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 Post subject: Guild Wars 2
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 11:19 am 
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Anyone else following it?

Good article on the Devs claim to have removed the Holy Trinity and their idea for combat:

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We here at ArenaNet just went through a round of interviews telling people about this exciting new Guild Wars 2 profession, the guardian. Not many of those conversations go by without someone wondering aloud if the guardian breaks the paradigm we set to create—a game without the Holy Trinity.

“So much for no Holy Trinity,” we’d hear. “Guardian is a paladin, dedicated healer, monk, tank…”

These folks are followers of the MMORPG genre who don’t get their hands on Guild Wars 2 every day, so I can’t say that I blame them. After all, what do they have to go on? Some things we said five months ago? A few anecdotes? The insistence of a few dedicated fans who defend us in forum threads?

In each interview we try to sprinkle in as much stuff as we can to support our ideas, but when this information isn’t all in one place it loses its weight and impact a bit. So I thought, why not collect all this information in one place?

It’s been a while since I wrote the GW2 healing and death article and frankly that article was a lot harder to write when the only profession examples I could use were the warrior and the elementalist.

I said something to Isaiah Cartwright the other day that has stuck in my mind since then. I think it explains how no trinity is possible more than anything else, so I’ll relay it here: “Our professions aren’t dedicated healers, DPS, or tanks because frankly, we built a combat system that just doesn’t allow it.”

Many interviewers wonder if we are worried about making such a radical change, but to me the whole thing is just common sense for what we are trying to accomplish. I’d be a lot more worried about building GW2 combat with trinity professions than without them. I don’t want to speak for other games or other combat systems, but this system is just better for our game.


So what features of the combat system encourage this profession design? The answer to that is, “lot of things,” so let’s talk about them one at a time.

Healing Skill slot

Everyone has a dedicated slot on their skill bar where they must place a healing skill. These vary greatly and are an intimate part of the Guild Wars 2 build-making process, but ultimately they are your most efficient and reliable way to sustain yourself in battle. Why did we do this? Because we think it is a more interesting way to create sustained encounters for solo players AND groups while keeping players focused on themselves and their surroundings.

Downed, defeated, and revival

The downed system creates combat situations where fallen allies (and enemies in PvP) are actual strategic locations in a battle. It means that situations can change quickly and players must react to them. From level 1, every profession has the ability to revive everyone else. This means that players don’t have to rely on one profession in case someone is defeated both during and after combat. I said that the healing skill was the most effective way to keep you going in a fight, which it is. However, in a party, what is more awesome than being able to revive someone who was defeated and doing nothing back to being a contributing member of the group again? We did this because it makes combat more dynamic and social—two of the main goals of Guild Wars 2.

Shared boon system

The basic buff system in Guild Wars 2 is a set of ally-friendly buffs that we call boons. There are seven“…We built this game so that they professions act as play styles, not as roles…” boons: Regeneration, Might, Fury, Swiftness, Protection, Vigor, and Aegis. With the exception of the Aegis boon, these are available to different professions on different weapons and skills. Their duration stacks but their effectiveness does not stack, so two players using Regeneration boon are equally effective putting health regeneration on allies. This system allows us to simplify the buff system while also making everyone similarly effective when trying to do something that the system handles. The duration stacking also means that you can’t overdo something, but you also aren’t ever wasting a boon when stacking it.

For example, if you put 10 seconds of regeneration on an ally and they already has 5 seconds of regeneration remaining, they will now have a total of 15 seconds of regeneration. More overall health, but not any more efficient.

No allied targeting

This is one of the big ones. There are no skills that specifically target allies. Everything must be done using positioning, ground targeting or other unconventional methods. This keeps every profession focused on their allies in the world, which adds a tactical complexity to the combat. Instead of watching red bars, we want you to watch your allies in the world. Making sure you are dropping ground-targeted spells effectively and moving into position to block attacks on allies is how we want players to defend each other.

Diversity

Being able to adapt to situations is something that we feel makes combat more exciting. In Guild Wars 2, the combination of weapon swapping and skill versatility give each profession the ability to adapt to combat situations and change their role. Taking too much damage as a warrior? Swap to mace and shield. A bunch of adds as an elementalist? Attune to fire. Even within single skills we try and maintain versatility. A guardian that brings Wall of Deflection or an elementalist with Swirling Aura can use them to defend allies when retreating. They can also use it to push into enemy lines, or they can cast it in a timely manner to counter a particularly dangerous enemy projectile and send the effects of that projectile back to the attacker. Being able to rotate roles and cover for other players is another piece in the puzzle to removing dependencies.

Mobility

Another important part of Guild Wars 2 combat is mobility. We felt that in order to get the dynamic and visceral feel that we wanted combat to have, players needed to be more mobile. A lot of work went into this from animation systems to animations themselves allowing skills while moving. It takes a lot of pressure off of the skill system and puts in back into movement, tactical play, and ground control—the areas where we wanted the game to be focused. Couple that with dodging arrows and double tap dodge rolling and you create a combat system that is more like a first person shooter where finding real cover, flanking and other more realistic fighting techniques find a lot more use. This again de-emphasizes the importance of roles and focuses players on what we intend, which is how their profession plays.


We’ve said this a few times in a few places but I can’t reiterate it enough: We built this game so that they professions act as play styles, not as roles. Each profession can support, control, and do damage. We believe that this creates more dynamic combat and more distinct professions because there are more play styles than roles.

One of the best ways to explain this is with an analogy. In a first person shooter there can be a variety of weapons, from sniper rifles to rocket launchers to machine guns and shotguns. No one looks at these weapons and says, “They’re all the same, they all just do DPS.” Why should an MMO be any different?

That is why we want to eliminate things that we felt were burdens on the game such as:

Group LF Healer/Tank…
Party wipes when you lose the wrong person.
Watching the interface instead of the world.
Playing with people because you have to, not because you want to.
Being stuck in the same combat patterns over and over again.

Anyway, I hope this gives everyone a little bit of insight into the combat of Guild Wars 2, the removal of the Holy Trinity, and profession roles.


http://www.arena.net/blog/jon-peters-talks-combat

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 12:37 pm 
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I've been following it for several months now. If they are able to actually successfully impliment even half of their more lofty goals/claims, it will be a game changing MMO.

I'm eagerly awaiting an open beta.


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:32 pm 
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World Vrs World = DAOC 2.0

Cant wait to see how this turns out: http://www.arena.net/blog/mike-ferguson ... d-vs-world

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 7:31 pm 
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I will be playing this for sure. And it's the first game in a few years that my wife has been interested in playing, so that will be cool.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 7:34 pm 
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http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/arch ... rsion.aspx

Wonder if they will be separate? Still, Guild Wars 2 looks fun to dick around in like I did in the original, but I don't see any lasting appeal.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 9:03 pm 
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Beta sign-ups are open for ~the next 48 hours only.

https://beta.guildwars2.com/


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:49 pm 
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Signed up. Cant wait to play.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 10:18 am 
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Well, a million people signed up for Beta. Not good odds.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 8:29 pm 
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Its fantasy. I'm tired of fantasy.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 8:41 am 
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I agree with that, but I'm more tired of grinding, raiding, LF Tank then GTG!! LF Healer then GTG! and WoW clones. More excited about the combat! looks great.

Plus no subscription, how could you not buy it?!

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:20 pm 
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Müs wrote:
Its fantasy. I'm tired of fantasy.


For some reason the MMO genre seems to work better for me in a Fantasy setting.

But as Dash said, the combat system is what is really intriguing me. SW is very quickly losing it's lustre because of all the minor annoying things many of which are combat related.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 7:13 pm 
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End of March for the next beta:

https://twitter.com/#!/GuildWars2/st...63356029157376

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Hi folks, just to confirm, the sign ups last week are for a chance at the next (end of march) and following beta events for #GuildWars2 ~AT

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:56 am 
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Pre-orders available April 10th.

Pre-order customers will have access to ALL beta events.

https://buy.guildwars2.com/


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2
PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:49 am 
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Yeah I'm in, April 10th for pre purchase. They are saying Beta test late this month, which is invite only, then if you pre purchase you get into all following Betas. Starting late April and occurring about once a month. Not sure where that puts release.

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/forum/pre-purchase-guild-wars-2-t31280.html?p=1212248#post1212248

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What do I get with a Pre-Purchase of the game?
Customers who pre-purchase the game in full will enjoy guaranteed access to our Beta Weekend Events, three-day Headstart Access to the final game, and five digital items designed to enhance your gameplay experience.

What if I don’t want to pay in full in advance?
In addition to Pre-Purchase, a number of our retail partners are offering a Pre-Order program. Customers who pre-order will receive one-day Headstart Access to the final game.

When do Beta Weekend Events (BWEs) start, and how many will there be?
The first BWE is currently planned for late April, and we expect to have one every month or so. The schedule is subject to change and will be confirmed at a later date. Currently, we do not know how many of these events we will have.

Is Pre-Purchase the only way to get into Guild Wars 2 Beta Weekend Events?
Pre-Purchase is the only guaranteed way to get into all Beta Weekend Events. We will also be running promotions for access to individual Beta Weekend Events.

I already signed up for the Guild Wars 2 Beta. Do I need to Pre-Purchase?
If you want to get guaranteed access to all Beta Weekend Events, yes, you must Pre-Purchase. Simply signing up for the Beta does not guarantee access to the Beta Weekend Events.

Which products are available for Pre-Purchase?
Customers will be able to Pre-Purchase the Guild Wars 2 Digital Edition and the Guild Wars 2 Digital Deluxe Edition directly from NCsoft. In addition to the digital products, certain retailers will also be offering physical Pre-Purchase of the Guild Wars 2 Standard Edition and the Guild Wars 2 Collector's Edition.

How does physical Pre-Purchase work?
Physical Pre-Purchase for Guild Wars 2 is only available at select retailers. The details of how this will work will differ slightly depending on which edition customers purchase and where they purchase it.

Standard Edition (North America) — Customers will buy the Standard Edition Pre-Purchase box and receive a Pre-Purchase serial code. They will then go to https://register.guildwars2.com and follow the on-screen instructions to create a Guild Wars 2 account and apply the serial code, which will give them access to Beta Weekend Events and three-day Headstart access to the final game. When Guild Wars 2 launches, customers will need to return to the retailer with proof of purchase to receive the full Standard Edition box and retail serial code. They will need to apply this retail serial code to their Guild Wars 2 account within five days to continue playing without interruption.

Standard Edition (Europe) — Customers will buy the Standard Edition Pre-Purchase box and receive their serial code. This is the only serial code customers will receive and will grant access to the Beta Weekend Events, three-day Headstart Access, the Hero's Band digital item, and full access to the final live game. Customers will not need to return to retail to receive another serial code.

Collector's Edition (North America and Europe) — Customers will buy the Collector's Edition Pre-Purchase box and receive a Pre-Purchase serial code. They will then go to https://register.guildwars2.com and follow the on-screen instructions to create a Guild Wars account and apply the serial code, which will give them access to Beta Weekend Events and three-day Headstart Access to the final game. When Guild Wars 2 launches, customers will need to return to their retailer with proof of purchase to receive the full Collector's Edition box with physical items and retail serial code. They will need to apply this retail serial code to their Guild Wars 2 account within five days to continue playing without interruption.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 8:26 am 
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Sweet. Two copies will be pre-purchased at our house. Probably dig-deluxe.

Hopefully, there's still a shot at a June/July release.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:52 pm 
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GW2 goes P2W?

http://my.mmosite.com/1cd10251c16a43d09 ... ef910.html

Not particularly promising.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2
PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 8:16 am 
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The only thing that raises an eyebrow for me are the top section of xp boosts. I can't say that I outright *hate* the thought of it being part of the final game, but if it were up to me I'd veto it. Most of the rest is fluffy and/or no different than stuff in the GW1 cash shop.

The currency in the cash shop is gems. You can trade the game currency, gold, for gems. So if you really wanted something in the cash shop, but didn't want to pay $ for it, you trade for some gems instead of buying them. I'll probably ignore 90% of the cash shop and if I can buy extra bank slots by trading gold for gems, that will be nice.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 8:55 am 
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Nothing pay to win there. You can buy anything with in game gold if you want. Personally I'm fine with spending the gold I farmed in rl rather than grind in game, especially since it's a no subscription model, but ymmv.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:10 am 
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Dash wrote:
Personally I'm fine with spending the gold I farmed in rl rather than grind in game, especially since it's a no subscription model, but ymmv.


This. As I get older (and make more money) I'm finding that I have more money than time available for something as trivial as a game.


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2
PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 10:42 am 
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Some fun WvW video:


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2
PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:48 pm 
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:02 pm 
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So... what's the appeal of Guild Wars? I bought the first ages ago, and just couldn't get into it. Perhaps it's because I'm a PvE person.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:13 pm 
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Neksar wrote:
So... what's the appeal of Guild Wars? I bought the first ages ago, and just couldn't get into it. Perhaps it's because I'm a PvE person.


It has no monthly subscription, basically. The storyline wasn't too bad, either. Certainly better than all other MMOs of its time, save for WoW. But yeah, once you finish up the story, there's very little keeping you playing unless you like PvP. I don't see that GW2 will be any different.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:50 am 
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Neksar wrote:
So... what's the appeal of Guild Wars? I bought the first ages ago, and just couldn't get into it. Perhaps it's because I'm a PvE person.


I dont feel like I can give a great answer, it's a lot of different stuff. Dynamic events, raid like encounters at all levels, skills based on weapons and class, dodge mechanic, no grinding, the artistic style, ability to visit people on any server you want. I personally am in it for the PvP on top of all that though.

I'd take a look at this:


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 Post subject: Guild Wars 2
PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 5:27 pm 
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No monthly subscription.
Allegedly no "Holy Trinity" or "I win" builds.

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