hood police officer.

Update: 4:50 p.m.: Texas senator Kay Bailey Hutchison has issued a statement: "I am shocked and saddened by today's outburst of violence at Fort Hood that has cost seven of our brave service members their lives and has gravely injured others.

"My heart goes out to their loved ones."

Update: 4:40 p.m.: A memo from Scott & White Memorial hospital, one of the hospitals taking wounded:

Scott & White Memorial Hospital is receiving victims from Fort Hood. No specifics are known regarding the incident resulting in the shooting. At this time, the victims coming to Scott & White are suffering from gun shot wounds. We have nothing else to report at this time.

There are also reports that shots have been fired near a residential area for soldiers.

Update 4:25 p.m.: There are reports that the death toll at the Fort Hood shooting may have risen to nine. A general has also reported that the number of wounded may rise to as high as 30 people.

Last year there was another shooting where two soldiers lost their lives.

There was also complaints from wounded soldiers that they were being mistreated. From CNN:

During the visit, Mullen met privately with about 30 wounded troops at Fort Hood, Texas. "The wounded expressed concern that, at Fort Hood, they were stigmatized and treated as lesser Soldiers for being wounded, ill, or injured," the memo said.

Update 4:20 p.m.: You can also follow a Twitter list of local media reporting on the Fort Hood shooting.

Update 4:15 p.m.: The second suspect has reportedly been captured.

---

A shooting has killed at least seven people and wounded at least 20 at Fort Hood, Texas, one of the largest army bases in the United States.

According to reports there are two possibly three suspects involved in the shooting. They are believed to have been wearing army uniforms and one of them may have been carrying a high-powered rifle.

Read the Reuters story

Local news is reporting that one suspect may have been captured. A SWAT team is believed to have one of the shooters holed up and may have exchanged fire with police, wounding a number of officers.

The Austin Statesman is livetweeting developments of the story on @fthoodshooting.

The Statesman is also blogging on the shooting.

NBC affiliate KCEN is broadcasting, watch it here.

The Associated Press is reporting on the events:

Army spokesman Lt. Col. Nathan Banks says the first shooting began at about 1:30 p.m. at a personnel and medical processing office. The facility, called a Soldier Rating and Processing center, handles administrative details for soldiers.

Banks says two shooters were apparently involved. There was no immediate word on who they were, nor on identities of the dead.

Banks says the second incident took place at a theater on the sprawling base.
Another Army official identified that site as the Howze Theater

CNN gives a bit of background on the army base.

Fort Hood is the Army's largest U.S. post, with about 40,000 troops. It is home to the Army's 1st Cavalry Division and elements of the 4th Infantry Division, as well as the 3rd Armored Cavalry Regiment and the 13th Corps Support Command. It is located near Killeen, Texas.

In June, Fort Hood's commander, Lt. Gen. Rick Lynch, told CNN that he was trying to ease the kind of stresses soldiers face. He has pushed for soldiers working a day schedule to return home for dinner by 6 p.m., and required his personal authorization for anyone working weekends. At the time, two soldiers stationed there had committed suicide in 2009 -- a rate well below those of other posts.


Read more: http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blog ... z0W1pHST66
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 Post subject: Re: Shooting at Ft. Hood
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 6:07 pm 
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That's just great. On top of the tragedy of the deaths, the shooter is Maj. Malik Nadal Hasan? Exactly what the Muslim/Arabic community in America needs right now. That's just great.

God bless the families in the days to come.


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 Post subject: Re: Shooting at Ft. Hood
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 6:26 pm 
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Beryllin wrote:
That's just great. On top of the tragedy of the deaths, the shooter is Maj. Malik Nadal Hasan? Exactly what the Muslim/Arabic community in America needs right now. That's just great.

God bless the families in the days to come.


A very beautiful response Bery.


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 Post subject: Re: Shooting at Ft. Hood
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 6:53 pm 
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Slythe wrote:
Beryllin wrote:
That's just great. On top of the tragedy of the deaths, the shooter is Maj. Malik Nadal Hasan? Exactly what the Muslim/Arabic community in America needs right now. That's just great.

God bless the families in the days to come.


A very beautiful response Bery.


Not really. Nothing beautiful in this at all, but it seems to me that the last thing we need in this kind of tragic situation is even a hint of connection to the Muslim/Arabic community. The situation is bad enough as it is; too many folks and groups of folks need our prayers now.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 7:08 pm 
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Very tragic event. I wish there was more that could be done except clean up the aftermath.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 7:41 pm 
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I just listened to an interview with an Army Lt. Col ( Doctor stationed with him in DC) who said that the guy had made verbal statements, basically to the effect that 'Muslims should rise up an fight the agressors'.

This interview was followed up by an Interview with his cousin who made the obligatory statement "We are in shock, we can't believe he would do something like this. He is such a non-violent person.. etc..."

This is a horrible tragedy, made worse by the fact that he specifically targetted troops who were either being processed back stateside from overseas deployments, or who were processing out for deploymentes over seas.

He killed 11 people, and wounded 30+ using 2 handguns. How many reloads does that take? ( <--rhetorical )


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:15 pm 
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Midgen wrote:
He killed 11 people, and wounded 30+ using 2 handguns. How many reloads does that take? ( <--rhetorical )


Depends on the weapon. If he was using a service issue Beretta 92fs, I *think* they have 18 round mags.

That's 36. If he's a good shot...

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:02 pm 
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Major Hasan is still alive. Maybe we will find out why the man went beserk.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:10 pm 
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Müs wrote:
Midgen wrote:
He killed 11 people, and wounded 30+ using 2 handguns. How many reloads does that take? ( <--rhetorical )


Depends on the weapon. If he was using a service issue Beretta 92fs, I *think* they have 18 round mags.

That's 36. If he's a good shot...


15 in a clip. When I went on the road I carried two with a total of 30 rounds. I lost contact with all my MP buddies down there.

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:32 pm 
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Micheal wrote:
Major Hasan is still alive. Maybe we will find out why the man went beserk.


Let's hope so. Reports so far do not sound good; if they are accurate it's another black eye for Islam. And that's too bad. In the minds of some, it'll be another validation of ill-will toward Muslims as a group, when instead the focus should be on the perp, alone.

We can hope.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:37 pm 
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I find it interesting that the shooter is a mental health professional, a psychologist or more possibly a psychiatrist.

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting at Ft. Hood
PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 4:26 am 
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I'd be interested in knowing what generation immigrant he is. If he himself moved here from an Arab nation or is a second generation immigrant, it reflects a lot worse on Arab culture than it does on Islam.


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 Post subject: Re: Shooting at Ft. Hood
PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 7:07 am 
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According to what was said on the news last night, he either moved here from Jordan himself, or his parents did before he was orn. I wasn't totally clear on which they meant.

In any case, this is one clearly disturbed individual. He doesn't reflect on Islam or Arabs at all. It does, however, bring up the question of why we're allowing people to be comissioned as officers (even in limited-duty positions such as doctors) who don't understand that by accepting a comission, their loyalties are to this country, not to their ethnic or religious background.

The actual reason is complex, but essentially comes down to manpower. Even then, however, the Army has a long and complex process for dealing with people who are problem soldiers, and the higher in rank you are the longer and more complex the process. It's designed that way to prevent railroading otherwise good soldiers over minor issues or because of personality conflicts, but it also often means the Army is saddled with a prolem soldier for a very long time.

As to the muslim/arabic communities.. how it impacts them is a pretty peripheral issue.

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting at Ft. Hood
PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 9:32 am 
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More information

Note the last line. Not only do shootings seem to be following me around (I was stationed at Fort Hood at went to Virginia Tech) but also this guy went to VT... and graduated the same year I did. The article claims he was in ROTC there, but I do not remember him. He would have had to be in the Corps of Cadets to be in ROTC, and he would have been in ROTC with me... but I have never seen or heard of this guy before in my life. I don't think they have all the facts strsight yet.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 9:37 am 
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Does VT have more than one RoTC? I could be mistaken, but I remember Clemson having both Army ROTC and an Air Force ROTC. At least, one of my friends roommates was in the Air Force ROTC, another friend of mine (female) was in the AAS, and its the Army ROTC that does the pushups at the games.


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 Post subject: Re: Shooting at Ft. Hood
PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 9:49 am 
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Ruidi status check.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:39 am 
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Ladas wrote:
Does VT have more than one RoTC? I could be mistaken, but I remember Clemson having both Army ROTC and an Air Force ROTC. At least, one of my friends roommates was in the Air Force ROTC, another friend of mine (female) was in the AAS, and its the Army ROTC that does the pushups at the games.


VT has all three ROTCs and has since the 80s. (Marines are part of Navy ROTC; hence 3). I still most likely would have known who the guy was if he were in ROTC through the Corps of Cadets since cadets are organized into companies within the Corps without regard to ROTC affiliation. (in fact, you don't even have to be in ROTC to be in the Corps although you have to be in the Corps to be in ROTC).

It's possible that he was a "town cadet" who was in the Corps but didn't live in the Barracks, but those were very rare and were always grad students. He apparently was an undergrad. I should have at least heard his name before.

The article seems to have been updated since I first read it:

Quote:
He served eight years as an enlisted soldier. Military records show he also served in the ROTC as an undergraduate at Virginia Tech in Blacksburg and received a bachelor's degree in biochemistry there in 1997.

But college officials said Friday that Hasan graduated with honors in biochemistry in 1995 and there was no record of him serving in any ROTC program.


There may be a screwup in military records. If VTs records are correct, he graduated 2 to 2 1/2 years before me, and wasn't in ROTC. This wouldn't be the first time military records have been assed up; I've had to make corrections to mine before. I was listed as working as a "kelp and seaweed gatherer" or something like that at one point, which was great for the lulz.

more information

Apparently he cleaned out his apartment before the shooting occured.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 2:38 pm 
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WTF Fox?

Quote:
Ft. Hood: The Largest 'Terror Act' Since 9/11?

The main question we should be asking is when did Maj. Malik Nadal Hasan become radicalized and who indoctrinated him? Everything else will fall in place once we have these answers.

more at link...


Nice opinion piece to put on the front page. :roll:

Attachment:
Picture 2.png
Picture 2.png [ 127.42 KiB | Viewed 4495 times ]


When did we concretely extrapolate one whack-job's actions to being.../checks article..."part of a wider ideological war, generated by radicalization and inciting individuals to perform such acts"? Last I heard we were still operating on the assumption that it was a guy who went crazy and started killing people.

Grrr at people using tragedies to stoke the fires of their own agendas.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 2:43 pm 
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I think the headline and some of the conclusions drawn in the article are stupid.

However, to be fair, evidence like this is emerging about Hasan:
Fox article wrote:
[...]the suspect made several statements indicating his ideological beliefs such as: “The killing of the soldier in Arkansas and any attack against the U.S. military inside the homeland is legitimate because of American military involvement in the Middle East.” Terry detailed remarks made by the accused killer “against U.S. policy and in support of potential suicide attacks inside the country.” Of course, these statements and those reported by others need to be analyzed and verified.



I heard unconfirmed items yesterday indicating Hasan had "celebrated" the killing of people at that Army recruitment center not too long ago as well.


Therefore, it isn't out of the realm of possibility that this was a "terrorist act." That being said, and I'll underline for emphasis here, jumping to that conclusion is illogical and dangerous.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 2:49 pm 
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That's my point as well. If the Ft. Hood shooting is indeed ideologically based, then that's a fact, and should be reported (reported, not trumpeted). It also colors the way the cleanup and any subsequent actions or psychological screenings need to be handled. But until it's confirmed that it had a religious/terrorist/jihadist Muslim motivation, news outlets offering legitimacy to articles like this by giving them a prominent voice is both dangerous and in exceptionally poor taste.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 3:02 pm 
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FarSky wrote:
That's my point as well. If the Ft. Hood shooting is indeed ideologically based, then that's a fact, and should be reported (reported, not trumpeted). It also colors the way the cleanup and any subsequent actions or psychological screenings need to be handled. But until it's confirmed that it had a religious/terrorist/jihadist Muslim motivation, news outlets offering legitimacy to articles like this by giving them a prominent voice is both dangerous and in exceptionally poor taste.


Gonna agree with this, it's kinda been my point all along.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 3:21 pm 
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http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/11/06/fort.hood.munley/index.html

Interesting story. This is the second time that a mass murderer was killed by a woman. There was that shooter at a church that was killed by a female security officer.


Last edited by Aegnor on Fri Nov 06, 2009 4:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 4:20 pm 
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Just a horrible tragedy. The guy apparently got moved from Walter Reid because he was underperforming and showing some signs of wigging out. Sigh.

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 Post subject: Re: Shooting at Ft. Hood
PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 5:14 pm 
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Unfortunately, as we dig deeper in this story I think we'll find that this is exactly what we thought it was...


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 5:29 pm 
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Slythe - The first reports stated there were multiple gunmen, and I was worried it might have been another organized terrorist attack and they were going for a specific target. As it unfolds it looks like it was an attempt at suicide by cop and take some of the nonbelievers down with me by a whacked out fool.

People are still dead, but not in the numbers they could be. I'm happy his try for the 70 virgins failed. Life in the mental wing in Leavenworth would be appropriate.

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