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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:21 am 
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This is becoming a huge story and I think it deserves it's own thread. Yes, it's been long suspected that the NSA is collecting data on all Americans, but now we have definitive proof. Hard to ignore the court order, which lays everything out pretty clearly (see the link in the first news story). And it looks like it's more than just phone records too, extending to e-mail and chat logs too. No more bullshit about not targeting domestic communications between Americans who have no links to terrorism.

NSA collecting phone records of millions of Verizon customers daily
The National Security Agency is currently collecting the telephone records of millions of US customers of Verizon, one of America's largest telecoms providers, under a top secret court order issued in April.

The order, a copy of which has been obtained by the Guardian, requires Verizon on an "ongoing, daily basis" to give the NSA information on all telephone calls in its systems, both within the US and between the US and other countries.

The document shows for the first time that under the Obama administration the communication records of millions of US citizens are being collected indiscriminately and in bulk – regardless of whether they are suspected of any wrongdoing.

The secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (Fisa) granted the order to the FBI on April 25, giving the government unlimited authority to obtain the data for a specified three-month period ending on July 19.

Under the terms of the blanket order, the numbers of both parties on a call are handed over, as is location data, call duration, unique identifiers, and the time and duration of all calls. The contents of the conversation itself are not covered.

The disclosure is likely to reignite longstanding debates in the US over the proper extent of the government's domestic spying powers.

Under the Bush administration, officials in security agencies had disclosed to reporters the large-scale collection of call records data by the NSA, but this is the first time significant and top-secret documents have revealed the continuation of the practice on a massive scale under President Obama.

The unlimited nature of the records being handed over to the NSA is extremely unusual. Fisa court orders typically direct the production of records pertaining to a specific named target who is suspected of being an agent of a terrorist group or foreign state, or a finite set of individually named targets.

continued...


U.S., British intelligence mining data from nine U.S. Internet companies in broad secret program
The National Security Agency and the FBI are tapping directly into the central servers of nine leading U.S. Internet companies, extracting audio and video chats, photographs, e-mails, documents, and connection logs that enable analysts to track foreign targets, according to a top-secret document obtained by The Washington Post.

The program, code-named PRISM, has not been made public until now. It may be the first of its kind. The NSA prides itself on stealing secrets and breaking codes, and it is accustomed to corporate partnerships that help it divert data traffic or sidestep barriers. But there has never been a Google or Facebook before, and it is unlikely that there are richer troves of valuable intelligence than the ones in Silicon Valley.

Equally unusual is the way the NSA extracts what it wants, according to the document: “Collection directly from the servers of these U.S. Service Providers: Microsoft, Yahoo, Google, Facebook, PalTalk, AOL, Skype, YouTube, Apple.”

London’s Guardian newspaper reported Friday that GCHQ, Britain’s equivalent of the NSA, also has been secretly gathering intelligence from the same internet companies through an operation set up by the NSA.

According to documents obtained by The Guardian, PRISM would appear to allow GCHQ to circumvent the formal legal process required in Britain to seek personal material such as emails, photos and videos from an internet company based outside of the country.

PRISM was launched from the ashes of President George W. Bush’s secret program of warrantless domestic surveillance in 2007, after news media disclosures, lawsuits and the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court forced the president to look for new authority.

Congress obliged with the Protect America Act in 2007 and the FISA Amendments Act of 2008, which immunized private companies that cooperated voluntarily with U.S. intelligence collection. PRISM recruited its first partner, Microsoft, and began six years of rapidly growing data collection beneath the surface of a roiling national debate on surveillance and privacy. Late last year, when critics in Congress sought changes in the FISA Amendments Act, the only lawmakers who knew about PRISM were bound by oaths of office to hold their tongues.

The court-approved program is focused on foreign communications traffic, which often flows through U.S. servers even when sent from one overseas location to another. Between 2004 and 2007, Bush administration lawyers persuaded federal FISA judges to issue surveillance orders in a fundamentally new form. Until then the government had to show probable cause that a particular “target” and “facility” were both connected to terrorism or espionage.

In four new orders, which remain classified, the court defined massive data sets as “facilities” and agreed to certify periodically that the government had reasonable procedures in place to minimize collection of “U.S. persons” data without a warrant.

continued...


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:28 am 
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I am at once, dumbfounded, and completely unsurprised (if that is possible).


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:42 am 
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You've got to fill the Library of Congress somehow.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 11:43 am 
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I love how the government's response is basically "Yes, we collect data on everyone indiscriminately, but we only look at the data of terrorists." That's comforting.

I also don't understand how all the big technology companies denying giving backdoor access to the NSA is news. They are denying a program that they are legally forbidden from talking about? Very surprising...


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 12:00 pm 
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Amanar wrote:
I love how the government's response is basically "Yes, we collect data on everyone indiscriminately, but we only look at the data of terrorists." That's comforting.

I also don't understand how all the big technology companies denying giving backdoor access to the NSA is news. They are denying a program that they are legally forbidden from talking about? Very surprising...

I don't understand how CNN.Com doesn't have a single story about this on their front page, or about the phone records, or the IRS scandals.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 12:16 pm 
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These corporate denials are accusations of criminal activity by the current Presidential Administration and the NSA. The corporations involved aren't denying that access happened; they're denying that access happened with their consent.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 12:34 pm 
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Hopwin wrote:
I don't understand how CNN.Com doesn't have a single story about this on their front page, or about the phone records, or the IRS scandals.

They do now. Three stories, in fact:

"Obama: No one is listening to your calls. Privacy worries called modest."

"The phone company against snooping."

"Internet laughs about being spied on."

See? Nothing to worry about. There's no major privacy problem, the phone companies have our back anyway, and "the internet" thinks it's a joke.

Nicely done, CNN! :thumbs:


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 12:55 pm 
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At this point, I think it is safe to say that our current President is a self-deluded nitwit who learned governance from Huge Chavez.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:04 pm 
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Hopwin wrote:
You've got to fill theLibrary of Congress Utah Data center somehow.

Fixed that...

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:11 pm 
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Khross wrote:
At this point, I think it is safe to say that our current President is a self-deluded nitwit who learned governance from Huge Chavez.

Quote:
President Obama strolled out to the podium today in San Jose, CA and was immediately at a loss for words. Not only did the President not have teleprompter, his aides forgot his speech.

“My remarks are not sitting here,” the President declared awkwardly. “I’m uhhh….people….oh goodness….uhhhh...folks are sweating back there right now.”

President Obama, who’s often mocked for an over-reliance on scripts, shifted uncomfortably smiling for several moments buying time. An aide sprinted out with a hard copy of the speech, tripping at one point, adding to the drama.


From Fox.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 2:15 pm 
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Hopwin wrote:
Khross wrote:
At this point, I think it is safe to say that our current President is a self-deluded nitwit who learned governance from Huge Chavez.

Quote:
President Obama strolled out to the podium today in San Jose, CA and was immediately at a loss for words. Not only did the President not have teleprompter, his aides forgot his speech.

“My remarks are not sitting here,” the President declared awkwardly. “I’m uhhh….people….oh goodness….uhhhh...folks are sweating back there right now.”

President Obama, who’s often mocked for an over-reliance on scripts, shifted uncomfortably smiling for several moments buying time. An aide sprinted out with a hard copy of the speech, tripping at one point, adding to the drama.


From Fox.



Smartest president evar!!!

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 3:33 pm 
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And like always Fox can't report on Obama without putting a huge amount of spin on things and making the scenario look far worse than it is.

Here's a video clip. Note, that there wasn't even a teleprompter setup. His reaction is what anyone's would be if they were giving a prepared speech.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/20 ... ?hpt=hp_t2


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 3:36 pm 
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Aizle wrote:
And like always Fox can't report on Obama without putting a huge amount of spin on things and making the scenario look far worse than it is.

Here's a video clip. Note, that there wasn't even a teleprompter setup. His reaction is what anyone's would be if they were giving a prepared speech.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/20 ... ?hpt=hp_t2


Yeah, I'm actually with you on this. That wasn't anywhere near as bad as it was made out to be.

I don't have a problem with needing notes or remarks or whatever.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:30 pm 
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Aizle wrote:
And like always Fox can't report on Obama without putting a huge amount of spin on things and making the scenario look far worse than it is.

Here's a video clip. Note, that there wasn't even a teleprompter setup. His reaction is what anyone's would be if they were giving a prepared speech.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/20 ... ?hpt=hp_t2


But we were promised he was an orator and communicator without peer.

Aside from the double standard I get it and I don't care.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 4:37 pm 
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Next week on Hoarders: Buried Alive. Damn man, you got all these boxes and boxes of phone records. What's this? Man, this is a box of tax records from 1973. It looks like its Wilkins-Wilkinson. Why do you even *have* these?
I dunno, I just like to collect them I guess. Thought maybe I'd fix em up or something.
Dude. 1973. They're 40 years old. And what is this? Phone records? My god man, how many of these do you have?
Um... like all of them? I guess?
Oh. Really. And what are you going to do with them?
I dunno, I thought I'd maybe look for terrorists or something?
Look man, you don't *need* these.
NO DON'T TOUCH THOSE! THEY'RE MINE! YOU'RE GOING TO MESS THEM UP!!!


Its a little ridiculous when you think about it. Its like looking for a needle in a haystack, except the needle is also invisible. And made of hay. And there are tens of thousands of haystacks.

I work in telecom for the most part. I sometimes have trouble finding calls when I *know* they're there. And I work for a small provider in Southern California. I would *hate* to see a DB this size. I couldn't imagine the immensity of it.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 5:28 pm 
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They've also got a better search function than you do.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 5:47 pm 
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https://twitter.com/SirPatStew/status/3 ... 92/photo/1

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 6:34 pm 
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It may just be my declining faith in our liege lords' or the aristocracy of this country or whatever, but I am more and more amused that anyone expects this administration to be any better or worse than the one before it, etc. This is the same pile of **** we have had shoved in our faces before, the only difference is that this one came from a minority and not from a "good ol' boy".

And as bad as it is here... I would still rather be here than say... in the Ukraine or in Kazakhstan or just about any African nation. And come on this is great... we are watching an empire crumble here people...

"Eternal Chaos comes with chocolate rain you guys.. Chocolate Rain!!"

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:19 pm 
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Corolinth wrote:
They've also got a better search function than you do.


That's entirely fair.

They also have several orders of magnitude more data to go through.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:46 pm 
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That's why they don't have a person track the data. They have a Cray do it.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 10:19 pm 
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Hadoop, I expect.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 7:11 am 
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I am betting chained 12 PS3s together to sort it.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 10:45 am 
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That's another likely scenario, although I think the number is larger than 12.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 11:29 am 
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Corolinth wrote:
That's another likely scenario, although I think the number is larger than 12.

Meanwhile, Sony HQ:
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How do we sell so many consoles but no games?!

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:03 am 
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utah_Data_Center

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Utah Data Center
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
The Utah Data Center will gather data from intercepted satellite communications and underwater ocean cables. Analysts will decipher, analyse and store the information in order to spot potential national security threats. The facility will be heavily fortified with backup generators and powerful equipment to keep the vast computer network cool.

The Utah Data Center, also known as the Intelligence Community Comprehensive National Cybersecurity Initiative Data Center,[1] is a data storage facility for the United States Intelligence Community that is designed to store data on the scale of yottabytes (1 yottabyte = 1 trillion terabytes, or 1 quadrillion gigabytes).[2][3] Its purpose is to support the Comprehensive National Cybersecurity Initiative (CNCI), though its precise mission is classified.[4] The National Security Agency (NSA), which will lead operations at the facility, is the executive agent for the Director of National Intelligence.[5] It is located at Camp Williams, near Bluffdale, Utah, between Utah Lake and Great Salt Lake.
Contents

1 Purpose
2 Structure
3 See also
4 References
5 External links

Purpose
Utah Data Center, Bluffdale, Utah

The data center is alleged to be able to capture "all forms of communication, including the complete contents of private emails, cell phone calls, and Internet searches, as well as all sorts of personal data trails—parking receipts, travel itineraries, bookstore purchases, and other digital 'pocket litter'."[2] In response to claims that the data center would be used to illegally monitor emails of U.S. citizens, a NSA spokesperson said, "Many unfounded allegations have been made about the planned activities of the Utah Data Center, ... one of the biggest misconceptions about NSA is that we are unlawfully listening in on, or reading emails of, U.S. citizens. This is simply not the case."[5]
Structure

The planned structure is 1 million or 1.5 million square feet[3][6][7] and it is projected to cost from $1.5 billion[8][9][4] to $2 billion when finished in September 2013.[2][3] One report suggested that it will cost another $2 billion for hardware, software, and maintenance.[3] The completed facility is expected to require 65 megawatts, costing about $40 million per year.[2][3]


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