The Glade 4.0

Pretty much this. You deserve to keep it all. You worked for it. On the other side of the coin, I like not having to pay tolls to drive to work, like that the police are there to deter and investigate crime, and that there is a fire department who will rescue me out of a burning building without checking my bank account. Thus we need to give money to the government to support these projects. It's not the idea but his choice of verbiage and the thought process that appears to be behind it.

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I prefer to think of them as "Fighting evil in another dimension"

The problem here is that you and TheRiov think someone is getting paid "more", Xequecal; by the by, I assume you opposed Obama's withholding changes and payroll tax deferments because you saw none of that money in your take home? I'm going to assume, since one of the tax changes you both keep proposing to counter reality actually happened, that neither of you noticed a changed in take home pay when your payroll deductions were altered later year?

I mean, it'd be good to know if you're both telling Obama's he wrong and that the changes didn't actually put more accessible currency in people's hands.

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Ah yes. Khross's old tactic of resorting to insults.

I figured since you've been ignoring facts all thread, I'd just skip the end in your case. I mean, your employer cut your pay when your FICA, Social Security, and Medicare Withholding (and actual tax burdens if you made less than the statutory maximum for Social Security) were cut off the front end last year, right? You received a pay decrease because of the Obama tax policy, right?

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It's a hundred times easier to get away with not increasing employee pay when your costs go down or profits go up, than it is to actually cut their salaries. I mean, one of the major arguments against inflationary policy is that employee wages are the last thing to go up when inflation occurs.

However, if the payroll tax increase was permanent, I have no doubt that many companies would eliminate or reduce annual raises or bonuses because of it.

This is not the same thing as what you originally said. More importantly, while actual tax rates can be seriously affected by life circumstances, generally employers do not alter your pay based on things like how many kids you have.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

It's a decrease, Xequecal ...

Obama actually changed how much money you take home, and it's been extended. So, again ...

Did your employer reduce your pay because of Obama's policy? Yes or no?

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I originally said that if the employer side of payroll taxes were decreased, (your employer's costs go down) your pay would not go up. I never said anything about employers cutting pay, Khross brought that up and I was just responding to him.

Yes, that was a brain fart on my part. I meant decrease. No, my employer did not reduce my pay, but I already addressed that.

Yes, but you said that in the context that your gross pay rate took your taxes into account. The fact is that it doesn't, except in the most general sense that corporations (or for that matter the government itself) need to pay enough that the takehome rate will be adequate.

Moreover, if you have any sort of contract you certainly WILL see that extra money, or your employer will be in breach of contract. Every job offer and contract I've ever seen is based on the gross. An employer cannot just decide to keep the tax money if tax rates go down.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

+1

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"...the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?" -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

Okay, everyone, flat tax of 75% until the national debt is gone. Deficit spending ends now. We don't spend more than we earn, and what we earn goes into debt service and principal reduction. The States get half of the taxes collected within their borders. Anything the feds mandate, the feds pay for, again, staying within taxes collected. Anyone wants foreign aid, that comes with a serious equitable what is in it for us package. NATO wants help, NATO, in the form of its other members puts up half the Capital to run the police action up front and American troops make up less than 50% of the combined force.

Any nations screws with us, they burn. They screw with us twice, they glow.

Every foreign car you own has a ten percent annual luxury tax assessed. Buy American Bozos. Any American car manufacturer that receives a less than satisfactory review, the top 3% of management has their personal fortune diminished to replace the lemons with American cars that have received a satisfactory rating. The top 1% go to Gitmo until their companies can bail them out after they hit satisfactory marks.

Similar Draconian measures will be placed on other industries that have fallen behind the foreign curve.

Citizenship is earned by Military or other Government Service, four years starting at 18 if you get out of high school with an earned diploma, 22 if you get out of college with an earned diploma. If you drop out of high school you will be trained for minimum wage work, usually hard labor. Ten years of low level labor can earn you citizenship, if your assessment scores in satisfactory range. Anyone taking more than 25 years to earn their citizenship in this program become organ donors, immediately.

Any Territory has five years to put in an application for Statehood. If they vote not wish to become a State, they are released from territorial status and we take our toys and go home. We allow immigration to those interested in becoming or continue being citizens of the United States.

Political refugees from other countries must bring education and skills with them. Lots of good intelligence if they are fleeing someone we are suffering hostilities with. There is no such thing as a political refugee from one of our true allies.

A felony involving a murder, any degree, gets an automatic 20 to life, no possibility of parole sentence. Criminal Gang involvement doubles the base sentence. The country ends the death penalty. We stop executing people, no matter what they have done. However, they do suffer civil death. They have no civil rights inside the maximum security prisons. Guards will be prosecuted for assaulting prisoners, either physically or sexually. Other prisoners will not be.

Expecting parents will receive a government sponsored multi-session, thumbprint verified training session to explain what child-abuse is. If the child then suffers abuse of any of the types covered in the training, the child is removed from the care of the parents, who will be reeducated and trained to be forward scouts for elite forces, or so they will be told. The children will be enrolled in of the Doom Kinder Academies where they will be healed of their injuries, then evaluated and trained for a productive career in addition to their regular schooling. Making Dr. Doom Happy, a near impossible task, will be their goals.

If the parents survive their training, and 25 missions in the field, they may petition to be reunited with their children. These petitions are not automatically granted and the parents maturity and sanity must be stress tested before they can reunite with their children, and only if the children choose to return to the abusive assholes that nearly took them out in the first place.

200,000 acres will be set aside in Montana and a similar size spread in Alaska.Drug addicts who have failed their first attempt at recovery will be given an option of the Montana dry ranch for three years. Anyone smuggling drugs in will summarily be executed. Anyone caught using drugs during their stint in rehab in Montana gets an automatic transfer to the Alaskan ranch. They will be dropped from a helicopter with two sets of weather appropriate clothing, enough food for five days and directions for a week long hike for those in good shape to get to the rehab center. In the kit is a K-Bar, some fishing line, a few hooks, and some sulfa powder. The last item is a shock resistant compass.

Pirates will automatically be hunted down and sunk, hostages will be offered rescue. Pirates will be shot or left to drown. Be sure to look like a hostage, whatever that means, if you get in that situation.

We need to tighten our belts. We need to do nasty things to criminal elements. No more soft on crime. No more wavering on constitutional issues.

Some of our agricultural areas lying fallow will grow new crops to supply those with medical reasons sufficient cannibas and opiates to feed the needs of addicts going through a medical crisis, or withdrawing from opiate addiction. Break the rules and go to Montana.

There are many other areas we could make similar draconian fixes to, and many would be as valid and more or less effective than the care bear system of justice.

There are no easy answers, mine would just create a military state none of us truly want. So we will keep on keeping on, trying this that and the other damn thing. We will never get it right, but we may get it close some day.

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The U. S. Constitution doesn't guarantee happiness, only the pursuit of it. You have to catch up with it yourself. B. Franklin

"A mind needs books like a sword needs a whetstone." -- Tyrion Lannister, A Game of Thrones

Would you like to know more?

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"...the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?" -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

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A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. ~ John Stuart Mill

How the hell could this be? I was offered my salary or wage in every job I've held before I filed what my with holdings and deductions would be. So how could they possibly know how much my net pay would be and adjust the wage/salary I was offered before I told them this information?

Furthermore, since I could move over to Pennsylvania at any instant and take advantage of other deductions (or lose out on them), my net income would change. Yet, my employer has not made any indication my salary would change as a result.

Now you're just making **** up.

This is seriously the dumbest argument you've tried to make Rafael. You don't think a company can estimate this? You dont think the market will evolutionarily balance out the salaries so the take-home pay remains relatively constant?

A McDouble currently has a price of $1. How much is that sandwich that worth, TheRiov? What's the value of that sandwich?

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"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth

It's not worth a damn thing. Who the **** would eat a McDouble?

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

I would.

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"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth

It has value, Diamondeye; and your snark isn't helping things here. That's actually a legitimate question.

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I don't think anyone is likely to be confused about the actual cash value of the McDouble just because I made a snarky comment, Khross. You can save your comments on what "isn't helping"; I'm quite sure the quality of the discussion will not be materially affected.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Are you now equating a product with labor?

This. Chicken(or whatever it is) McNuggets are a guilty pleasure.

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"It is true that democracy undermines freedom when voters believe they can live off of others' productivity, when they modify the commandment: 'Thou shalt not steal, except by majority vote.' The politics of plunder is no doubt destructive of both morality and the division of labor."

We can and do equate all products to labor; that however isn't what I asked. I asked what's the value of a McDouble. It's price is $1, but what is the sandwich worth?

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