The Glade 4.0

I was browsing around Wikipedia today. As is so easy with that site I got started down a thread of topics completely different from my starting point.

I came upon the page for Atypical Depression.

It describes the following symptions:

A. Mood reactivity (i.e., mood brightens in response to actual or potential positive events)
B. At least two of the following:
1. Significant weight gain or increase in appetite ("comfort eating")[3]
2. Hypersomnia (sleeping too much, as opposed to the insomnia present in melancholic depression)
3. Leaden paralysis (i.e., heavy, leaden feelings in arms or legs)
4. Long-standing pattern of sensitivity to interpersonal rejection (not limited to episodes of mood disturbance; fits of rage, hysteria, aggression and irrational reactions) that results in significant social or occupational impairment

I experience all but #3 on a pretty regular basis.

Following the link to Interpersonal Rejection I find:



It's really kind of scary how accurate a picture of my personality that one paragraph draws. Ironically, much of that explains why I don't post here very much. Why I'm posting this here now I'm not really even sure.

I got some small amount of therapy 2 years ago to get myself moving again after a breakup and cross country move. But once I got a job and got at least self sufficient again I was pretty much booted from the program, which was publicly funded.

So now I find myself 2 years later, and things not a whole lot better. I should get into therapy again, I know. But have trouble caring enough to make that step.

Hm... I have those same symptoms, almost to the letter.

Especially #4.

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Holy shitsnacks!

And me! And me!

Is it medicalising being, you know, a person?

The best treatment for depression is 30 minutes of brisk aerobic exercise per day. It is better than medications.

*looks around*

Just looking to make sure I don't get caught telling y'all this.

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Memento Vivere

I have local knowledge.
That sandbar was not there yesterday!

I would prefer pills. Exercise is too much like work.

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Holy shitsnacks!

Makes sense, squirreltherapist.

The whole WoW addiction thing makes that more difficult than it would otherwise be, however!

Edit: And yes, too much like work, which I'm allergic to.

Pshh. Women get all those symptoms every month...

Squirrel girl is right though. I just read an article this morning about a study they did comparing two groups of depressed individuals. The first group they put on the antidepressant zoloft and the second group they instructed to exercise for 45 minutes 3 times a week.
Both groups improved at the same rate.

If running on a treadmill while listening to some music isn't your cup of tea you could always try something more fun like playing basketball after work, rollerblading, etc. Makes it seem less like exercise.

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"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth

Vigorous sex-drenched sexual intercourse can be substituted. 45 minutes is quite a long time. I believe they call it "****" in some areas.

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"It's real, grew up in trife life, the times of white lines
The hype vice, murderous nighttimes and knife fights invite crimes" - Nasir Jones

I try not to self-diagnose myself, mainly because I am afraid of the outcome.

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These two things are related.

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Holy shitsnacks!

1 & 4, yup, though I have insomnea no hypersomnia.

And I've tried the whole excercise thing to help with depression, about the only thing that came from it was feeling exhausted and sore then next morning cause I would be at the gym for 2-3 hours till like 1-2am till I couldn't physically continue when I had to work the next day, though I guess on the plus side it held off the weight gain unlike now where I'm at that why bother stage and never go to the gym so the weight keeps creeping up :/

Hmm...yup.

Eh, not really. And yeah, I've gained weight over the past 10 years, but it's from lack of exercise and abandonment of my diet, not from "comfort eating."

Yes. Mental problem or laziness? Hard to tell.

I've felt like that before, but who hasn't?

Ehhh...not really.


Yeah.

The problem I'm having with this is that most of that is simply human nature. I'm sure that were any of those criteria to reach crippling levels it would be cause for alarm, but with something so nebulous, how do you tell when you're mentally unhealthy vs. simply being a normal person?

Such is the danger with self-diagnosis. And I'm not anti-doctor in the least, but I'd be wary of being clinically diagnosed with such as well.

Like LK said, once a month like clock works.
Also add to it the symptoms of blowing up with out cause, tendency to cry over stupid trivial things, and the need to kill co-workers with sporks.

Apart from that I'm totally normal >.>

Sui and Squirrel Girl posts are right on the money...

In summary, humans need more exercise.

My wife keeps her DSM IV hidden away, because she knows if I get my hands on it, I WILL start diagnosing.

Do you work for the Department of Redundancy Department?

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

If you are in rut, force yourself into immediately completing the first three mundane tasks that come to mind each day. That is all.

:edit; And hard work will bring sound sleep. Yeah!

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"Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one." Charles Mackay

When I was in high school I was clincally diagnosed with "Major Depression." I took several tests, one of which was a 500 questionnaire "True/False" quiz that had some bizarre questions on it. Things like "I believe Abraham Lincoln was a better president than George Washington" and it had "I am satisfied with my sex life" more than once (I left it blank each time).

This was all during my stint in a mental hospital that I voluntarily checked into (I was afraid of what I might do to myself). I had quite a few realizations there.

One is that you can voluntarily check in, but you can't voluntarily check out. It was very similar to a prison. Magnetically sealed doors. People wearing similar garb (hospital garments and slippers). Solitary confinement (rooms with single beds with straps for the more violent patients). Regimented days; you had to get up when they told you, go to bed when they told you, eat when they told you, and you never could just have time to yourself (always had to be under supervision). I was there for exactly 7 days, and it felt like 7 months. To this day nothing in my life has ever felt like such a long time (even the past 3 years).

But I also realized that I wasn't alone in how I felt. And I realized that as bad as I thought I was, there were a LOT of people worse off than I was. I remember one kid who was 16 or so who had been in there for a whole month (Jebus!) and he was finally released to go home. They gave him a razor the day his parents were to come pick him up, so he could shave and look presentable. He comes out with his forearms slashed up and just giggling like Beavis & Butthead. He did not go home that day.

I hated that place so much and I didn't really think the doctors were helping me much so I did a ton of self-examination. I had a lot of time to kill to do so.

The first thing I realized is that I had to ask myself this question first and foremost: "Do I want to be happy?" It sounds stupid. However, it's easier to be depressed. A lot of people seem to prefer it, even if they say otherwise. Ultimately, the answer was "yes." After that I realized I had to work for it, including likely making some sacrifices.

I thought about some of the major triggers my depression fed off of. The biggest one was chatting on a local BBS that I did every single day. There were several reasons, but one of them was that people tended to know me as already depressed so I kind of slid into that role even if I was not quite feeling that way beforehand. It happens to a small degree here on the glade (which is why I haven't been as humorous as I used to be long ago), but it's extremely minor. I realized that I should just go completely cold turkey from that chat bbs, even though the mere thought of doing so did not sit well with me. But I was forced to think of my first question again: "Do I want to be happy?"

I did cut the online chatting out completely after I got out of the hospital and never looked back. It didn't fix everything emotionally, but it made a huge difference and allowed me to continue to improve my mental health. I focused on my good qualities instead of dismissing them and focusing on only the bad. I always suggest people write a list of their good qualities so that they have hard evidence to turn to.

It wasn't an easy road, but becoming happy can be done. I did it without therapy or pills (pills made me feel TOO happy and I didn't like that). But I am not wired like you or anyone else. We're all different. Some people have a chemical imbalance that cannot be fixed by sheer willpower and do in fact need medication to balance their emotions. Some people need the support of a professional. But I can promise you there is happiness to be had. You deserve it. Everyone deserves it. The biggest lie depressed people convince themselves of is that they can never be happy or that it is too far away to reach.

I won't lie and say I never have to battle with it. It's always there, a part of me. But it is not pronounced as much as it was and on the rare occasion it surfaces it leaves just as quickly.

Just know that people care about you (and I am speaking to anyone reading this, not just a particular Glader). Only you have to the power to decide how you want to feel. Nobody else can do it for you. All they can do is help and cheer you on. And if anyone ever needs it, I will most certainly be in their bleachers doing just that.

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Les Zombis et les Loups-Garous!

and weed

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Ron Paul 2012

How very, very true! I've been in your shoes before. Really. And I came to the same conclusions that you did.
Unfortunately, I also know many people who are still in depression, and not only do they not want to be happy, they continually seek out things, people, situations, and perspectives to purposefully keep themselves miserable. It's very sad.
Such a simple question, but for so many people, impossible to answer...Do you want to be happy?

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"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth

Reminds me of the time I was at the doctor's and picked up the "Do You Have ADD?" pamphlet. It asked a series of questions, and at the end said if you answered yes to so many of these, talk to your doctor about ADD. I lol'd because I had answered yes to all of them. Tell me something I don't know already.

While I think it's important that we find various abnormalities and take care of them as best we can, I think at this point some of the various mental "issues" have just gone to far. Last figure I read said one of four people had some form of ADD. I'm sorry, but that's not a disorder. If 25% of people have it, it's pretty normal.

We've just gotten to the point where we're trying to remove tendencies or actions that society has deemed "bad" even if they're completely normal. Don't get me wrong, there are legitimate mental and physical issues, of course, but far too many people are medicated or cast out or whatever else for things that are normal and have been for thousands, if not millions, of years.

That Wikipedia article doesn't adequately explain what this is. "Atypical Depression" isn't a diagnosis unto itself. The DSM-IV criteria in that article are actually the criteria for the "With Atypical Features" specifier. This is a specifier which clarifies or extends the criteria for an underlying Depressive Disorder (ex. Major Depressive Disorder, Dysthymic Disorder). That is, the criteria listed for Atypical Depression must be in addition to the criteria for a Depressive Disorder.

The "With Atypical Features" specifier mainly stands in contrast to the "With Melancholic Features" specifier. It should not be used if the patient meets the criteria for "With Melancholic Features":



For reference, these are the criteria for a Major Depressive Episode:



A Major Depressive Disorder, then, is the presence of one or more Major Depressive Episodes. It may be classified as either single-episode (296.2X) or recurrent (296.3X). A Major Depressive Disorder should have one of these mandatory specifiers: Mild, Moderate, Severe Without Psychotic Features, Severe With Psychotic Features. Additionally, it may have several optional specifiers: Chronic, With Catatonic Features, With Melancholic Features, With Atypical Features, With Postpartum Onset. Catatonic, Melancholic, and Atypical are mutually exclusive. The Chronic specifier requires that the full criteria for a Major Depressive Episode be met continuously for at least 2 years. It can also have the In Partial Remission or In Full Remission specifier depending on the age of the last Major Depressive Episode.

Dysthymic Disorder is essentially a less severe, but chronic version of a Major Depressive Episode. The criteria for Dysthymic Disorder (300.4) are:



Dysthemic Disorder should be classified as either Early Onset (age <21) or Late Onset (age >= 21). As with a Major Depressive Disorder, it may receive the With Atypical Features specifier, however it does not permit the Catatonic, Melancholic, or Postpartum specifiers. It also doesn't permit the Chronic specifier, merely because Dysthymic Disorder is inherently chronic.

In any case, it's important to realize that the DSM-IV criteria are only a portion of the full DSM-IV description for each disorder. This leaves out a lot of important information included in the Diagnostic Features, Associated Features and Disorders, Specific Age and Gender Features, Prevalence, Course, Familial Pattern, and (perhaps most importantly) the Differential Diagnosis sections.

Even if you do have the full DSM-IV available, I have to give the usual caveats about the dangers of self-diagnosis. As well, the DSM-IV is an important resource and set of guidelines, but it's not the sum entirety of mental health or the practice of psychiatry.

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Sail forth! steer for the deep waters only!
Reckless, O soul, exploring, I with thee, and thou with me;
For we are bound where mariner has not yet dared to go,
And we will risk the ship, ourselves and all.

We're all depressed. Learn to live with it.

While I don't battle depression (I'm just a naturally feel good, happy type person) I to have to deal with mild to moderate Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD). It manifests in a variety of ways for me, but is typically the root of all conflict and unhappiness in my life.

We had an interesting Thanksgiving as both my younger and my older brother were visiting. We had a number of discussions which also covered my "gift" (of OCD). Fortunately, it's not life controlling for me, but something I have to self-monitor.

The biggest manifestation is in daily routines and specifically when things minutely alter or change them. A big change is not a problem, especially when I know something is going to be different, but minor changes can cause inordinate amounts of stress and consternation.


What's this have to do with depression? Probably not much, but it does seem like a thread where people are admitting to their faults and describing how they deal with them in hopes others can deal with theirs as well.

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Gorse

One of the major difficulties with mood disorders is that the symptoms are all things which everyone has experienced to one degree or another. It isn't like a delusional disorder, for instance. Truly delusional thinking (i.e. when we're not using the word hyperbolically) is not something that most of us have experience with. It isn't "normal", and therefore we find it easy to delineate between those who have it and those who don't. Depression, like manic disorders and anxiety disorders represents an excess of something which is otherwise a normal part of human experience.

Andrew Solomon wrote in "The Noonday Demon":


Anyone who has experienced major depression will recognize what Solomon is talking about. Everyone experiences symptoms of depression, but not everyone is depressed. Except in some specific circumstances like post-partum onset depression, you cannot pinpoint a precise time that you crossed over that threshold into depression, but you know when you've been there, and you know that it isn't "normal".

Nothing that you experience is, in and of itself "abnormal", but it there comes a point at which these things take on a life apart from yourself that is utterly alien and foreign. It thrives, as he described, on thin air, existing without cause, purpose, or reason and feeding on seemingly nothing.

"Tumbleweed distress" is apt analogy, but so is the image of vine that Solomon uses elsewhere -- a choking, alien thing that keeps on drawing your life out of you even when there seems to be nothing left to give it. You sense these leaves that are not your leaves, moods that are not your moods. And yet from a distance, you cannot see the vine from yourself. The entanglement of depression with personality and identity is perhaps one of its most vexing characteristics. What is normal and what is not? "Normal is a word that haunts depressives."

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Sail forth! steer for the deep waters only!
Reckless, O soul, exploring, I with thee, and thou with me;
For we are bound where mariner has not yet dared to go,
And we will risk the ship, ourselves and all.