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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:31 am 
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http://www.kpho.com/news/23202195/detail.html

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Ariz House: Check Obama's Citizenship

POSTED: 7:15 pm MST April 19, 2010
UPDATED: 10:23 pm MST April 19, 2010

PHOENIX -- The Arizona House on Monday voted for a provision that would require President Barack Obama to show his birth certificate if he hopes to be on the state's ballot when he runs for reelection.

The House voted 31-22 to add the provision to a separate bill. The measure still faces a formal vote.

It would require U.S. presidential candidates who want to appear on the ballot in Arizona to submit documents proving they meet the constitutional requirements to be president.

Phoenix Democratic Rep. Kyrsten Sinema said the bill is one of several measures that are making Arizona "the laughing stock of the nation."

Mesa Republican Rep. Cecil Ash said he has no reason to doubt Obama's citizenship but supports the measure because it could help end doubt.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:40 am 
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I'm actually excited for this one. It will immediately put this issue to rest in every election thereafter. Hopefully some people will shut up now.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:13 pm 
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Or Obama could just ignore it since he knows he has no chance of winning Arizona anyway.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:39 pm 
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 2:05 pm 
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Obviously, Rorinthas, it is not.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 2:35 pm 
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ROFL!

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 2:57 pm 
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Xequecal wrote:
Or Obama could just ignore it since he knows he has no chance of winning Arizona anyway.

That would actually be pretty funny.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 3:17 pm 
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Actually, it's kind of funny in a lot of ways. The document Obama provided is not accepted for passport requests or college applications. You have to provide long forms with official embossed seals.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 3:17 pm 
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I thought Wayne Gretzky coaching the Phoenix Coyotes made Arizona the laughing stock of the nation... :)


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 6:40 pm 
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I have no idea if he is a legal citizen or not(he likely is), but what would happen if it turned out he wasn't? I mean, would he go to jail? What about all of the legislature he signed and all of that? Would it all become void? I'm really curious as to what would happen if it turned out he wasn't a natural born citizen.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:23 pm 
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I suspect the supreme court would uphold his work to date, based on the fact he was vetted and sworn in. However, I suspect he would be immediately impeached. Charges would follow, depending on the seriousness of the crime. Hell, it could be (obviously extremely unlikely) that he's not a citizen but thinks he is. That shouldn't land him in jail.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:55 am 
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Isn't there equal doubt about McCain being a natural born citizen, because his birth certificate shows he was born in Colon, Panama, not on a U.S. base in Panama?

It's just that no one is going to attack him as a former war hero as a non-natural born citizen.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:42 am 
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Katas wrote:
Isn't there equal doubt about McCain being a natural born citizen, because his birth certificate shows he was born in Colon, Panama, not on a U.S. base in Panama?

It's just that no one is going to attack him as a former war hero as a non-natural born citizen.

He's the son of two American citizens, which grants him citizenship. The problem with Obama is that he's not the son of two American citizens. And while I believe he was born in the Hawaii, I find it quite telling that he won't show a standard long-form birth certificate as well. Like Khross has said, it doesn't have to do with the fact that he's a natural-born citizen, so much as the rule of law. If no one has to prove definitive citizenship, any foreigner can act like a natural-born citizen and then run for president later on.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:01 am 
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Katas:

McCain was sued during his 2000 Presidential bid over the issue and produced a long form U.S. Army hospital birth certificate in Court to solve the matter.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:57 am 
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The only thing this does is give credance to the idea that Obama detractors hate him because if who he is or isn't as opposed to the issues.

Tossing out a seated president on a technicality is only going to result in rioting and chaos. The time for this issue is passed.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 8:01 am 
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Rorinthas wrote:
Tossing out a seated president on a technicality is only going to result in rioting and chaos. The time for this issue is passed.
No, it really has not. President Obama has gone to great lengths to undermine the Constitution on this matter of law. It really doesn't matter to me where he was born; I am concerned about the damage done to the Rule of Law in this nation. But, thanks for demonstrating why a Constitutional Republic failed this nation: you're more concerned about people being pissed off than upholding the binding covenant of law that created this nation.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 8:11 am 
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Khross wrote:
Rorinthas wrote:
Tossing out a seated president on a technicality is only going to result in rioting and chaos. The time for this issue is passed.
No, it really has not. President Obama has gone to great lengths to undermine the Constitution on this matter of law. It really doesn't matter to me where he was born; I am concerned about the damage done to the Rule of Law in this nation. But, thanks for demonstrating why a Constitutional Republic failed this nation: you're more concerned about people being pissed off than upholding the binding covenant of law that created this nation.

Ooo burn!

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 9:13 am 
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Rorinthas wrote:
The only thing this does is give credance to the idea that Obama detractors hate him because if who he is or isn't as opposed to the issues.

Tossing out a seated president on a technicality is only going to result in rioting and chaos. The time for this issue is passed.

A technicality? If he's not a natural-born citizen, he just undermined the US Constitution. If he is, but doesn't have to prove it, what stops anybody who's not a natural-born citizen from running for US President and then claiming no one has standing to question his/her eligbility? Then our system of government is still undermined. And all he'd have to do is show a long-form birth certificate. We have to do this everyday when we apply for official government documents, yet for the highest political office in the US, you don't?


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:20 pm 
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He could be the best president ever, but if he doesn't meet the eligibility requirements, then he shouldn't be in office. The requirements are there for a reason, if they are outdated let's get them changed. But you just can't ignore them because it's convenient. That's like convicting someone without a trial because, well, of course he's guilty.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:24 pm 
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Khross wrote:
Actually, it's kind of funny in a lot of ways. The document Obama provided is not accepted for passport requests or college applications. You have to provide long forms with official embossed seals.


Not true. According to the Hawaii Department of Health, Hawaii no longer has a long-form birth certificate and cannot issue one. The form Obama provided has an "official embossed seal" and contains all the information required by the State Department for passport issuance.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:32 pm 
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Telumhetar:

That statement is an outright lie. Would you like me to scan the one my older brother requested and received less than six months ago? You know, the one he was required to get for his graduate school admissions portfolio?

But ...

http://travel.state.gov/passport/get/fi ... t_830.html

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*A certified birth certificate has a registrar's raised, embossed, impressed or multicolored seal, registrar's signature, and the date the certificate was filed with the registrar's office, which must be within 1 year of your birth. Please note, some short (abstract) versions of birth certificates may not be acceptable for passport purposes.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:40 pm 
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Khross wrote:
Telumhetar:

That statement is an outright lie. Would you like me to scan the one my older brother requested and received less than six months ago? You know, the one he was required to get for his graduate school admissions portfolio?


Hmmm, Hawaii DOH spokesperson vs. some dude on the internet. Yes, please do.



http://travel.state.gov/passport/get/fi ... t_830.html

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*A certified birth certificate has a registrar's raised, embossed, impressed or multicolored seal, registrar's signature, and the date the certificate was filed with the registrar's office, which must be within 1 year of your birth. Please note, some short (abstract) versions of birth certificates may not be acceptable for passport purposes.


Emphasized an important word for you there.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:53 pm 
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Telumhetar:

I wouldn't have quoted it if I had not read it. I just find it rather amusing that my brother possesses and received, less than six months ago, a long form from the State of Hawaii that was stated not to exist. Indeed, the only person I know (or know of) born in Hawaii that doesn't possess and can't produce a long form is the President. Indeed, I honestly think it's an issue of won't more than anything else. And given his legal arguments on the matter, I'm still furious over the whole situation.

Funny how people had standing to challenge John McCain on the issue, and he was required to produce a long form from a military installation on the issue ...

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 1:06 pm 
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Did McCain ever make the motion that the plaintiff didn't have standing? It's one thing if he did and they got two different outcomes, but he probably never did that.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 1:09 pm 
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Xequecal:

He did, in fact.

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