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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 8:05 am 
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Lucky Bastard
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Surprised no one has posted this one.

Short, short version:

Man caught in act of sexually molesting a 5 yr old girl, beaten to death by her father.

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Shiner, Texas (CNN) -- Shiner is a place you can raise your cattle and chickens under the hot Texas sun, cool off with a bottle from the Lone Star State's oldest independent brewery, then go to bed knowing all your neighbors and believing that you'll be safe.
But a few days ago, one of its trademark ranches turned into a crime scene. That's when a father spotted a man sexually assaulting his 5-year-old daughter, then beat the alleged abuser to death.
In a community that prides itself as being peaceful, a place where things like this just don't happen, there is a sweeping consensus that justice was served.
"Any father would have done that," Michael James Veit, whose son graduated with the father from Shiner High School in 2007 and who now lives across the road from the ranch where the killing took place, said Thursday. "Everybody is saying the father is justified."
Father kills man abusing daughter
According to the Lavaca County Sheriff's Office, the 23-year-old father and his family were enjoying a barbecue last Saturday at their ranch on Shiner's outskirts where they keep horses and chickens.
His young daughter had gone off toward the barn, to feed the chickens, the child's grandfather -- who isn't being named, to protect the identity of his granddaughter -- told CNN affiliates KSAT and KPRC.
Then her father heard screaming and ran. He found a 47-year-old man in the act of sexually abusing his daughter, according to Sheriff Mica Harmon.
The father stopped the alleged abuser, then pounded him repeatedly in the head.
"I jumped the fence and saw the man on the ground," the grandfather said of what he first saw. "At that point, I didn't know if he was dead or not."
Authorities did, in fact, pronounce the alleged abuser dead. Lavaca County Precinct Judge Alene Lyons said Monday that a preliminary autopsy report shows he "died from blunt-force head and neck injuries," adding toxicology report results should be back in six weeks.
Harmon described the victim as an acquaintance of the family, known for his horse-grooming abilities. He has not been publicly identified by authorities.
The father himself called 911, telling them that his daughter's alleged abuser was lying, beaten, on the ground. Afterward, the sheriff said that the admitted killer appeared "very remorseful" and didn't know the other man would die at the scene.
Asked whether authorities would press charges against the father, the sheriff responded, "You have a right to defend your daughter. He acted in defense of his third person. Once the investigation is completed, we will submit it to the district attorney, who then submits it to the grand jury, who will decide if they will indict him."
Neighbors portrayed the father as hard-working, friendly and polite, the type of guy who reliably addresses others as "Sir."
"He's not a violent guy. He's never been in any trouble in his life," Veit said of a man he described as a single father who worked nobly to make ends meet. "He's a good, honest, hard-working kid."
Most any violence is unexpected in Shiner, a community between Houston and San Antonio that has about 2,000 people within its city limits and another 1,500 or so on its outskirts, according to the U.S. Census Bureau.
Billing itself as the "Cleanest Little City in Texas," Shiner is known for the Spoetzl Brewery, a wire and plastics company, not to mention its acres upon acres of plains and farms. Veit calls it "a small-town community," filled with folks who may not be wealthy but who work hard and look out for one another.
"Nothing ever happens. There's never any murders here," Veit said. "Everybody knows everybody and gets along with everybody. (This killing) is a real big shock."
Man kills his alleged abuser


Justified homicide in defence of his daughter? Tough call, I can see any father doing this to protect their daughter, but beating him to death? Seems his community is rallying behind him.

I really have to mull this one over on how I feel, honestly.

Thoughts.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:07 am 
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Depends on what the "beating" actually entailed. If he stood there pounding the guy in the head over and over for an excessive amount of time after he was already down, then yeah, that's voluntary manslaughter, subject to a temporary insanity defense. However, if he just punched the guy a few times more than strictly necessary, and the guy happened to die (which can happen from even one punch), then I'd say that's either not a crime (or at least not one you'll ever get a conviction on) or involuntary manslaughter at most.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:34 am 
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I'd go the temporary insanity route. Get one father on the jury that has a daughter? No way he gets convicted.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:22 am 
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the prosecutor would voir dire any parents of girls off the jury and probably any parents at all.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:24 am 
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TheRiov wrote:
the prosecutor would voir dire any parents of girls off the jury and probably any parents at all.



He would try.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:54 am 
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challenge for cause is unlimited iirc. RD?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:02 am 
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I am on board with this father's actions.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:03 am 
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TheRiov wrote:
challenge for cause is unlimited iirc. RD?



I thought it was each side has a limited number of challenges.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:08 am 
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Nitefox wrote:
TheRiov wrote:
challenge for cause is unlimited iirc. RD?

I thought it was each side has a limited number of challenges.

Each side gets a limited number of "peremptory" (i.e. discretionary) challenges, but there's no limit on removals for cause (e.g. bias, incapacity, etc.). However, you have to convince the judge that there's genuine cause for such removal, and I can't imagine parental status alone would ever be enough to establish bias.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 12:52 pm 
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If I understand correctly, the beating was not "overly" severe, and the father was "remorseful" saying he didn't realize the guy would die. Initially, the interviewed officer said it was up to the DA, but he viewed it as defense.

If the guy's head was smashed in, then yeah - probably excessive, but it's still a waste of time to prosecute. If you do get a conviction, he'll get 3-6 months or something and probation. All you've done is make his employment prospects more difficult.

Is he dangerous? Apparently, but only if you attack his family. Is that the sort of individual we need to put away for the protection of society?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 12:59 pm 
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He should have shot him, then it wouldn't be an issue?

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:12 pm 
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I think the difference lies in the fact that he beat him to death rather than shot him.

How much and how long do you have to punch someone until the injuries become fatal? Perhaps an argument can be made (to prosecute him, that is) that during the beating he could have formulated an intent to kill?

With a gun, it would have been a snap reaction with deadly force in defense of his daughter. Justified, I would assume, moreso than beating him with his bare hands.

Maybe his rage was so great that what beating he did mete out was just that severe. If the law deems that there is punishment necessary, I hope that it is lenient.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 2:26 pm 
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People have died from one punch.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 2:31 pm 
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Elmarnieh wrote:
People have died from one punch.


Sure that can happen, but in the context of this story this was not the case.

From the original article reporting the story:

Quote:
The father returned to the house, caught the man in the act, and stopped him by striking him in the head several times, Harmon said.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 2:32 pm 
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Elmarnieh wrote:
People have died from one punch.


Even one punch from a girl!


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 7:32 pm 
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Don't care, molester's dead. Dude should get a medal.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 7:50 pm 
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If I had been in that father's shoes I'd have done the same thing!

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 8:03 pm 
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Foamy wrote:
Elmarnieh wrote:
People have died from one punch.


Sure that can happen, but in the context of this story this was not the case.

From the original article reporting the story:

Quote:
The father returned to the house, caught the man in the act, and stopped him by striking him in the head several times, Harmon said.


No, but punches happen very, very quickly. Remember George Zimmerman? That's why (according to him) he was in mortal danger.

Real people are not made of hit points.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 8:04 pm 
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Texas has a lot of strange laws and precedents about this kind of thing, though most of them have to do with shooting.

Personally I think even he deserved his day in court, but I'm not gonna get all worked up about what happens to someone during his/her commission of a violent crime.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 8:27 pm 
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A fit of rage, I can see that as a defense.
Justifiable homicide.
This shouldn't even be going to court.
Caught in the act of sexually abusing of a 5 year old, should be an automatic death sentence, to be carried out on the spot, by whatever means are available.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:40 pm 
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Leshani wrote:
Caught in the act of sexually abusing of a 5 year old, should be an automatic death sentence, to be carried out on the spot, by whatever means are available.


Ummm hi... it was carried out on the spot, now they are trying to figure out what to do with him.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:44 pm 
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I would not fire a pistol in the direction of my daughter. I might pistol whip the guy, at least until my daughter is out of the range of fire.

I think he should get off by reason of justifiable homicide.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 2:48 pm 
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My gut response was "good."

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 9:13 pm 
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If there is ever to be a justifiable reason for losing it and beating someone to death, catching them in the act of raping your young child should be it.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:16 am 
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