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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:39 pm 
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Warner Bros. Home Entertainment Group and Netflix, Inc. (Nasdaq: NFLX) today announced a new agreement that will extend the current 28-day sales-only window to 56 days for Theatrical New Release and made-for-video titles on DVD and Blu-ray Disc.

"Since we implemented a 28-day window for subscription and kiosk, we have seen very positive results with regard to our sell-through business," said Mark Horak, president, Warner Home Video North America. "One of the key initiatives for Warner Bros. is to improve the value of ownership for the consumer and the extension of the rental window – along with our support of UltraViolet – is an important piece of that strategy."

Warner Bros. is balancing its home entertainment revenue streams by creating different times at which a product is available at different prices. A staggered schedule allows the Studio to maximize the sales potential of its theatrical new release titles and VOD offerings.

"Netflix wants to ensure members have continued secure access to Warner Bros. DVDs and Blu-ray discs and, as such, is accepting the 56 day holdback," said Netflix Vice President of Content Anna Lee.

The new agreement was announced at the annual Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas, Nev. in conjunction with an annual event held by the Digital Entertainment Group.


This is my favorite part - "Netflix wants to ensure members have continued secure access to Warner Bros. DVDs and Blu-ray discs and, as such, is accepting the 56 day holdback," said Netflix Vice President of Content Anna Lee.

I like the idea that there are people that didn't go see it in the theater, but if they have to wait 1-2 months to see it once it's on disc THAT'S JUST TOO LONG, MUST GO PURCHASE. You've already waited, people! Also, have to love their little ad for Ultraviolet in there. Everything I've heard about that service is that it's an absolute nightmare.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:46 pm 
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I like UltraViolet. It's like Steam for movies. Redeem a code, and you can stream the movie to any device (computer, set-top box, iPhone/iPad, etc.), or you can download a copy to a device for travel.

The window thing is idiotic, though.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:47 pm 
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Netflix needs to come up with a way to DL a whole movie to a portable device rather than just streaming.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:49 pm 
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If you buy a BluRay or DVDs that have a UV logo, you'll be able to watch it instantly on any UV-capable device – for example, stopping off at a mate's house on the way home, even if he doesn't have a BluRay player. The optical media you've just bought becomes your instant backup disc. Or, if you go down the streaming route, you'll be able to burn movies to a DVD if you wish – "unlimited copies" are going to be approved.

You pay only for what you use, and you'll never lose anything. Six users can share a single UV account, and there is a cap of 12 devices per account, apparently, which is not a problem for most people but might cause ruction in houses with teenagers.

While the music industry used DRM as a nuisance mechanism, creating artificial friction, UV uses it to allow you to do things you couldn't do before. Or at least, that's the design goal: trying to take the friction out of watching movies on digital equipment. This is smart; instead of trying to prevent copying, it's designed to take away most of the necessity of making copies - the personal freedom to watch something anywhere. "You may have kids away at school, or other relatives living with you or elsewhere," the UV blurb promises, so you can "buy" them a rental they can watch anywhere. The goal is growing the market.


http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/06/01 ... iolet_wtf/


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:15 pm 
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Sorry, I should've been more complete in my statement.

The things I've heard from people who have tried to actually use the service, as well as forum posts and news articles are the sources I was talking about saying it sucks.

Hollywood flubs movie system launch, miffs users - 12/8/11 - http://www.mercurynews.com/entertainment/ci_19499878

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UltraViolet, the industry's latest scheme to promote movie ownership, attempts to make DVDs and Blu-rays more attractive by offering consumers the option of receiving a digital copy of a movie they buy on disc. Those digital versions, of course, are more versatile than discs, and -- in theory at least -- can be placed on mobile phones and tablet devices.
But it took two weeks for Heath Parks, a 43-year-old technology buff in Cincinnati, to get UltraViolet to work, even after exchanging emails with Flixster CEO Joe Greenstein.
Parks says it would have been easier to use unlicensed software to copy "Green Lantern" from the discs himself.
"I could have ripped it. I could have done any of this stuff. The point is I didn't want to do that," he says in an interview. "My personal feeling is they rushed the service out. I don't think it's ready."
Warner Bros. declined comment to The Associated Press.


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Among thousands of posts about UltraViolet on social media sites in the weeks following the Oct. 11 launch, only 3 percent of comments were positive, according to Fizziology, a company that tracks buzz related to Hollywood movie releases. About 17 percent were negative and the rest were neutral. That's on par with the worst product receptions the firm has ever seen.


http://gigaom.com/video/ultraviolet-bad-reviews/

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After creating accounts for both Flixster and Ultraviolet, [sic] linking the accounts, enabling WB to view my personal information, the system hangs and doesn’t download the movie. I contacted Ultraviolet first with the issues and error messages. After a day, I was told this is not an Ultraviolet issue, but a Flixster problem. I then contacted Flixster. They responded by sending me to the FAQ. To date, I have not gotten a proper response from Flixster on the error messages. I plan on canceling both accounts and will NEVER buy another DVD tied to Ultraviolet.


Random post I found interesting:
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Guess what… Ultraviolet sucks. Wanna know why? Over Christmas I was given a Blu-ray of “Crazy Stupid Love” as a gift. Noticing it came with an Ultraviolet digital copy, I was intrigued and was willing to sign up and give the digital cloud based system a try… Until I read the fine print. The movie has unlimited playable on the Ultraviolet system for only three years, after that, YOU HAVE TO PAY FOR IT… AGAIN!!! What kind of bullshit is that. How is getting a digital copy that you will eventually have to pay again a value? It’s a total rip off. I will not use the UV service. I can play a DVD or a Blu-ray as many times as I want. Thanks, but no thanks.


I guess that 3% positive may be why I've never seen a single positive comment about it (other than yours). Are you currently using it FS?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:42 pm 
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Waiting isn't a problem. When they are putting them in Redbox right away, you're being disenenguous about your motives.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 2:11 pm 
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Rorinthas wrote:
Waiting isn't a problem. When they are putting them in Redbox right away, you're being disenenguous about your motives.


I believe Redbox is currently doing the 28 day wait, and I'm assuming the next time they have to re-negotiate with WB their wait will be bumped as well. Unless WB is making more money off Redbox. Or owns stock in them. Or just want to screw Netflix over. Any of these things are possible.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 2:21 pm 
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http://news.cnet.com/8301-13506_3-57353 ... -for-dvds/

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:17 am 
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Amusing.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:31 am 
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I'm a firm believer that the all at once model is really the best for the studios and the fans. I think if people could have it in their home on day one less people would pirate less movies.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:08 am 
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Rorinthas wrote:
I'm a firm believer that the all at once model is really the best for the studios and the fans. I think if people could have it in their home on day one less people would pirate less movies.


So...more people would pirate more movies?

:)

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:01 pm 
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I think some people pirate movies because they can't/won't go to the big screen and then don't want to wait for the DVD release to rent or buy it.

If there was a competitive, viable, in home pay per view option for first run movies, I think more people would avail themselves of legitimate options.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:04 pm 
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Oh wait that was a grammar retort.... Less people would pirate movies, and in smaller numbers.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 10:40 am 
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Meh, personally with the economy like it is, I don't go to the theater much anymore. Their prices have gotten ridiculous, and I have way more important things to spend my money on, i.e. food. That also means I rarely have enough money to shell out $20+ for a DVD/Blu-Ray, especially for a movie I haven't already seen and know I will like.

I'm a movie buff, I used to go to opening night movies quite a bit, but due to the circumstances I stated above, I usually have to wait till Netflix gets the movie, then if I really like it, it goes into my list of movies to buy when the price drops ($5 walmart bin). Sucks for the movie industry, but they need to realize that until the economy comes back their numbers are going to continue to slump no matter what they do. Pissing their customers off is only going to hurt them in the long run. I'd love to see a boycott of WB films until this is repealed.

On the bright side, 56 day wait will just mean I'll find the movies I want to buy in the $5 bin that much quicker after they come out on Netflix.

Also, just wanted to note that the UltraViolet crap pisses me off. Just an excuse to charge you more to be able to take advantage of rights you already have by purchasing the DVD/Blu-Ray to begin with.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:59 am 
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I am not sure what the point is of the industry ignoring the obvious fact that regardless of whatever rules they fruitlessly try to enforce, nothing will stem the tide of file sharing.

It's all free. You want people to buy it? Include something fun that downloading doesn't get you. Fancy maps, books, posters, collectibles of some kind. Otherwise, you aren't providing any value, no tangible reason to buy. Make it more expensive, or less convenient, and you just push more people toward piracy.

I still see most movies I really want to see at the theater because there is a tangible, real reason to want to do so. It's more than the big screen or the 3D gimmick...there's an atmosphere to it, going out and seeing something in a theater has an appeal that home theaters can never replace. But buying the blu-rays? yeah, no.

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Last edited by Talya on Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:01 pm 
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Talya wrote:
I am not sure what the point is of the industry ignoring the obvious fact that regardless of whatever laws or rules they fruitlessly try to enforce, nothing will stem the tide of file sharing.

It's all free. You want people to buy it? Include something fun that downloading doesn't get you. Fancy maps, books, posters, collectibles of some kind. Otherwise, you aren't providing any value, no tangible reason to buy.

You like to steal, we get it. You can stop chiming in on these threads :P

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:03 pm 
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Hopwin wrote:
You like to steal, we get it. You can stop chiming in on these threads :P

Copyright infringement is not theft - not legally (where it's more akin to trespassing), and not conceptually (where Copyright is garbage creation of artificial value by arbitrary thought policing). Don't buy into the hype from the RIAA/MPAA.

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But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:07 pm 
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Talya wrote:
Hopwin wrote:
You like to steal, we get it. You can stop chiming in on these threads :P

Copyright infringement is not theft - not legally (where it's more akin to trespassing), and not conceptually (where Copyright is garbage creation of artificial value by arbitrary thought policing). Don't buy into the hype from the RIAA/MPAA.

It has nothing to do with the RIAA/MPAA. Someone else made it and my personal morality tells me that they deserve to make their money off it. You can quibble and mince words to get to your happy place but the bottom line is that people who invest their hearts and souls into the things they create are being robbed of the fruits of their efforts by you.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:12 pm 
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Hopwin wrote:
It has nothing to do with the RIAA/MPAA. Someone else made it and my personal morality tells me that they deserve to make their money off it. You can quibble and mince words to get to your happy place but the bottom line is that people who invest their hearts and souls into the things they create are being robbed of the fruits of their efforts by you.

So I'm going and taking the money other people gave them?

You cannot steal potential profit. Theft requires both taking something someone owns and depriving them of the thing taken. For example, if I steal a car, I'm depriving someone of it. If I find a way to duplicate a car, I am not depriving anyone of anything.

I cannot take their steal their rights to the IP in question, and I cannot deprive them of access to it. There's nothing being stolen. They can't claim any right to my money, they've never owned my money. Ever watch a friend's DVD or blu-ray which you haven't purchased yourself? If so, you're a hypocrite for condemning file sharing, because it's exactly. the same. thing.

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But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:25 pm 
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But you can't claim any right to their IP, either, Taly. That's the whole point. Saying they never owned your money is one thing, and valid. But then turning around and getting indignant when they seek to deprive you of their information because they never owned your money is the height of hypocrisy.

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Last edited by Kaffis Mark V on Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:27 pm 
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Talya wrote:
Hopwin wrote:
It has nothing to do with the RIAA/MPAA. Someone else made it and my personal morality tells me that they deserve to make their money off it. You can quibble and mince words to get to your happy place but the bottom line is that people who invest their hearts and souls into the things they create are being robbed of the fruits of their efforts by you.

So I'm going and taking the money other people gave them?

You cannot steal potential profit. Theft requires both taking something someone owns and depriving them of the thing taken. For example, if I steal a car, I'm depriving someone of it. If I find a way to duplicate a car, I am not depriving anyone of anything.

I cannot take their steal their rights to the IP in question, and I cannot deprive them of access to it. There's nothing being stolen. They can't claim any right to my money, they've never owned my money. Ever watch a friend's DVD or blu-ray which you haven't purchased yourself? If so, you're a hypocrite for condemning file sharing, because it's exactly. the same. thing.


Good point, go to France pull down the Mona Lisa; Xerox it and leave the copy pinned to the wall. Same thing right? Copiers now have the resolution to replicate it to an almost atomic level. No harm, no foul?

Artists are paid a fee upfront and collect residuals from every sale so yes you are in fact stealing money from them. Your example of borrowing a DVD is nonsense. Are you going to conflate your example to "if you sit next to your friend and watch a DVD they purchased with them it is stealing"?

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:31 pm 
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Hopwin wrote:
Good point, go to France pull down the Mona Lisa; Xerox it and leave the copy pinned to the wall.


Hopwin, you realize it's actually legal to duplicate the Mona Lisa? (So long as you don't present it as the original, which would be forgery.)

Kaffis Mark V wrote:
But you can't claim any right to their IP, either, Taly. That's the whole point. Saying they never owned your money is one thing, and valid. But then turning around and getting indignant when they seek to deprive you of their information because they never owned your money is the height of hypocrisy.



I claim no "right" to their IP. I'm not screaming foul when I can't find a decent rip online. I'm not demanding the studios unencrypt their IP and place it available for download on their website. No such "right" exists.

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But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
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Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 1:36 pm 
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But you are screaming foul when they want to tell you you don't have a right to decrypt it, and they want to punish that behavior (that's not a right, by the way).

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 2:09 pm 
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Kaffis Mark V wrote:
But you are screaming foul when they want to tell you you don't have a right to decrypt it, and they want to punish that behavior (that's not a right, by the way).


Positive vs. negative rights...big difference.

If you have to make a rule saying you don't have a right to decrypt something, the real problem is your encryption doesn't work, so you're artificially trying to limit people from breaking it.

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But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2012 2:30 pm 
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Talya wrote:
I still see most movies I really want to see at the theater because there is a tangible, real reason to want to do so. It's more than the big screen or the 3D gimmick...there's an atmosphere to it, going out and seeing something in a theater has an appeal that home theaters can never replace. But buying the blu-rays? yeah, no.


Trust me, I have a nice Home Theater setup that I have put together slowly, but I still prefer the experience of the theater. It's just not in the budget right now.

Also, wanted to clarify, my final statement earlier is in regards to paying extra for the right to have a digital copy of the movie I just bought. I should be able to make my own digital copy to use on my ipad, laptop, whatever, as long as I'm not selling it.


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