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PostPosted: Sat Sep 11, 2010 3:08 pm 
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So the community college and university I go to use Gmail to power their e-mail. I'm trying to figure out a way if there's a way to access this via Google directly without having to login to each respective college's website first and then hit their e-mail link. I've tried entering my respective login for each institution at Google's gmail site but that doesn't work.

Anybody know if there's a way to do this? Or are these partnerships usually designed to keep you bound to the school website?

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 11, 2010 3:24 pm 
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Not really, but you could set up your gmail account to check your other accounts.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 11, 2010 3:36 pm 
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Wow. I'm really surprised anybody responsible (executives at the college) would do this. It's a FERPA nightmare.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 11, 2010 10:19 pm 
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UNLV did this as well.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 11, 2010 10:42 pm 
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http://www.google.com/a/help/intl/en/edu/privacy.html

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Google complies with applicable US privacy law, and the Google Apps Terms of Service can specifically detail our obligations and compliance with FERPA (Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act) regulations.


WRT the original question:
Doing some googling around, it looks like POP3 access (required for Gmail to manage another email account) is turned on/off at a domain level. IE the school IT department turns POP3 on or off for everyone. If POP3 is on, you're supposed to be able to log in via pop3 using the standard Gmail server (pop.gmail.com).

Since the Google Apps addresses are accessed via the standard gmail backend interfaces, I would expect the web interface to work as well. You tried logging in via your full email address, right?

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 11, 2010 11:11 pm 
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Mookhow wrote:
http://www.google.com/a/help/intl/en/edu/privacy.html

Quote:
Google complies with applicable US privacy law, and the Google Apps Terms of Service can specifically detail our obligations and compliance with FERPA (Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act) regulations.


WRT the original question:
Doing some googling around, it looks like POP3 access (required for Gmail to manage another email account) is turned on/off at a domain level. IE the school IT department turns POP3 on or off for everyone. If POP3 is on, you're supposed to be able to log in via pop3 using the standard Gmail server (pop.gmail.com).

Since the Google Apps addresses are accessed via the standard gmail backend interfaces, I would expect the web interface to work as well. You tried logging in via your full email address, right?

Yeah - I tried entering my fully e-mail addresses as the User ID on Gmail's site and it didn't work. I feel stupid though that I didn't think about just getting the POP3 settings. I guess I don't have to use the Gmail app on my phone.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 12, 2010 8:01 pm 
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Kaffis Mark V wrote:
Wow. I'm really surprised anybody responsible (executives at the college) would do this. It's a FERPA nightmare.
It's ultimately no different than having school email powered by Microsoft, which my employer does.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 13, 2010 12:38 am 
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Well, it is different, in one big way.

Presumably you are running an internal exchange server?

Most company policies state that no corporate data can be stored outside the corporate network. At least for us, this includes email.

It's a bit of a dilemma, because we endorse/sell products that are conducive to just the opposite (gmail/android/danger, etc..), and we struggle with telling our customers they can do one thing, but we do something completely different.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 13, 2010 9:17 am 
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Yeah. Granted, I don't do the granular close reading of FERPA for my school, but from what I've absorbed from the rantings of the guy that does (who has to fend off impulsive faculty attempts to use Google Docs and the like on a semi-regular basis), the fact that Google crawls gmail accounts for advertisement data mining opens up FERPA liabilities.

Again, I'm not sitting around reading Google Apps TOS or FERPA, but my mind just can't reconcile what I DO know of the two without headexploding.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 13, 2010 3:24 pm 
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We did this toward the end of my year over at MSU. The department I worked for didn't like groupwise that the campus was pushing and though gmail worked pretty good, so off we went. Most folks liked it. It worked well for the most part.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 15, 2010 3:26 pm 
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Gawker wrote:
GCreep: Google Engineer Stalked Teens, Spied on Chats (Updated)

We entrust Google with our most private communications because we assume the company takes every precaution to safeguard our data. It doesn't. A Google engineer spied on four underage teens for months before the company was notified of the abuses.

David Barksdale, a 27-year-old former Google engineer, repeatedly took advantage of his position as a member of an elite technical group at the company to access users' accounts, violating the privacy of at least four minors during his employment, we've learned. Barksdale met the kids through a technology group in the Seattle area while working as a Site Reliability Engineer at Google's Kirkland, Wash. office. He was fired in July 2010 after his actions were reported to the company. [Update: Google has confirmed the security breach. An update appears below.]

It's unclear how widespread Barksdale's abuses were, but in at least four cases, Barksdale spied on minors' Google accounts without their consent, according to a source close to the incidents. In an incident this spring involving a 15-year-old boy who he'd befriended, Barksdale tapped into call logs from Google Voice, Google's Internet phone service, after the boy refused to tell him the name of his new girlfriend, according to our source. After accessing the kid's account to retrieve her name and phone number, Barksdale then taunted the boy and threatened to call her.

In other cases involving teens of both sexes, Barksdale exhibited a similar pattern of aggressively violating others' privacy, according to our source. He accessed contact lists and chat transcripts, and in one case quoted from an IM that he'd looked up behind the person's back. (He later apologized to one for retrieving the information without her knowledge.) In another incident, Barksdale unblocked himself from a Gtalk buddy list even though the teen in question had taken steps to cut communications with the Google engineer.

What motivated Barksdale to snoop on these teens is not entirely clear. Our source said Barksdale's harassment did not appear to be sexual in nature, although his online communication with the minors (such as inviting underage kids to attend to the movies with him) demonstrated extraordinarily questionable judgment on Barksdale's part. "My gut read on the situation was that there wasn't any strong sexual predatory behavior, just a lot of violating people's personal privacy," our source explained.

Barksdale declined to speak with us by phone. Via email, however, he confirmed that he'd been fired by Google, although he refused to elaborate on the circumstances behind his departure or the specific allegations made against him. "You must have heard some pretty wild things if you think me getting fired is newsworthy," he responded by email.

It seems part of the reason Barksdale snooped through the teens' Gmail and Gtalk accounts was to show off the power he had as a member of a group with broad access to company data. A self-described "hacker," Barksdale seemed to get a kick out of flaunting his position at Google, which was the case when, with a friend's consent, he pulled up the person's email account, contact list, chat transcripts, Google Voice call logs—even a list of other Gmail addresses that the friend had registered but didn't think were linked to their main account—within seconds. The friend wasn't concerned; Barksdale seemed to him to be a "silly," good-natured nerd.

The parents of the teens whose Google accounts were violated by Barksdale were hardly amused, however. Several attempted to cut off Barksdale's access to their children and withdrew them from the technology group where they'd first encountered the Google engineer. (Barksdale was kicked out of the group after his abuses came to light.) In July, officials at Google were notified of Barksdale's actions. We've obtained an email exchange between one person who complained about Barksdale to Google and Eric Grosse, an Engineer Director in Google's security group at the company's Mountain View, Calif. headquarters. Grosse quickly responded to the complaint with a curt email: "Thank you very much for reporting; we'll investigate quietly and get back to you if we need anything more."

If Google was already aware of Barksdale's privacy violations, Grosse didn't mention it. But while Google seemed initially helpful and friendly when dealing with those who'd notified Google of his conduct, they became increasingly tight-lipped as company officials realized the seriousness of the problem.

Later, when asked if Google had taken steps to deal with Barksdale, Grosse would only say, "I am personally satisfied that we've taken decisive steps to limit any additional risk." When emailed again several weeks later about whether Barksdale was still employed by Google, or if the company had determined the extent of his privacy violations, Grosse refused to get into any specifics: "Google has taken the appropriate actions, I can't say more."

Right around the same time, Barksdale was quietly fired by the company.

It's no surprise that Google execs were skittish about discussing the case in detail. Site Reliability Engineers (or SREs) have access to the company's most sensitive data. Responsible for a variety of tasks including responding to technical difficulties across Google's ever-expanding portfolio of products, SREs are given unfettered access to users' accounts for the services they oversee, according to a former SRE who left the company in 2007.

"If you're an SRE, for instance, on Gmail, you will have access to mailboxes because you may have to look into the databases," the former Google SRE—who did not work with Barksdale—explained to us by phone. "You'll need access to the storage mechanisms," he explained, pointing out that in order to determine the cause of a technical issue with Gmail, an SRE might have to access emails stored on Google's servers to see if data is corrupted.

Barksdale's intrustion into Gmail and Gtalk accounts may have escaped notice, since SREs are responsible for troubleshooting issues on a constant basis, which means they access Google's servers remotely many times a day, often at odd hours. "I was looking at that stuff [information stored on Google's servers] every hour I was awake," says the former Google employee. And the company does not closely monitor SREs to detect improper access to customers' accounts because SREs are generally considered highly-experienced engineers who can be trusted, the former Google staffer said.

"There's a whole bunch of trust involved. There's a lot of data inside Google, and I'm willing to bet some of it is really valuable. But for me and the people I worked with, it was never worth looking at."

It's unclear how many accounts Barksdale inappropriately accessed while employed by Google, or if the company has conducted a thorough investigation into possible privacy abuses by other employees. (Calls to Google for comment were not returned.) It's also not clear what measures are in place to prevent Google staffers from snooping on users.

The Barksdale case comes as Google has attempted to address concerns about privacy by encrypting Gmail to protect messages from hackers, and by simplifying its privacy policies to make them more comprehensible to users. Ironically, just last week Google launched its Family Safety Center, dedicated to helping parents keep their children safe on the Internet. But as this disturbing incident suggests, the biggest threat to kids' privacy might be Google employees themselves.

Additional reporting by Sergio Hernandez.


Update:
Google has released a statement confirming it fired Barksdale for privacy violations:

"We dismissed David Barksdale for breaking Google's strict internal privacy policies. We carefully control the number of employees who have access to our systems, and we regularly upgrade our security controls–for example, we are significantly increasing the amount of time we spend auditing our logs to ensure those controls are effective. That said, a limited number of people will always need to access these systems if we are to operate them properly–which is why we take any breach so seriously."

— Bill Coughran, Senior Vice President, Engineering, Google
[Photos of Barksdale via Flickr. Photos of Google's Kirkland campus via Getty Images]

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"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 15, 2010 4:50 pm 
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Nothing about that incident surprises me one bit.

Although I found some irony in this statement by the reporter
Gawker wrote:
We've obtained an email exchange between one person who complained about Barksdale to Google and Eric Grosse, an Engineer Director in Google's security group at the company's Mountain View, Calif. headquarters


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 15, 2010 5:11 pm 
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Indeed, Midgen. Lol.

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"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades


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