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PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:41 pm 
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Here's the idea: a guest-worker program that issues a work visa, renewable annually, to any foreigner who can get a job here and pass a criminal background check. The guest-workers are allowed to bring their spouses and children with them, and all of them are entitled to use public services for the duration of the work visa. If the guest-worker loses his/her job, he/she has six months to find another one or they and their family have to leave the country. Similarly, any serious criminal conviction is grounds for immediate deportation. No caps on the total number of visas, but no path to permanent residency or citizenship either. The work visa is treated as a totally separate thing from permanent immigration programs.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:44 pm 
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If you deport immigrants you might as well exile citizens.

IMO anyone should be able to come here and stay if they can afford it and not violate zoning laws.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:45 pm 
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RangerDave wrote:
Here's the idea: a guest-worker program that issues a work visa, renewable annually, to any foreigner who can get a job here and pass a criminal background check. The guest-workers are allowed to bring their spouses and children with them, and all of them are entitled to use public services for the duration of the work visa. If the guest-worker loses his/her job, he/she has six months to find another one or they and their family have to leave the country. Similarly, any serious criminal conviction is grounds for immediate deportation. No caps on the total number of visas, but no path to permanent residency or citizenship either. The work visa is treated as a totally separate thing from permanent immigration programs.


Dummy short duration jobs that serve no purpose other than importing people into the Country. 2 weeks after arrival, they are "fired" and disappear.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 1:28 pm 
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Not to mention, the ones who come here pregnant and then get outraged when you deport their family that includes a citizen infant.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 1:56 pm 
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There already are guest worker visas that allow people to utilize public services. In fact, anyone in this country legally can utilize them with the exception of very-short-term visas such as transit visas or crewmen making a temporary landing. The entire H-series of visas is for guest workers, and there are a number of other nonimmigrant visas which pertain to work or employment in some fashion. Guest workers are allowed to bring their spouses and children as well; that falls under H-4. Serious crime is already grounds for deportation. The only thing new in your idea is giving them 6 months to find a new job.

As for a path to citizenship, relatively few nonimmigrant visas are a path to an immigrant visa in and of themselves. K-series visas are temporary statuses for spouses and fiance's awaiting an immigrant visa, O-1 aliens may self-petition for permenant residence. Generally, if someone wants to be a LAPR, they just get an immigrant visa in the first place.

The problem has nothing to do with a lack of suitable visas. It has to do with people not wanting to follow the existing paths, which in turn is a product of there simply being far more people wanting to come here than are good for this country. We should not make policy based on the needs of other countries; we should make it based on this country's needs.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 3:02 pm 
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Well, the two new elements in my scenario that I think are significant are 1) the catch-all approach and 2) the uncapped numbers. Under current rules, there are all kinds of visa options, but each has its own rules and red tape. If you have this kind of job, you apply for such-and-such a visa; that kind of job, you need a different one. And the jobs that qualify are limited. You aren't getting an H visa to come flip burgers! In addition, I believe the number of available visas varies by job category, country of origin, year, etc.

What I'm suggesting is a very streamlined process. Are you from the Americas? Do you have a job of any kind waiting for you here? Can you pass the background check? If the answer to all three is yes, come on in and welcome to ya! And once you're here: Did you lose your job and can't find another one quickly, well thanks for coming by, but it's time to head on home. Committed a crime while you were here? Well gtfo and don't come back.

What I'm shooting for is an approach that's so simple and open that there's very little incentive for honest, hardworking people to do an end-run around the system, but also no question that this is a temporary arrangement based on employment.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 8:07 pm 
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RangerDave wrote:
Well, the two new elements in my scenario that I think are significant are 1) the catch-all approach and 2) the uncapped numbers. Under current rules, there are all kinds of visa options, but each has its own rules and red tape. If you have this kind of job, you apply for such-and-such a visa; that kind of job, you need a different one. And the jobs that qualify are limited. You aren't getting an H visa to come flip burgers! In addition, I believe the number of available visas varies by job category, country of origin, year, etc.

What I'm suggesting is a very streamlined process. Are you from the Americas? Do you have a job of any kind waiting for you here? Can you pass the background check? If the answer to all three is yes, come on in and welcome to ya! And once you're here: Did you lose your job and can't find another one quickly, well thanks for coming by, but it's time to head on home. Committed a crime while you were here? Well gtfo and don't come back.

What I'm shooting for is an approach that's so simple and open that there's very little incentive for honest, hardworking people to do an end-run around the system, but also no question that this is a temporary arrangement based on employment.


This isn't the case at all.

The vast majority of workers fit under 1 of 2 categories: H-2A, temporary agricultural worker or H-2B, temporary non agricultural worker. You most certainly can come flip burgers on an H-2B.

There are indeed a lot of different kinds of nonimmigrant visas, but the majority of them are not employment-related. Of those that are employment-related, all the rest are much more limited in scope. A and G visas are for diplomats, which obviously don't pertain to the immigration problem. B-1 are temporary business visitors, which is pretty much only businessmen, E series is for treaty traders and investors, a specific type of businessman, H-1B is for researchers, fashion models, and up to 100 DOD workers per year on joint projects with other countries like the F-35. H-1C is registered nurses only. Some types of J may work, but J is for exchange programs, not employment per se. L is for intracompany transferees, who already have a job. O-1 is only for people of world-class achievement such as nobel prize winners. P and Q are work-related but they related to athletics, the arts, and cultural exchanges, not areas that the average immigrant is working in. R is for religious workers.

As you can see, while there are plenty of different visas, they aren't the cause of any significant red tape or confusion to the verge guest worker who just wants to come get a job. They all pertain to people that are already employed and need to come here to conduct business, or to people who are in one of several narrow categories.

Moreover, why do we want to make it easier for people to come here as guest workers? We don't need them. We don't have enough jobs to go around. I don't see any real reason behind this other than to benefit the people who would get the visas, and it isn't our job to benefit them. In point of fact, being able to ship excess people to the U.S. is only a relief valve for problems in their country, allowing their governments to continue running jacked up countries.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 8:52 pm 
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Diamondeye wrote:
Moreover, why do we want to make it easier for people to come here as guest workers? We don't need them. We don't have enough jobs to go around. I don't see any real reason behind this other than to benefit the people who would get the visas, and it isn't our job to benefit them. In point of fact, being able to ship excess people to the U.S. is only a relief valve for problems in their country, allowing their governments to continue running jacked up countries.

So they can vote Democrat and live off the public teat that rewards them for doing so.

Or, so they can do all our work for us as we retire on the profits, if you're a Republican, instead.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 9:35 am 
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RangerDave wrote:
Here's the idea: a guest-worker program that issues a work visa, renewable annually, to any foreigner who can get a job here and pass a criminal background check. The guest-workers are allowed to bring their spouses and children with them, and all of them are entitled to use public services for the duration of the work visa. If the guest-worker loses his/her job, he/she has six months to find another one or they and their family have to leave the country. Similarly, any serious criminal conviction is grounds for immediate deportation. No caps on the total number of visas, but no path to permanent residency or citizenship either. The work visa is treated as a totally separate thing from permanent immigration programs.

Without real border security, allowing local police to check immigration status, and e-verify it's just going to get violated.

Also define services.

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