The Glade 4.0
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Political Leanings of the Glade (split)
https://gladerebooted.net/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=7766		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  TheRiov [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 10:52 am ]
Post subject:  Political Leanings of the Glade (split)
So anyone with a |score| < 5 is sane and rational on that axis, and the rest are fanatics?
Author:  Lex Luthor [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 10:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re:
TheRiov wrote:
So anyone with a |score| < 5 is sane and rational on that axis, and the rest are fanatics?


Maybe anyone with a centrist score has been brainwashed by contemporary societal values.
Author:  TheRiov [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 1:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
I could have sworn a large number of people screamed foul when I claimed the board leaned to the right. (particularly several people who insisted they were centrist who are coming out in the extreme right.)

Its more pronounced when you weigh number of posts in hellfire against people's political leaning.
Author:  Lex Luthor [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 1:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
From your post 9 months ago:

TheRiov wrote:
The Hellfire portion of this board is HEAVILY slanted to the right.


I don't think it is 'HEAVILY'.
Author:  TheRiov [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 1:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Political Leanings of the Glade (split)
Code:
Left/Rig   Number of Posts      Posts in Hellfire        Poster        Total Posts Weighted     Hellfire Weighted
 -5.12           3444                  558               Farsky              -17633.28              -2856.96
   8             3193                  2148             Elmarnieh              25544                  17184
   1             5158                  1653              Hopwin                5158                   1653
 -0.88           5258                  1739               Talya              -4627.04               -1530.32
  3.25           2945                  1490              Taskiss              9571.25                4842.5
  -1.5           4106                  1763            Lex Luthor              -6159                 -2644.5
   1             564                    46               Oonagh                 564                    46
  0.75           1973                  296               Mookhow              1479.75                  222
  2.75           1631                  147                Foamy               4485.25                404.25
  6.88           3865                  1904               Rynar               26591.2               13099.52
  4.38           7369                  4249            Diamondeye            32276.22               18610.62
  0.62           505                    42              Vladimirr              313.1                  26.04
  6.38           3902                  1863            Vindicarre            24894.76               11885.94
   8             5223                  2811              Khross                41784                  22488
   10            3013                  177               Raltar                30130                  1770
  3.12           1816                  689               Lydiaa               5665.92                2149.68
  5.25           328                    27               Ulfynn                1722                  141.75
  0.5            4319                  1167             Darkseige             2159.5                  583.5
 -4.12           5892                  1121              Michael             -24275.04              -4618.52
  -5.5           3130                  1890               Aizle               -17215                 -10395
  1.12           1577                  141                Jasmy               1766.24                157.92
  3.5            1464                   25              Nevandal               5124                   87.5
 -5.88           500                    15              Sassandra              -2940                  -88.2
  2.62           4312                  1159             Rorinthas            11297.44                3036.58
   -8            2953                  865               TheRiov              -23624                  -6920
  4.62           5179                  1367           Kaffis Mark V          23926.98                6315.54
   3             3138                  2192          Arathain Kelvar           9414                   6576
1.694074     3213.222222           1168.296296                              6199.787037            3045.438519








                                                                          Average weight      Average Hellfire Weight
                                                                            1.929461023            2.60673472
Author:  Lex Luthor [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
Are you factoring in the post length in word count that people make? Some may make many short posts, while other people may make fewer but well thought out ones.

Second, 2.6 as the average Hellfire weight isn't 'HEAVILY' like you originally claimed and were criticized for. Remember the scale goes up to 10.
Author:  TheRiov [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:02 pm ]
Post subject: 
That's still pretty far to the right leaning. And no, I didn't factor in post length.
Author:  Arathain Kelvar [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:03 pm ]
Post subject: 
TR - it just feels that way because everyone is to the right of you by far.

But yes, it definitely leans right.
Author:  TheRiov [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
TR - it just feels that way because everyone is to the right of you by far.

Except apparently Sean. ;-)

but 99 posts doesn't tip this that far against the people that have 2000+ posts in hellfire
Author:  Lex Luthor [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:07 pm ]
Post subject: 
Diamondeye has a barely higher Hellfire score than Elmarnieh, but I'm sure his word count is well over 10 times higher.
Author:  Kaffis Mark V [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:
TheRiov wrote:
That's still pretty far to the right leaning. And no, I didn't factor in post length.

It's the middle third. So it's pretty reasonable to call it the right end of centrist.
Author:  shuyung [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
So far. The graph and subsequent table are incomplete for participants.
Author:  Khross [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Political Compass positions: That time of year
Of course, the table is amusingly irrelevant to the discussion at hand; post count has nothing to do with political leaning or ideology.
Author:  TheRiov [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Political Compass positions: That time of year
Khross wrote:
Of course, the table is amusingly irrelevant to the discussion at hand; post count has nothing to do with political leaning or ideology.

:roll: Yes. The volume of posts from one side or the other has nothing to do with the overall tenor of the board.
Author:  shuyung [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:01 pm ]
Post subject: 
Code:
 1     Diamondeye     Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:59 am     7369    Commence Primary Ignition
 2     Müs     Thu Sep 03, 2009 6:15 pm     6907    I got nothin.
 3     Micheal     Wed Sep 02, 2009 6:36 pm     5892    Bull Moose
 4     LadyKate     Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:51 am     5693    Home of the Whopper   
 5     Talya     Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:11 am     5258    Oberon's Playground
 6     Khross     Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:07 am     5224    Evil Bastard™
 7     Kaffis Mark V     Wed Sep 02, 2009 6:59 pm     5182
 8     Hopwin     Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:21 pm     5158    The Dancing Cat

Here's the users with >5000 post counts. Go ahead and refactor.
Author:  Khross [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Political Compass positions: That time of year
TheRiov wrote:
Khross wrote:
Of course, the table is amusingly irrelevant to the discussion at hand; post count has nothing to do with political leaning or ideology.
:roll: Yes. The volume of posts from one side or the other has nothing to do with the overall tenor of the board.
Post volume has nothing to do with "tenor" or "tone" or any other subjective valuation of political leanings. Inasmuch one can aggregate a normative political baseline from the content of this forum, all volume indicates is a propensity to speak. As points of contention are actually rarely political, especially in my case, it seems to me that without some sort of content metric and standardization, you're simply producing numbers to substantiate your own confirmation bias. You think the board leans right because you lean left in some primarily fictive 2 dimensional comparison of personal and economic liberties. Things aren't that simple; this place itself is not that simple. Most importantly, however, the topics of discussion aren't homogeneous at any useful level of abstraction.

So, yes, the table is indeed irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
Author:  TheRiov [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
I agree the data is not a perfect sampling. No one is claiming that, but this does support the original assertion quite strongly. Stop trying to wriggle out of things when the data pins you to the wall.
Author:  Khross [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Political Leanings of the Glade (split)
TheRiov wrote:
I agree the data is not a perfect sampling. No one is claiming that, but this does support the original assertion quite strongly. Stop trying to wriggle out of things when the data pins you to the wall.
Mods, please move this thread to Hellfire or split the Table Discussion there. I'm good with that, too.
Author:  Mookhow [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:36 pm ]
Post subject: 
Okay now everyone can yell and scream and act like asshats.
Author:  Vladimirr [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Political Leanings of the Glade (split)
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR
RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH
HHHHHHHHHHHHH
:o :shock: :evil: :derp:

I feel better already.
Author:  Khross [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re:
TheRiov wrote:
I agree the data is not a perfect sampling.
No one said anything about a "perfect sampling"; Shuyung and I have observed that the data presented is woefully incomplete and that the conclusions are fallacious both logically and procedurally when compared with your initial assertion. You see, post count means nothing and provides no useful benefit when multiplied by the results of the Political Compass questionnaire. More important, because the questions in the questionnaire produce a 2 dimensional result and you lack access to the questionnaire's processes, you don't know what content a given poster produces actually aligns methodologically, ideologically, or ontologically with the results. As such, you honestly have done nothing more than produce numbers which demonstrate your own confirmation bias about your own assertion.
TheRiov wrote:
No one is claiming that, but this does support the original assertion quite strongly. Stop trying to wriggle out of things when the data pins you to the wall.
Nothing you've presented supports the original assertion. Not all Hellfire topics are political. Not all non-Hellfire topics are a-political. So, please do explain to me how you're going to normalize variant content and points of contention/response across multiple subjects based on multiplying my post count by my economic freedom score on that questionnaire? I mean that's what you did, so why is it valid? How do you defend your assumption that 100% of my Hellfire posts are political? You have the entire sample, so you must have done some sort of rigorous analysis and data mining of the actual content right? It couldn't be that you started with a assumption, achieved a result you found amenable to your assertion, and ran with it? Because, honestly, that seems to be what you have done here.

In fact, this thread is being split into Hellfire at my request, so as to keep the debate itself out of general; however, the debate is entirely a-political. My responses have nothing to do with me being a "conservative" or "leaning right"; my responses are entirely about challenging the thought process that produced such a flaw analysis and unsubstantiated conclusions.

So, how does your "data" account for the fact that the majority of these posts are a-political?
Author:  Vladimirr [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:47 pm ]
Post subject: 
I'm gonna have to agree. I don't know how I ended up on that list, but the majority of my posts in Hellfire are distinctly a-political, and primarily consist of the aforementioned acting like an asshat.

Post count ratio in Hellfire might at best tell you which people enjoy controversial subjects.
Author:  Wwen [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:53 pm ]
Post subject: 
I cannot roll my eyes in my head hard enough at where this thread is going, but yes The Glade does lean more or less together.
Author:  TheRiov [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:56 pm ]
Post subject: 
The initial assertion was that the general tenor of the posts on the glade leans to the political right.

Of course the data is incomplete. No one has the time to mine every post, analyze the political leanings of each post, from some kind of objective rating on each possible axis, and then create an objective table. You might be able to do it with an actual scientific study, research funds, etc. but nothing short of that would provide the level of data accuracy you're asking for. In short, you're creating an unreasonable standard and waving it around claiming because my quick-and-dirty numbers (which I admit they are) aren't enough to back up my contention (that the board's general posts lean to the right)

I'm also making no assumptions that 100% of anyone's posts are political. Certainly 100% of my posts in hellfire are not. But short of a more detailed analysis which no one will perform, this is as good an approximation as we're going to get.

So unless you can provide better numbers, using the methods you describe, we'll go with my analysis. You can whine about why my numbers are not 100% accurate (and again, something I freely admit) but they're a reasonable approximation given the data we have, and our analysis capabilities.
Author:  Rynar [ Tue Nov 29, 2011 5:03 pm ]
Post subject: 
So, you've admitted to having a flawed and incomplete study, but insist that we have to both use it and assume it's general accuracy because no one has done (or will do, in your opinion) a study that is complete and accurate?

That's **** absurd.
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