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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 2:51 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:09 pm 
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Rynar wrote:
When I was a kid I was was punished equally for bullying and for not standing up for myself and my younger siblings to older children who were bullying us..

It served me and my family very well.


Depending on the situation, this type of parenting style is going to result in a lot of suicides.

The high school I attended in freshman and sophomore year had a severe bullying problem. This was exacerbated by the fact that the management of that school was utterly and grossly incompetent and responded to systemic problems by basically sticking their fingers in their ears and pretending the problems didn't exist. "Standing up" to a bully there that was twice your weight meant you risked serious injury, and it happened to a few kids. One freshman known to have severe claustrophobia was stuffed in a locker for an entire day, and ended up in the hospital because he tore all his fingernails off trying to claw his way out. Another got carted out with a fractured skull, he finally got the courage to tell some big guy to **** off and got his head slammed into a wall for it.

If you put your kids in a situation where they have to choose between getting beat at home and getting beat at school, what do you think is going to happen?


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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:12 pm 
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Not a F'n Boy Scout
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Xequecal wrote:
Rynar wrote:
When I was a kid I was was punished equally for bullying and for not standing up for myself and my younger siblings to older children who were bullying us..

It served me and my family very well.


Depending on the situation, this type of parenting style is going to result in a lot of suicides.

The high school I attended in freshman and sophomore year had a severe bullying problem. This was exacerbated by the fact that the management of that school was utterly and grossly incompetent and responded to systemic problems by basically sticking their fingers in their ears and pretending the problems didn't exist. "Standing up" to a bully there that was twice your weight meant you risked serious injury, and it happened to a few kids. One freshman known to have severe claustrophobia was stuffed in a locker for an entire day, and ended up in the hospital because he tore all his fingernails off trying to claw his way out. Another got carted out with a fractured skull, he finally got the courage to tell some big guy to **** off and got his head slammed into a wall for it.

If you put your kids in a situation where they have to choose between getting beat at home and getting beat at school, what do you think is going to happen?


Rynar wrote:
...how do you know if my punishments were physical? How do you know what my parents thought "standing up to bullies" meant? Do you think it was a bad thing that my parents raised me and my siblings not to be bullies?

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19 Yet she became more and more promiscuous as she recalled the days of her youth, when she was a prostitute in Egypt. 20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

Ezekiel 23:19-20 


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:14 pm 
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That was more of a simplification, I'm not trying to demonize you with the physical punishment angle. The child still has to choose between punishment at home and "punishment" at school, with no way out.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:37 pm 
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I dont think of myself as particularly violent, but was two teen boys fighting really that shocking to people? It was just bare fisted street brawling too, no weapons or teaming up on anyone. I'd also attribute the "poke his eyes out" comments to heat of the moment.

To paraphrase Chris Rock: I aint saying he was right, but I understand.

For the Judge to say you can no longer see your children over this pushes my buttons big time.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:39 pm 
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Mr Judge... **** yourself and your decision.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:39 pm 
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Or simply the fact that it encourages one not to turn the other cheek. Rather than just walk away from a problem, you elect to meet it head on. I'm not even suggesting that one approach is better. In fact I would tend to agree that in many cases confrontation is the better choice. But it is reflected in your posting style here.

Expounded enough?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:42 pm 
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Xequecal wrote:
That was more of a simplification, I'm not trying to demonize you with the physical punishment angle. The child still has to choose between punishment at home and "punishment" at school, with no way out.


That would be awful parenting. There is a way to do it that accomplishes your parenting goals and doesn't isolate your child.

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19 Yet she became more and more promiscuous as she recalled the days of her youth, when she was a prostitute in Egypt. 20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

Ezekiel 23:19-20 


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:52 pm 
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darksiege wrote:
Mr Judge... **** yourself and your decision.


This, appeal immediately.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:57 pm 
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Quote:
Everyone considered him
The coward of the county
He'd never stood one single time
To prove the county wrong
His mama named him Tommy
But folks just called him yellow
Something always told me
They were reading Tommy wrong

He was only ten years old
When his daddy died in prison
I looked after Tommy
'Cause he was my brother's son
I still recall the final words
My brother said to Tommy
Son my life is over
But yours has just begun

Promise me, son
Not to do the things I've done
Walk away from trouble if you can
Now it don't mean you're weak
If you turn the other cheek
And I hope you're old enough to understand
Son, you don't have to fight to be a man

There's someone for everyone
And Tommy's love was Becky
In her arms he didn't have
To prove he was a man
One day while he was working
The Gatlin boys came calling
They took turns at Becky
N'there was three of them
Tommy opened up the door
And saw his Becky crying
The torn dress, the shattered look
Was more than he could stand
He reached above the fireplace
Took down his daddy's picture
As his tears fell on his daddy's face
he heard these words again

Promise me, son
Not to do the things I've done
Walk away from trouble if you can
Now it don't mean you're weak
If you turn the other cheek
And I hope you're old enough to understand
Son, you don't have to fight to be a man

The Gatlin boys just laughed at him
When he walked into the barroom
One of them got up
And met him half way cross the floor
Tommy turned around they said
Hey look, old yeller's leavin'
You could've heard a pin drop
When Tommy stopped and locked the door

Twenty years of crawling
Was bottled up inside him
He wasn't holding nothing back
He let 'em have it all
Tommy left the bar room
Not a Gatlin boy was standing
He said, This one's for Becky
As he watched the last one fall
And I heard him say

I promised you, Dad
Not to do the things you've done
I walk away from trouble when I can
Now please don't think I'm weak
I didn't turn the other cheek
Papa, I sure hope you understand
Sometimes you gotta fight
When you're a man

Everyone considered him
The coward of the county

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 4:18 pm 
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Home of the Whopper
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Oh I LOVE that song!!!

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 5:32 pm 
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Not a F'n Boy Scout
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TheRiov wrote:
Or simply the fact that it encourages one not to turn the other cheek. Rather than just walk away from a problem, you elect to meet it head on. I'm not even suggesting that one approach is better. In fact I would tend to agree that in many cases confrontation is the better choice. But it is reflected in your posting style here.

Expounded enough?


I'm of the opinion that saying what you mean, and meaning what you say is the best course of action to follow in every situation. I'm also of the opinion that talking it out should always be your first first course of action. Telling a bully that what he is doing is unacceptable is absolutely consistent with standing up to him. In fact, it's the first part. The second part, especially as an adult, is to embarrass the bully with your words and logic humiliating him to the point that he won't show himself anymore. More often than not, this is enough to stop the bullying. However, in the event that it is not, you "lock the door" and don't stop beating the bully until they can't/won't defend themselves anymore. You make it clear to them that if they ever bully again, the next beating will be worse. If not putting up with passive aggressive bullshit is reflected in my posting style, I'll take that as a huge compliment.

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Quote:
19 Yet she became more and more promiscuous as she recalled the days of her youth, when she was a prostitute in Egypt. 20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

Ezekiel 23:19-20 


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 8:51 pm 
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Commence Primary Ignition
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TheRiov wrote:
Or simply the fact that it encourages one not to turn the other cheek. Rather than just walk away from a problem, you elect to meet it head on. I'm not even suggesting that one approach is better. In fact I would tend to agree that in many cases confrontation is the better choice. But it is reflected in your posting style here.

Expounded enough?


Turning the other cheek in the face of insults and humiliation is one thing; in the face of physical harm is quite another. Even the Bible only advocates turning the other cheek against petty behaviors; every one of Jesus's examples involves an insult; the worst thing physically he uses is a slap on the cheek which is painful but not really dangerous.

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