The Glade 4.0

Is Detroit really that bad?

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The U. S. Constitution doesn't guarantee happiness, only the pursuit of it. You have to catch up with it yourself. B. Franklin

"A mind needs books like a sword needs a whetstone." -- Tyrion Lannister, A Game of Thrones

Yes it is.

Granted, some of my friends tell me I am silly and that it is a nice place to go for a day. Just don't be on the streets after dark.

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Raell Kromwell

If it is your first gun then go with something inexpensive until you know you will stick with it. If you are going to own a firearm you should practice regularly, so before you make a investment find out if it is an activity you will want to do.

I am not a fan of Ruger's at all but that is my preference I know some people that like them.

Look for a cheap Hi Point 9mm to start you can get one for under $150 it isn't great and they are heavy but they shoot well. They do have a lifetime warranty though so if you ever have an issue with it you can send it in and they will fix it no problem.

In the 9mm category my preferences in order are Glock, Beretta, Sig and Walther

If you are going to carry then get used to shooting first then look into what feels best to you.

For home defense a shotgun is always a good choice to have on hand.

I have 15 different guns and they all have their place, but I also used to shoot in competition and have been shooting since I was 8 years old, so the collection grows over time.

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I met this six-year-old child, with this blank, pale, emotionless face and, the blackest eyes... the devil's eyes. I spent eight years trying to reach him, and then another seven trying to keep him locked up because I realized what was living behind that boy's eyes was purely and simply... evil

Alright I'm planning a trip to the range this weekend in aims of trying the following:

1) Glock 17
2) Sig P226
3) Beretta 92FS
4) H&K P2000
5) Springfield XD
6) Ruger P95
7) Hi-Point C9

Any other last minute semi-auto 9mm recommendations?

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Anything 9x33mmR is still my suggestion.

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+1

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"Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko

Since someone asked through another avenue of contact ...

9mm is pretty vague. For those of you who are reading but not really following the conversation, 9mm is probably the most popular diameter for a handgun bullet, not to be confused with cartridge, in the world. Most of the firearms discussed in this thread are 9mm Parabellum, which gained popularity due to its adoption by German security and police forces as their default load during the 1970s. It was developed to provide more stopping power than .380ACP (the Walther PPK being the most well known firearm in this caliber for obvious reasons). The .38 SP and .357 are revolver loads and thus have rimmed cartridges, unlike your ACP rounds. Some ACP rounds have detentions in their brass so you can use a retention clip and fire them through appropriately chambered revolvers, but that's not really an issue here.

9x19mm Parabellum is what Hopwin wants.

9x33mmR is a much beefier load with a larger powder charge behind it, hence the longer brass and more effective impact force.

9x33mmR is .357 Magnum. It is a child load developed from a slightly modified .38SP case (9.1x29.5mmR). The case is about an 1/8" longer than the .38 Brass to prevent .357s from being loaded into flimsier .38s. The issue here is discharge pressure: the .357 Magnum obviously produces a lot more discharge pressure than the .38 Special. So, to solve the pistol problem, S/W developed new cylinders and slightly heavier revolvers to compensate for the load change. As such, all .357 Magnum pistols can fire .38SP rounds; .38SP revolvers cannot fire .357 rounds.

Now, just as an example, this can get more complex when you have things like .357 Sig, 9mm Steyr, 9mm Mauser Pistol (**** you Han Solo) ...

Most of these bullets are only fractionally different in lead and loads, but they will not fire through guns not designed for them.

Both will kill you.

The only gun I'd add to your list is the aforementioned Walther PPK despite shooting .380ACP. It's smaller than the various 9mm Parabellum pistols you mention, and you can find them with full stainless construction in the $550 range. You can even get some of the arguably superior pre-S/W pistols in very good condition for that price.

And, that reminds me ...

While cartridge availability might be an issue, .357 Sig is a fantastic load.

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Ohio folk, I know you need a permit for concealed carry, but what about to buy a handgun?

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No permit is needed for purchase. I don't recall what the law is on waiting periods.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Nice. Thanks!

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There is no permit needed (unless for CC) and there is no waiting period. They have the "instant" background check which you fill out a form and it takes about 5 - 10 minutes and your out the door. Although that is if you go to a store. You can also go to one of the many gun shows or even find a private seller and bypass the check if you really want to.

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I met this six-year-old child, with this blank, pale, emotionless face and, the blackest eyes... the devil's eyes. I spent eight years trying to reach him, and then another seven trying to keep him locked up because I realized what was living behind that boy's eyes was purely and simply... evil

I would recommend against anything chambered in .357 Sig. I have a conversion barrel from EFK Fire Dragon for my XD40 and while the round is quite brisk and tests show it offers considerable stopping power, it just is too expensive. I buy 125gr load, JHP Federal rounds for about $41/50. .40 S&W, .45ACP and 9x19 Parabellum are all superior rounds in terms of their overall economics vs. technical performance. You're also more likely to encounter them making shopping for them less of a pain in the ***.

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"It's real, grew up in trife life, the times of white lines
The hype vice, murderous nighttimes and knife fights invite crimes" - Nasir Jones

I wouldn't recommend anything in .357 Sig to a first time buyer, mostly for the reasons you mention; that said, it's still a fantastic load.

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Open Carry is also legal without a permit in Ohio; however, many in law enforcement and the general public don't know this, and you could be asking for harassment should you carry in that manner.


RE: The Judge. It's an eminently fun weapon to shoot, but with an effective range of about 8 feet, I see little to no value in it.

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

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Very nice.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

G-19 looks like? Congrats.

Get ye to the range and run a few hundred rounds through it to get comfortable with it and then get some training on grip, stance, and the legalities of self defense use of deadly force in your area.

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"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville

17. I took the course last week but I do need to get to the range and as you put it, send a few hundred rounds down range

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Btw Khross, I just sold a 1930 S&W 38/44 HD that was in my collection. Since you have a good knownledge of the 357 round I'm sure you know where this fits in.

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History of the Condom
In 1272, the Muslim Arabs invented the condom, using a goat's lower intestine.
In 1873, the British somewhat refined the idea, by taking the intestine out of the goat first.

Speaking of handguns, anyone got a line on what a new 4" S&W M27 would run me? Based on the shops I visited and some online retailers, looks like $800 with no options.

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"It's real, grew up in trife life, the times of white lines
The hype vice, murderous nighttimes and knife fights invite crimes" - Nasir Jones

for new probably about right on that price.
used might save you a bit.
do have have bass pro and or cabellas near you, if you do you can play a bid game with them to see who will cut to the lowest price.

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History of the Condom
In 1272, the Muslim Arabs invented the condom, using a goat's lower intestine.
In 1873, the British somewhat refined the idea, by taking the intestine out of the goat first.

Leshani:

How much better was its replacement?

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Speaking of things that go bang Or... pfft, as the case may be

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Holy shitsnacks!

...

Someone who is not me will tell you why you just got ellipsed, Arafys ...

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replacement was more than one
Citori 20 gauge for my Daughter
and a Colt gold cup Trophy for my self

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History of the Condom
In 1272, the Muslim Arabs invented the condom, using a goat's lower intestine.
In 1873, the British somewhat refined the idea, by taking the intestine out of the goat first.