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PostPosted: Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:15 pm 
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I'm with Xeq on this one. There's no reason you can't get by AND plan for the future on 40-50 hours a week. Maybe it'll take some extra work upfront to get that type of job, but those jobs are out there.

There's zero chance I will ever work over 55 hours a week for any extended period of time. Due to my quality planning, I won't need overtime to save money. I'm happy I learned from an early time in life that there's a hell of a lot more to life than working and making money. I learned to have a strong work ethic, but that alone doesn't mean I'm going to use that work ethic 55+ hours a week just because it's there. It's no wonder America is no where near the happiest country in the world. If you look at the lists, the happiest countries are the ones that have less time at work. Perhaps it has to do with the fact that there are things such as family that mean more than work. Yes, it's great to be able to support them financially, but there are other aspects to family than just paying for their existence.

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 Post subject: Re: Need a vaca & bj
PostPosted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 12:17 am 
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Diamondeye wrote:
Not even close, unless you're going to count pay by all 24 hours in a day for the entire deployment, which is silly because A) you're not working all 24 hours and B) who cares? Minimum hourly wage sucks in the U.S. because you're trying to get by on 8 hours a day, 5 days a week of it. The amount I'm making per week still vastly exceeds what a minimum wage person could make in a work week.

In my case, I'm a senior Captain so my pay is pretty high to begin with. There's also hazard pay of various types on top of all this, and no income taxes.

Yes, 12/12 is brutal, but its only for a year, there's nothing else really to do (well there is, but you can only watch so many movies, play so much softball, etc.) and there's not a lot to spend money on. You sleep free, eat free, and if you're not a dumbass spending all your money on snacks, video games, extra gear that isn't issued to you and you don't really need anyhow, or buying a motorcycle or a car you come home with an assload of money in the bank, plus a nice little form you can add to any future job application - especially any government job - saying you're a combat veteran. All this plus whatever nice skills you learned from your MOS.

Really, don't be ridiculous. 12/12 is a reason not to join the military? It's only like that in the field and in combat. Please, don't sign up. We don't need more whiners.


84 hours per week at $7.25 per hour is $31,668 per year. According to this chart, that's about the equivalent of an E-6 with 4 years of service. Now I realize I'm probably not matching rank and years of service well, (I don't really know how many years of service generally corresponds to what rank) but that's not a low rank and with 4 years of experience you get minimum wage for the work you do.

When you say, "no income tax," are you referring to the fact that you don't make enough to pay income tax, or are military members exempt from paying income tax?


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 1:11 am 
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Roophus & X:

There is more to life than working, true, but putting in a few years of 70-80-90 hours a week will definitely put you in a position of being able to do more than "get by", or "get by and plan for the future". I understand the reasons why some people choose not to put in that much time and effort, as I said before: "That's why some people tread water through life and others end up cruising in their own boat."

X:
DE stated that he's a Captain, that's O3 if I recall correctly. IIRC, if you serve in a combat zone, your military pay that month is excluded from gross income.

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 Post subject: Re: Need a vaca & bj
PostPosted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 9:42 am 
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Xequecal wrote:
Diamondeye wrote:
Not even close, unless you're going to count pay by all 24 hours in a day for the entire deployment, which is silly because A) you're not working all 24 hours and B) who cares? Minimum hourly wage sucks in the U.S. because you're trying to get by on 8 hours a day, 5 days a week of it. The amount I'm making per week still vastly exceeds what a minimum wage person could make in a work week.

In my case, I'm a senior Captain so my pay is pretty high to begin with. There's also hazard pay of various types on top of all this, and no income taxes.

Yes, 12/12 is brutal, but its only for a year, there's nothing else really to do (well there is, but you can only watch so many movies, play so much softball, etc.) and there's not a lot to spend money on. You sleep free, eat free, and if you're not a dumbass spending all your money on snacks, video games, extra gear that isn't issued to you and you don't really need anyhow, or buying a motorcycle or a car you come home with an assload of money in the bank, plus a nice little form you can add to any future job application - especially any government job - saying you're a combat veteran. All this plus whatever nice skills you learned from your MOS.

Really, don't be ridiculous. 12/12 is a reason not to join the military? It's only like that in the field and in combat. Please, don't sign up. We don't need more whiners.


84 hours per week at $7.25 per hour is $31,668 per year. According to this chart, that's about the equivalent of an E-6 with 4 years of service. Now I realize I'm probably not matching rank and years of service well, (I don't really know how many years of service generally corresponds to what rank) but that's not a low rank and with 4 years of experience you get minimum wage for the work you do.

When you say, "no income tax," are you referring to the fact that you don't make enough to pay income tax, or are military members exempt from paying income tax?


An E-6 with 4 years of service is a very, very competant E-6; its highly unusual to be any higher than E-5 at 4 years.

Military members are exempt for Federal income tax during any month in which they are in a combat area for any one day. When not in a combat area they are not exempt.

You don't get all this back in a tax refund either; it's in an actual paycheck. IIRC it was a separate check at the end of the month. Don't ask why; the vagaries of DFAS are beyond my comprehension.

In any case, who gives a **** if the hourly wages are the same? You're still not making minimum wage for any practical purpose. It only appears that way if you insist on comparing it hourly. Where can you find a minimum wage job you can make $31,000 a year at?

By the way, that's only basic pay. That doesn't include things like your housing and expense allowances, hazard/combat pay, etc.

And yes, a Captain is an O-3.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:35 am 
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Vindicarre wrote:
Roophus & X:

There is more to life than working, true, but putting in a few years of 70-80-90 hours a week will definitely put you in a position of being able to do more than "get by", or "get by and plan for the future". I understand the reasons why some people choose not to put in that much time and effort, as I said before: "That's why some people tread water through life and others end up cruising in their own boat."

X:
DE stated that he's a Captain, that's O3 if I recall correctly. IIRC, if you serve in a combat zone, your military pay that month is excluded from gross income.

You don't need to put in 70-90 hour weeks for a few years to be cruising on your own boat. That's where I disagree. If you truly understand the importance of planning for your future, you'll never need to allow your life to get that unbearable. Generalizing every single person who works a 40 hour work week as being someone who's constantly "treading water," is simply incorrect. Sure, if you choose to life a lifestyle that's beyond what you should be living, 40 hours isn't going to cut it for your entire life. However, if you're a responsible adult who enjoys saving money, you don't necessarily have to work 70-90 hour weeks.

DE- I tend to equate all work in terms of hours. Since work is not what I do to get enjoyment out of life, every hour worked is one less hour that I'm not spending time with family and/or doing the things I love. It always equates to hours for me. If I had to choose between working 80 hours making $31k in a year,versus working 40 hours to make $24k, I'd much rather work the 40. You're working an extra 40 hours just to make 7k, and that's absolutely idiotic. There's no reason in the world to settle for working 80 hours just to make $31k, if money is your motive.

Motives can be different for different people, though. I'm simply saying I'm one of those different people.

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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 11:35 am 
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Roophus Gunthar wrote:
DE- I tend to equate all work in terms of hours. Since work is not what I do to get enjoyment out of life, every hour worked is one less hour that I'm not spending time with family and/or doing the things I love. It always equates to hours for me. If I had to choose between working 80 hours making $31k in a year,versus working 40 hours to make $24k, I'd much rather work the 40. You're working an extra 40 hours just to make 7k, and that's absolutely idiotic. There's no reason in the world to settle for working 80 hours just to make $31k, if money is your motive.

Motives can be different for different people, though. I'm simply saying I'm one of those different people.


That's all well and good if you want to equate it that way, but claiming that military personnel in general are making minimum wage becasue of that equation is pretty silly, and that's what X is doing.

Not only that, but it certainly doesn't apply to being deployed in a combat area because you're certainly not going to be going home to your family in your off time. People do not join the military int he first place because their only concern in a job is the dollars:hours ratio.

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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 12:06 pm 
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Diamondeye wrote:
Roophus Gunthar wrote:
DE- I tend to equate all work in terms of hours. Since work is not what I do to get enjoyment out of life, every hour worked is one less hour that I'm not spending time with family and/or doing the things I love. It always equates to hours for me. If I had to choose between working 80 hours making $31k in a year,versus working 40 hours to make $24k, I'd much rather work the 40. You're working an extra 40 hours just to make 7k, and that's absolutely idiotic. There's no reason in the world to settle for working 80 hours just to make $31k, if money is your motive.

Motives can be different for different people, though. I'm simply saying I'm one of those different people.


That's all well and good if you want to equate it that way, but claiming that military personnel in general are making minimum wage becasue of that equation is pretty silly, and that's what X is doing.

Not only that, but it certainly doesn't apply to being deployed in a combat area because you're certainly not going to be going home to your family in your off time. People do not join the military int he first place because their only concern in a job is the dollars:hours ratio.

That, I can agree with you on. Joining the military for dollars:hours ratio would be a terrible idea.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 6:10 am 
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I never complained about the money I made in the army. I always had more than enough.

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