The Glade 4.0

Guess I'm consolidating the topics on the speech a bit, but here are two links:

Transcipt of Obama's speech. Its on Foxnews, but after looking at several website, I thought the way they formatted the transcript was the most readable, and accurate in terms of delivery (where applause occured, etc).

Transcript of the GOP Rebuttal. Again, from Foxnews, but oddly enough, sites like CNN didn't have it, or it wasn't easily found.

I was terribly pleased that he called out the liars for what they are. I was not entirely pleased that he make the public option non negotiable. I get why, I just don't like it. I'm personally in favor of doing away with private health insurance, since I don't feel they do any good for health care and only drive up costs, and simply expanding medicare.

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It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show

I, for one, don't want Medicare.

I'll be paying the same, or more for worse service. THis is not acceptable to me, I don't care how many more people will be insured by the program, I'm not them.

I absolutely DO NOT want my level of service to decline to the farce that medicare is because some people aren't insured.

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Holy shitsnacks!

Doctors and patients will be forced to arrive at a mutually agreeable price via trade independent of the existing monetary system. Yes a black market for healthcare.

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"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville

Do you honestly think that would be the result of the policy proposed last night?

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It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show

Do you honestly think your current overlords will submit themselves to the same level of care you'll be getting?

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The Dude abides.

Do you honestly think that's a rational question?

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It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show

Do you guys always answer a question with a question?

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"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth

It is a rational question. There has been extensive debate in the Senate over precisely that issue.

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Stop using words you don't understand.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Indeed I do. The fact that they don't intend to should frighten you all the more. It would seem the ruling elite are more equal than the rest of us.

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The Dude abides.

As to my reply,

Yes. 100%.

If the Overlords are going to exempt themselves from the plebian portion of the insurance... I want what they're using. Failing that, I want what I have now.

There are no fathomable improvements to our current system that the government can make. If they start sticking their fat fingers into the pie, its *going* to get worse.

Instead of good care for some, mediocre care for others, and none for a few... its going to be shitty care for all.

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Holy shitsnacks!

Liberals always seek the equality of the grave for us all.

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"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville

That's exactly what the libs and "progressives" want.

The libs want it because government mandated distribution of goods and services is their goal in all things.
The "progressives" want it because it will allow more power to accumulate in the hands of those "who know what's best" for us.

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"Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko

Yes its the evil leading the naive like the march of tyranny has almost always been since we decided this veneer of civility suits us.

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"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville

Expand this to 350 million, throw in the 15 million illegals or so...

You really think that standard of care is going to get *better*?

Who's going to pay for it? People like me that already have insurance. Sure, I won't have to pay insurance premiums, but the amount in insurance premiums that I won't be paying will be eclipsed by what I'll have to pay in taxes.

And I'll have less access to health care than I currently have.

Tell me how this will be better for *me*. Tell me why I should get behind this process.

Remember two things about me. I'm racist, and I don't give a **** about people.

Now. Sell me public health care. Begin.

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Holy shitsnacks!

Hi! I'm here from the Government, nice to meet you!

/points gun at you.

We are going to be either accepting your payment, or putting you in prison. If you resist you might get shot. Will that be check, cash, money order or credit card?

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A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. ~ John Stuart Mill

Well, since you put it that way...

/moves to Australia.

WHAT NOW *****?

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Holy shitsnacks!

Now you have a different government pointing guns at you and have no option to point them back.

Grats?

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"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville

Yeah that was like getting away from a pawn by jumping in front of a rook.

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A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. ~ John Stuart Mill

The fact that you cannot escape the BS governments is what I would call proof that the world needs to be purged in fire.

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Darksiege
Traveller, Calé, Whisperer
Lead me not into temptation; for I know a shortcut

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"It is true that democracy undermines freedom when voters believe they can live off of others' productivity, when they modify the commandment: 'Thou shalt not steal, except by majority vote.' The politics of plunder is no doubt destructive of both morality and the division of labor."

Hey!

That's my favorite source... Give it back!

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

ZOMG LIBERALS WANNA KILL US ALL AND YER BABIES AND JESUS!!!!ONEONEONE!!!!

Yeah. I'm the bigot around here. I'm the irrational one that poisons the well. You and Diamondeye *both* just came out with attacks that were entirely unprovoked. As for poisoning the well, who is calling these people Overlords?

Seriously guys, mind your own store before you come out swinging at mine.

To answer the meat of the inflammatory question - members of congress should have the same choices we all have. If there's an exchange, as the President described, that included a public option, they should be just as free to use whatever they like. That's the point of this plan - choice and competition.

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It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show

The big issue with healthcare in the US is coverage. If you have it you like it, very much. If you dont, or you lose it well.. yeah, that's a problem. So the question is, how do you make sure everyone is covered or at least, everyone who wants to be.

For people who dont have it, or are afraid they'll lose it, socialized healthcare is obviously an appealing alternative to the status quo. Problem there is, the quality will go in the tank, availability will be seriously downgraded, it will be obscenely expensive and drive the national debt to ludicrous speed. This is why it's so unpopular.

The Obama administration and many proponents of a public option has been very misleading on this issue. "It will be deficit neutral" (no it wont), "you can keep your current plan if you like it" (no you cant, not for long anyway), "46 million uninsured" (that includes people who dont want it, are here illegally, are eligible for government programs but havent signed up among others).

The problem on the other side is, they appear to be pushing for status quo, which people also dont like. There is no coherent counter proposal to the "public option". I know the Republicans have a host of bills they presented, but there is no public knowledge of what it is they are proposing and certainly no widely known specifics. So right now it seems like stick with the flawed system you know or move to a system flawed in a different way that you dont know.

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“Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general”. - Mark Rippetoe