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 Post subject: Police Officers Executed
PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 5:37 pm 
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091129/ap_ ... icers_shot


4 police officers shot dead at Wash. coffeehouse

By GENE JOHNSON, Associated Press Writer Gene Johnson, Associated Press Writer – 51 mins ago

PARKLAND, Wash. – A gunman burst into a coffeehouse Sunday and opened fire on four police officers as they sat working on their laptops, killing the three men and one woman in what an official described as a targeted ambush.

Pierce County Sheriff's spokesman Ed Troyer said officers were looking for one male suspect who fled the scene and haven't ruled out an accomplice, possibly a getaway driver.

It wasn't clear whether the officers even had time to draw their weapons to return fire, Troyer said.

"This was more of an execution. Walk in with the specific mindset to shoot police officers," Troyer said.

Troyer said the officers — all from the Lakewood Police Department — were catching up on paperwork at the beginning of their shifts when they were attacked at 8:15 a.m. Sunday.

Troyer said the attack was clearly targeted at the officers, not a robbery gone bad.

"There were marked patrol cars outside and they were all in uniform," Troyer said.

With no known suspects, there was no indication of any connection with the Halloween night shooting of a Seattle police officer. The suspect in that shooting remains hospitalized.

"We won't know if it's a copycat effect or what it was until we get the case solved," Troyer said. "We don't even have a suspect ID right now."

Troyer would not release the names of the victims in Sunday's shooting. He said Lakewood has a small police force and the deaths represent a loss of 10 percent to 15 percent of the department.

Troyer estimates a couple hundred officers from the Washington State Patrol and multiple surrounding police agencies in the area are at the scene, with some coming on their own time.

"We have no motive at all," Troyer said. "I don't think when we find out what it is, it will be anything that makes any sense or be worth it."

Two employees and a few other customers were in the shop during the attack. All are being interviewed by the Pierce County Sheriff's investigators.

"Some are in shock. They are very upset," Troyer said. "They are the ones who are going to put together for us how this happened."

The Forza Coffee Shop, part of a popular local chain, is on a side street near McChord Air Force Base in Tacoma, about 35 miles south of Seattle. The shop is in a small retail center alongside two restaurants, a cigar store and a nail salon.

Brad Carpenter, founder and owner of Forza Coffee, said his staff was OK and being interviewed by police, and that his main concern was with the families of the police officers.

"I'm a retired police officer, so this really hits close to home for me," said Carpenter, of nearby Gig Harbor.

Troyer said the Lakewood officers were two blocks outside their jurisdiction, and the coffee shop was a popular place for officers from surrounding jurisdictions to meet and share information.

Streets around the coffee shop were blocked off late Sunday morning, and a police helicopter hovered over a large crowd of investigators. TV video showed police taking possession of a pickup truck parked in a grocery store in Parkland.

"We are looking at some people. We are looking at some cars. We are looking at some residences," Troyer said.

Troyer said investigators are checking surveillance video from multiple sources, trying to identify a possible getaway car. He urged people to stay away from scenes to avoid interfering and putting themselves at risk.

Dave Gabrielson, a clerk at Foot Mart about a block away from the coffee shop, told the newspaper all was quiet when he opened the store at 8 a.m. About 30 minutes later, "All of a sudden a million cops were zooming up and down the road," Gabrielson said.

He said he saw officers bring a police dog into a nearby apartment complex.

Last month, Seattle police officer Timothy Brenton was shot and killed Halloween night as he was sitting in a cruiser with trainee Britt Sweeney. Sweeney was grazed in the neck.

Authorities say the man charged with that shooting also firebombed four police vehicles in October as part of a "one-man war" against law enforcement. Christopher Monfort, 41, was arrested after being wounded in a firefight with police days after the Seattle shooting. He remains hospitalized in stable condition, the hospital said Sunday.

The officers killed Sunday were a patrol squad made up of three officers and their sergeant. No threats had been made against them or other officers in the region, sheriff's officials said. Their families have been notified.

"We lost people we care about. We're working to find out who did this and deal with him." Pierce County Sheriff Paul Pastor told reporters at the scene.

Washington Gov. Chris Gregoire said she was "shocked and horrified" by the killings.

"Our police put their lives on the line every day, and tragedies like this remind us of the risks they continually take to keep our communities safe," she said in a written statement. "My heart goes out to the family, friends and co-workers of these officers, as well as the entire law enforcement community."

At Rollies Tavern near the coffee house, the plasma TVs usually tuned to football had Northwest Cable News on. Three bar patrons live next door to the coffee house.

Jerry Arnold, 45, was in bed when he was awakened by sirens. He's lived there seven years and never seen anything close to Sunday's scene.

"I hope they get them. I can't sleep until they do," he said. "Those guys could be hiding in my backyard."

------------------------------------

Not sure what happened here, but I hope they catch the perpetrators quickly, and lock them away for life.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 6:40 pm 
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Thats awful.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 10:07 am 
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We were discussing this last night, and could only come up with 3 reasons..

1) Corrupt cops being targeted by those they are protecting or the rivals of those they are protecting.
2) All members of some undisclosed case or task force
3) Some mentally disturbed person decided that day was a good day to kill cops and picked that coffee house because of the visible presence of officers inside (we considered this one the most unlikely).


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 10:39 am 
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Let out on clemency. Very sad situation all around.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/l ... ght29.html

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Maurice Clemmons, the 37-year-old Tacoma man being sought for questioning in the killing this morning of four Lakewood police officers, has a long criminal record punctuated by violence, erratic behavior and concerns about his mental health.

Nine years ago, then-Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee granted clemency to Clemmons, commuting his lengthy prison sentence over the protests of prosecutors.

"This is the day I've been dreading for a long time," Larry Jegley, prosecuting attorney for Arkansas' Pulaski County said tonight when informed that Clemmons was being sought for questioning in connection with the killings.

Clemmons' criminal history includes at least five felony convictions in Arkansas and at least eight felony charges in Washington. The record also stands out for the number of times he has been released from custody despite questions about the danger he posed.

Huckabee, who ran for the Republican presidential nomination last year, issued a statement tonight calling the slaying of the police officers "a horrible and tragic event."

If Clemmons is found responsible, "it will be the result of a series of failures in the criminal justice system in both Arkansas and Washington State," Huckabee said.

He added that Clemmons' release from prison had been reviewed and approved by the Arkansas parole board.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:43 pm 
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Ladas wrote:
We were discussing this last night, and could only come up with 3 reasons..

1) Corrupt cops being targeted by those they are protecting or the rivals of those they are protecting.
2) All members of some undisclosed case or task force
3) Some mentally disturbed person decided that day was a good day to kill cops and picked that coffee house because of the visible presence of officers inside (we considered this one the most unlikely).


Actually number 3 is by far the most likely.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:47 pm 
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\second Diamondeye

The other scenarios sound like bad TV.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:48 pm 
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Increased violence against the executive officers of government is indicitive of dissatisfaction with said government.

That said, this is not a judgement statement, just a continued observation.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:50 pm 
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Rynar wrote:
Increased violence against the executive officers of government is indicitive of dissatisfaction with said government.

That said, this is not a judgement statement, just a continued observation.


A) That is not necessarily true.
B) There is no evidence of increased violence against the police, and even if there were, it is nowhere near high enough to establish any general dissatisfaction with the government.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:52 pm 
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I respectfully disagree.

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19 Yet she became more and more promiscuous as she recalled the days of her youth, when she was a prostitute in Egypt. 20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

Ezekiel 23:19-20 


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:57 pm 
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Rynar wrote:
I respectfully disagree.


That's quite obvious. In the meantime, however, I see no support for your position.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 8:00 pm 
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I see no support for yours.

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19 Yet she became more and more promiscuous as she recalled the days of her youth, when she was a prostitute in Egypt. 20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

Ezekiel 23:19-20 


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:02 pm 
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No support for either yet, still to early to tell. Other than to say this guy has a record, it seems premature to paint him as some upstanding citizen who just snapped at the oppressive regime of the police state.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:45 pm 
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Diamondeye wrote:
Rynar wrote:
Increased violence against the executive officers of government is indicitive of dissatisfaction with said government.

That said, this is not a judgement statement, just a continued observation.


A) That is not necessarily true.
B) There is no evidence of increased violence against the police, and even if there were, it is nowhere near high enough to establish any general dissatisfaction with the government.


The people executing police officers often haven't thought through the consequences of their actions enough to understand B, if that is indeed what they are trying to accomplish.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 1:31 am 
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He told his friends the day before to watch the news, because he was going to kill some cops. Apparently they didn't take him seriously.

He's also probably got the makings of a good insanity defense going (if he's still alive). His neighbors are all saying he's a great guy, except when he goes nuts and throws rocks through their windows and rapes their kids. They can hardly believe he'd do something as horrendous as murder 4 cops in cold blood.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:49 am 
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I dunno, raping their kids seems pretty horrendous. I think it's easily past the threshold in which I stop concerning myself with ranking acts of horror.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:12 am 
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Suspect in police killings shot dead

* Killing of Maurice Clemmons, 37, ends 2-day manhunt
* Clemmons was sought in the shooting deaths of 4 officers in coffee shop
* Clemmons is an ex-convict with a long rap sheet in Washington and Arkansas

Seattle, Washington (CNN) -- The man wanted in the fatal shooting of four police officers was shot and killed Tuesday in south Seattle after he challenged police who approached him, authorities said.

The Seattle police department confirmed to the Pierce County sheriff's office that Maurice Clemmons was killed in the shooting, sheriff's spokesman Ed Troyer said.

The shooting took place about 2 a.m. It ended a two-day manhunt for Clemmons, 37, that began Sunday after an ambush-style killing of four police officers from Lakewood, about 40 miles south of Seattle.

The slain officers were identified as Sgt. Mark Renninger, 39; Officer Ronald Owens, 37; Officer Tina Griswold, 40; and Officer Greg Richards, 42. All of them were parents and had been with the department since its inception.

Clemmons was an ex-convict with a long rap sheet in Washington and Arkansas, according to authorities and documents.

Witnesses say Clemmons was shot in the torso during the Sunday morning attack, and blood and gauze bandages were found in a truck linked to Clemmons, Troyer said.

Clemmons is thought to have slipped away from a home in Seattle's Leschi neighborhood Sunday night, before police surrounded the residence for about 12 hours. He was not found in the home when the investigators moved in Monday morning, Seattle police spokesman Jeff Kappel told reporters.

The night before the shootings, Clemmons had threatened to kill police officers, but witnesses did not report those threats until after the slayings, Troyer said on ABC's "Good Morning America."

Clemmons was accused of child rape and assaulting a police officer in May. He had been released on $150,000 bond five days before the shootings, according to court records.

After his arrest, Clemmons' sister told police that he "had not been himself lately" and that his behavior was "unpredictable and erratic."

"He had said that the Secret Service was coming to get him because he had written a letter to the president," an affidavit quoted her as telling investigators.

In addition, neighbors had complained that he had been throwing rocks through their windows.

In 2000, then-Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee commuted a 95-year prison sentence for Clemmons, according to documents from the Arkansas Department of Community Correction. He returned to prison in 2001 but was paroled in 2004.

"Should he be found responsible for this horrible tragedy, it will be the result of a series of failures in the criminal justice system in both Arkansas and Washington state," Huckabee's office said in a statement Sunday night.

Guess we'll never know if we was an upstanding citizen raging against a corrupt government or just a mentally disturbed person who decided that day was a good day to kill cops.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:21 am 
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Rynar wrote:
I see no support for yours.


My position is the negative; namely that the phenomenon you are claiming exist, have no evidence supporting them. How exactly would I provide supporting evidence for the lack of evidence for your positions, other than to point out the fact that you have none?

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:06 am 
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Kaffis Mark V wrote:
I dunno, raping their kids seems pretty horrendous. I think it's easily past the threshold in which I stop concerning myself with ranking acts of horror.


I fail at sarcasm.. sorry


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 12:18 pm 
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Rynar wrote:
Increased violence against the executive officers of government is indicitive of dissatisfaction with said government.

That said, this is not a judgement statement, just a continued observation.


You're going waaaaay out on a limb with that statement.

You are missing one key piece of evidence: the motive for the attacks.

I can think of one example of a situation where increased violence against the executive officers of government is indicative of dissatisfaction with the government - drug cartels in Mexico. As Mexico steps up enforcement, its approval increases, and so do attacks.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 12:41 pm 
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Midgen wrote:
Kaffis Mark V wrote:
I dunno, raping their kids seems pretty horrendous. I think it's easily past the threshold in which I stop concerning myself with ranking acts of horror.


I fail at sarcasm.. sorry

I blame the timestamp. My bad.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 12:42 pm 
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As far as motive, we're likely not to get to find out now, but my guess is elaborate suicide by cop manhunt.

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"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 12:57 pm 
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I don't think so.. based on what I'm hearing on the local news, this guy was a total loon. He told either friends or family members (the source wasn't made clear on the local broadcast) that they should watch the news the next morning.. this the day before he killed the 4 cops.

First and foremost, he should NOT have been on the streets. The justice/court systems failed miserably on multiple counts to properly handle this guy.

Besides having a lifetime criminal history starting at having a 100 year plus sentence in Arkansas when he was 16 years old, more recently, he had been accused of raping a 12yo female family member, and was out on $15k bond. I seriously question the judgement of those individuals who recommended and approved that bail. All of them should be disbarred.

While he was in jail on those charges, he threatened to kill the jail workers, claimed he was Jesus, that Obama was his brother, and Oprah was his sister.

He was given a Psych eval, which determined he was dangerous, but not enough so to forcibly commit on those grounds.

He was supposed to be wearing a GPS bracelet, which he had removed and left in his house.

The anti-gun crowd is having a nut over this.

It is all very depressing....


Last edited by Midgen on Tue Dec 01, 2009 1:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 1:09 pm 
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Midgen wrote:
The justice/court systems failed miserably on multiple counts to properly handle this guy.



Yeah ... what's new? I mean, we do have a system that is ultimately predicated on human judgment. The idea of "reasonability" is not concrete. Why is it so shocking that something like this would happen?

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 1:21 pm 
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The court system didn't fail. Then Arkansas-governor Mike Huckabee failed. He's the one that set in motion the parole and clemency for this whackjob, who otherwise would never have been released.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 1:39 pm 
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Talya wrote:
The court system didn't fail. Then Arkansas-governor Mike Huckabee failed. He's the one that set in motion the parole and clemency for this whackjob, who otherwise would never have been released.


Bull. You'd know Huckabee would be the one attacked. He gave a full explanation for what happened, including that officials said the sentence given was excessive for the crimes he'd been found guilty of at that time.

Funny it's not mentioned that the guy was out on bail of 15 grand after being charged with rape of a 12 year old (as well as another crime)in your post, Talya. The court system very well failed. But when you have an agenda, I suppose it's easy to ignore all that and go after the target you really want, isn't it.

Huckabee manned up and explained what happened. Finding the right target would be my suggestion.


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