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PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 4:20 pm 
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Xequecal wrote:
Aizle wrote:
Rynar wrote:
It's all of sports, Aethien. I don't blame him for anything. I would have done exactly the same.


So you'd cheat if it meant you had a better chance of winning?


When you're talking about the best of the best in one-dimensional sports, where only one physical aspect matters (how fast you can run, how much weight you can lift, how much endurance you have, etc) and there's not much thinking involved, it's basically impossible to compete without "cheating." There's no way to beat that advantage in a competition where you don't have the ability to out-think or out-play the opponent.

But in the TdF, there's all sorts of strategy and out-thinking the opponent. When to do a breakaway, whether or not to chase one down, which stages to contest, the strength of the other riders on your team.

The thing that might lead me to believe he actually didn't dope is that he was a fantastic rider before his cancer. Everyone was doping? Maybe it was just that they were all clearly inferior to him and had to dope to stand any kind of chance against him ...

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 9:40 pm 
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Using PDE's will not (by itself) make an athlete the caliber of Armstrong. Only an incredibly strong human mind can create an athlete that achieves that level of success. PDE's may be one of the tools used to get there but greatness will and always will be limited by the human mind. It is the single more powerful thing we possess.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 9:45 pm 
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Xequecal wrote:
It's not about "overcoming adversity." Your opponent can do all these things too, and you're again behind. You can't expect to win at something thoughtless like running or cycling if they cheat and you don't. Sports like soccer and basketball don't really have problems with drugs or doping because in those sports you can win by outthinking the opponent, so drugs don't help. I doubt many football quarterbacks take drugs either, it's not worth it. But for something as single-minded as moving from Point A to Point B as fast as you can, I'm pretty sure nearly everyone cheats. They wouldn't be competitive if they didn't.


This assumes three things:

1) In games where the depth of strategy is greater than cycling, you can't win on physical prowess plays no role. This is untrue because physicality plays into the execution of gameplan.

2) Cycling involves no strategy at all. Similarly in thinking that team sports completely ignore the elements of physical athleticism, it is untrue to say cycling includes no strategy.

3) That ability to perform physical exertion isn't linked to the mind. A strong mind is absolutely critical to winning event of endurance. It's not thoughtless at all. In fact, it's more mental than anything else.

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Last edited by Rafael on Thu Aug 30, 2012 10:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 10:15 pm 
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Xequecal wrote:
It's not about "overcoming adversity." Your opponent can do all these things too, and you're again behind. You can't expect to win at something thoughtless like running or cycling if they cheat and you don't.


I stopped reading at this statement. This shows that you have a complete lack of understanding of how important the team and strategy are to winning the Tour De France. No cyclist stands a chance of even a decent finish in a single tour stage (Time Trials excepted) without the help of his team and a winning strategy. I don't care how much cheating (via chemicals) is going on.


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