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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:25 am 
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TheRiov wrote:
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
Foamy wrote:
Cops made the first mistake, yes.


First and last. And if you're talking about responsibility for escalation, wouldn't then logically the blame fall on whomever made the FIRST mistake?



Sure lets also blame anyone who puts a cup on a shelf.


That's retarded. First, I'm ONLY blaming the man who made the fatal mistake, as he was professional and is responsible for his actions. Read what I wrote. I'm arguing that blaming only the victim for escalation, and ignoring the first mistake in a series is inappropriate. If you're laying blame based on escalation, then you should start at the beginning.

But what's really retarded is a) refering to placing a cup on a shelf as a mistake, much less one that results in escalation, and b) comparing placing a cup on a shelf to police knocking without announcing at 1:30 am on the wrong door.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:29 am 
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TheRiov wrote:
All anyone here has is the facts reported in the news.

You're editing out certain statements that you deem untrustworthy and then saying "OMG THOSE FASCIST THUGS"


Really? Quote where I said that.

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I'm drawing bad conclusions based on the stated conditions. If the stated conditions are untrue then obviously my conclusions would be re-evaluated. Then again, if the facts are in question, the debate is pointless since we have no common frame of reference.


FTFY. Your conclusions should be reevaluated based on your own inputs.

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You're inventing facts to fit a scenario that demonizes the police without based on your distrust of the established report. If you want to have a debate about just how factual local news reporting is, that's another discussion.


I'm not inventing anything. Even using your "facts", your conclusions are terrible.

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I'm taking the facts/statement's we're given, and using that as an established set of facts (maybe we'll get dash-cam) and making an assessment of the situation of that, without cherry picking my data.


Your coming to the conclusion that maybe he was planning on shooting the officers based on items he had in his apartment. It's a terrible conclusion. Ridiculous.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:38 am 
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Rihannsu Commander

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incorrect or unprovable conclusions based on data at hand (and for the record I didn't draw a conclusion, I posited a motive (note the use of the word "MAY") is still better than editing the root data to achieve the result you want.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:56 am 
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TheRiov wrote:
incorrect or unprovable conclusions based on data at hand (and for the record I didn't draw a conclusion, I posited a motive (note the use of the word "MAY") is still better than editing the root data to achieve the result you want.


Who's editing root data? WTF are you talking about? Show your work.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:54 pm 
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Foamy wrote:
I am not assuming anything. I am going on the information presented in the story.

I even said that if the victim didn't point his weapon and the police shot him anyway, my point doesn't stand so much.

Your bias has blinded you to all else, even what was said in this thread.

So let me say it again...Based in the information presented in the story which I don't immediately disbelieve because of the fact that said information came from a cop, I think the victim's action made the situation worse than it already was. The cops were at the wrong house, and they didn't announce themselves so as to gain a tactical advantage thus triggering the victim to act as he did. (paranoid, stupid, unsafe use of a weapon). Had he acted a little more carefully, he wouldn't have ended up shot.

Or, maybe I shouldn't believe my last second to last statement. After all, the cops made it and there is no one to contradict it. Maybe they WERE at the right house, and they really did announce themselves...

You hear the word cop or police, and immediately you distrust every word said. Try being a little more fair minded and not having your judgement so clouded by your bias.


You're so off on this its insane. There is no way for either of us to know if the cops statement were true therefore the only logical action is to state a maybe.

Lets look at the subjective material here (your claim that it was paranoid, and stupid and your belief that what cannot be verified happened). Restate your case without the subjective material.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 7:03 am 
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The Dancing Cat
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 7:32 am 
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Elmo:

Not going to comment any further. I think I have made my point as clear as I possibly can in the preceding pages.

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