The Glade 4.0

^this

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In time, this too shall pass.

A) Because that money was already taxed when it was earned.
B) That money is being rolled into businesses to buy raw materials, capital and hire workers.

But now that I think about it, screw income taxes in general. Find some way to create a usage tax for every service the government provides.

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This^billion^billion

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

Also, labor isn't wealth.

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Ezekiel 23:19-20 

Isn't there an arguement to be made that if we removed all taxation then salaries/take home income would decrease/and create deflation so that -- net effect being that the real value of people's take home pay would be (while still higher than the 'current' system) lower than your current gross pay.

I think its disingenuous to claim that if all taxation were removed then you would be entitled to your gross pay.

I also think the logical flaw that you're making is that you see your gross salary/payouts as 'yours' to begin with. If you instead think of them in terms of they are offered/payed out and prices set with those taxes in mind.

ie. If I make 100K/year in the current world gross, but only take home 50K due to taxes, if all tax were removed, then companies wouldn't be willing to pay me 100K knowing I could live on 50k. they'd just offer me 50K (or 70K or 90k or whatever to make up for the services I would otherwise have to buy that the gov't provides)

TheRiov:

Do you have any idea what the average salary multiplier for employee cost is?

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1.25 or so, varies depending on the level of benefits being offered as part of the employment as well as location (local taxes, etc).... unless you are including something else. But here, that covers an employee's salary, benefits, federal and state taxes, unemployment, etc.

depends on the industry and what you're factoring in, doesn't it? If we're soley talking about taxes, totally pulling numbers out of my rear, but somewhere in the 150-200% range I'd guess.

add in benifits (many of which are incentivized) I'd say 300-400% total. Whats your point?

I was under the impression that you could deduct capital losses from your taxes, so the government only makes money if you do.

Still, someone really needs to reconcile the oft-repeated libertarian positions of:

1. The rich pay too many taxes.
2. The rich buy our lawmakers to create an inflationary economy so they can steal the wealth of everyone else.

If the rich were really struggling under oppressive taxation, the rich-poor gap would be decreasing, not widening. Obviously they're having no problems amassing wealth even with the "ridiculously high" taxes in place. I should also point out that China, which is always trotted out as being the "right" way to do things from an economic standpoint due to their massive growth, has a 25% capital gains tax.

I don't believe I have heard either of those two "libertarian" statements... I have heard a version of the first that excessive taxes on high income decreases investment opportunities, which dampens in the economy. That is correct.

The second is non-sense.

It's been trotted out multiple times on this board that inflation is used as a tool to suppress the poor and middle classes by decreasing their real income every year so the wealthy can abscond with the remainder. You need to keep up with your conspiracy theories. You know, the same one that says the Federal Reserve was created solely to preserve a sort of unofficial caste system in the US and empower an unofficial ruling class by destroying the earning potential of everyone else?

Inflation doesn't let the "wealthy" abscond with money at the expense of the "poor." It lets the government abscond with money at the expense of the citizens.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

Actually, it does, assuming that by "wealthy" he means "bankers and other looters", and by "poor" he means "everyone else".

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Ezekiel 23:19-20 

The earlier any individual uses the newly created currency the more they gain advantage over later users.

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"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville