RangerDave wrote:
Micheal wrote:
New York cops have a respect line that if you cross you get arrested. If it goes anywhere it is usually just an infraction. Mostly it is cool down time, teaching you not to be an *** to cops just for grins.
This is what I think is wrong with the events in that video and with the general culture of law enforcement (in my experience anyway). No one likes being disrespected or insulted, but for regular people, there's not much you can do about it. There's nothing illegal about being rude. However, cops have the power to f*ck with you on a whim, so if you're rude to them, they'll often use that power to do exact a little "justice" (as they see it) by jerking you a round, citing you for something if they can, and arresting you if you get all agitated about it. That's abusing their authority, in my opinion.
Well, for one thing there is no "general culture of law enforcement" that says to ticket or arrest people for disrespecting you. Some cops do this, but they tend not to stay cops long because sooner or later they make arrests without probable cause and start getting into trouble.
There is, on the other hand, a culture of looking at a person getting arrested for an infraction that is minor, and who is disruptive, abusive, or violent because they don't like it, and then blaiming it on the cop; i.e. claiming a perfectly legal arrest is somehow abusive just ebcause the original infaction was minor.
In this particular case, it was worse than that. The guy that ended up arrested wasn't "having a private conversation with another citizen", he came up and interrupted a conversation between an officer conducting business and another citizen that he really had no business getting involved in. In addition to being rude, it was a case of interfering with official business - minor, certainly, but a case of it nonetheless.
That, however, is why the cop not only did not leap out and tackle him, didn't immidiately tell him he was getting a ticket, and in fact didn't even immidiately get out of the car. He simply expressed his displeasure at the man's rudness. The man then decides he needs to stick around and argue about it because by jove he's not going to take any crap from no NYC cop, no sir! He ain't no little *****!
Could the officer have ignored it? Yes, it was possible, but there's no reason he
should ignore it, just as there's no reason he necessarily should respond to it. The police do not (and in fact cannot possibly) cite every minor violation; on the other hand there is no reason every minor violation should be ignored just ebcause it is minor. It is the job of the police to deescalte the
use of force in a situation; it is not their job to deescalte from an arrest to a ticket to letting someone else go just because someone has a video camera or passersby don't like it.
One wonders what the outcome would have been without any cop; if he had interrupted two other people's conversation with a "joke", and someone had told him they didn't appreciate it. Maybe he would have just gone about his business since it wasn't "the Man" making him look bad.. or on the other hand, maybe he simply can't accept being told anything he doesn't like and just decides to argue with everyone, and it might have ended in a fight.
It is not in any way an abuse of power or authority to arrest someone for interrupting your official business, especially after you already gave them a chance to leave with nothing more than a ticket, or even just an expression of displeasure. The law does not allow people to disrupt official business for their own entertainment, and it does not allow you to ahve aloud confrontation with someone on the public street, whether that person is a police officer or not.
There is also plenty you can do about it if you are a regular citizen - depending on where you are you might get someone who is being rude or disruptive thrown off the premisis, arrested, or ticketed. You can't arrest them yourself is really the only difference. You can leave, or you can stand there and be rude right back if you choose.
The polcie, however, when out in public, on duty and in uniform, are conducting official business simply by patrolling. They may also be engaging in other, nonofficial activities at the same time such as chatting with citizens, but the fact of the matter is that the polcie cannot be retreating from enforcing the law simply because normal citizens can't enforce the law. That's silly. Essentially this eventually ends up being "there shouldn't be any law enforcement officers because they have powers normal citizens don't have, and so using them is abusive". Ok, fine if you don' want any cops and want mob justice, good luck.
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