The Glade 4.0

"Turn the lights down, the party just got wilder."
It is currently Fri Nov 22, 2024 8:43 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 20 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 4:36 pm 
Offline
Noli me calcare
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:26 am
Posts: 4747
Government Openness Meeting: Closed to the Media and Public

Quote:
Openness in government is all well and good, and we are in fact firmly committed to it, but, well, get the hell out of our face, media, the government is having a secret meeting over here! From the Associated Press, which finds that, like many of Obama's promises, his promises of increased government transparency haven't panned out too well:

It's hardly the image of transparency the Obama administration wants to project: A workshop on government openness is closed to the public....


It still amazes me that people think Obama is leading us to the new Golden Age of government transparency and accountability.

_________________
"Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko

Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 4:39 pm 
Offline
Too lazy for a picture

Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2009 8:40 pm
Posts: 1352
haha, ohhh man that is funny.

_________________
"Life isn't divided into genres. It's a horrifying, romantic, tragic, comical, science-fiction cowboy detective novel. You know, with a bit of pornography if you're lucky."
— Alan Moore


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 4:42 pm 
Offline
Deuce Master

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:45 am
Posts: 3099
I know it was promised on the campaign trail, but I haven't really seen anybody boasting of the transparency of the new President's administration. That's just my experience.

_________________
The Dude abides.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 4:51 pm 
Offline
Noli me calcare
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:26 am
Posts: 4747
You mean besides the administration? The Huffington Post, Dailykos, a vociferous poster here, people on mass transit in San Francisco, MSNBC, among others - in my experience.

_________________
"Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko

Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:36 pm 
Offline
Asian Blonde

Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2009 7:14 pm
Posts: 2075
Quote:
I know it was promised on the campaign trail, but I haven't really seen anybody with common sense boasting of the transparency of the new President's administration. That's just my experience.


Quote fixed.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:20 pm 
Offline
Noli me calcare
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:26 am
Posts: 4747
Lol, I can get behind that.

_________________
"Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko

Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 8:48 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 8:49 am
Posts: 2410
Or, you know,you could look at what he's really done about the issue.


Some specifics -

Quote:
• Requires federal agencies to make a minimum of three "high-value" data sets available within 45 days. An example, they said, was data that was released on Data.gov earlier this year by the Federal Aviation Administration about the on-time performance of commercial airline flights, and which was subsequently used by a member of the public to create Flyontime.us.

• Directs that within 60 days, the White House will launch a dashboard on Whitehouse.gov that will be used to hold each agency accountable for the contents of the directive.

• Commits each federal agency to launching its own open government Web site.

• Says that within 90 days, agencies will receive guidance from the federal Office of Management and Budget about creating challenges and contests for how best to use publicly available data.

• And mandates that within 120 days, each agency will create an open government plan geared towards ensuring that the philosophies of openness, transparency, and collaboration are permanently "hardwired."

_________________
Image

It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:04 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 7:59 pm
Posts: 9412
Wow. Publishing information about commercial airlines' performance is considered transparent government?

We truly live in an age of enlightenment.

_________________
"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 10:25 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 10:49 pm
Posts: 3455
Location: St. Louis, MO
So when do we get to say "At least he made the planes run on time"?

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 10:27 pm 
Offline
Asian Blonde

Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2009 7:14 pm
Posts: 2075
he's only publishing the information, he made no promises to make them run on time, not that it would matter too much if he did make the promise /snark


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 12:59 am 
Offline
Peanut Gallery
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 9:40 pm
Posts: 2289
Location: Bat Country
It doesn't really matter. They could put crazy **** on those websites like "NASA sends fish-man to colonize Venus and no one would be reading it. People who are taking an active interest in what our government is doing already knows it full of charlatans and prostitutes. (well, maybe I can't back that statement up, but it feels good) Everyone else is too busy tracking the events of Tiger's personal life. Not to say I'm totally awesome, and spend all my time reading Tolstoy and sipping fine brandy while discussing what to do about world events with the members of the Extraordinary League of Gentlemen. (I Take breaks from my Tolstoy to play MW2 and Borderlands. Not sure if my friends are considered "gentlemen", but they are extraordinary at MW2 and Gears of War.) Unless someone can drown out the impotent and media and their vestigial sense of journalistic integrity, it's going to be a struggle raise anyone's political awareness to a conscious level.

_________________
"...the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?" -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 7:07 am 
Offline
Noli me calcare
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:26 am
Posts: 4747
Monte wrote:
Or, you know,you could look at what he's really done about the issue.


Yes, let's:

Some specifics -

barackobama.com wrote:
Sunlight Before Signing: Too often bills are rushed through Congress and to the president before the public has the opportunity to review them. As president, Obama will not sign any non-emergency bill without giving the American public an opportunity to review and comment on the White House website for five days.


Not even close.

As politifact eloquently puts it:
Image


Barack Obama wrote:
"I'm going to have all the negotiations around a big table. We'll have doctors and nurses and hospital administrators. Insurance companies, drug companies -- they'll get a seat at the table, they just won't be able to buy every chair. But what we will do is, we'll have the negotiations televised on C-SPAN, so that people can see who is making arguments on behalf of their constituents, and who are making arguments on behalf of the drug companies or the insurance companies. And so, that approach, I think is what is going to allow people to stay involved in this process."


Hell, those negotiations were so open to the public and transparent that the Republicans were locked out of meeting rooms.

Image

When asked to provide a list of the health care executives and lobbyists who've had meetings with Obama, a FOIA request had to be filed because the info wasn't forthcoming. It was denied; lawsuit subsequently filed.

When asked to provide a list of the coal company executives who've had meetings with Obama, the info was not released, a FOIA request was filed - denied and lawsuit filed.

Here are a few more:

Quote:
February 9, New York Times:

In a closely watched case involving rendition and torture [Mohamed v. Jeppesen Data], a lawyer for the Obama administration seemed to surprise a panel of federal appeals judges on Monday by pressing ahead with an argument for preserving state secrets originally developed by the Bush administration.

February 21, Huffington Post:

The Obama administration, siding with former President George W. Bush, is trying to kill a lawsuit that seeks to recover what could be millions of missing White House e-mails.

February 27, Associated Press:

The Obama administration has lost its argument that a potential threat to national security should stop a lawsuit challenging the government's warrantless wiretapping program. . . . The Obama administration, like the Bush administration before it, claimed national security would be compromised if a lawsuit brought by the Oregon chapter of the charity, Al-Haramain Islamic Foundation, was allowed to proceed.

April 7, The Atlantic:

The Obama Administration still wants to keep its secrets. Yesterday, the Justice Department [in a case brought against Bush officials for illegal spying] embraced the argument that the state secrets privilege . . . should shut down any litigation against the National Security Agency for its arguably illegal warrantless surveillance program.

April 28, New York Times:

A federal appeals court ruled Tuesday that a lawsuit brought by five men who say they were tortured as part of the Central Intelligence Agency’s “extraordinary rendition” program could proceed, dealing a blow to efforts by both the Bush and Obama administrations to claim sweeping executive secrecy powers.

May 12, Washington Times:

The Obama administration says it may curtail Anglo-American intelligence sharing if the British High Court discloses new details of the treatment of a former Guantanamo detainee. . . . In February, the British Foreign Office claimed that the U.S. government had threatened to reduce intelligence cooperation if details of the interrogations and treatment of Mr. Mohamed were disclosed.

May 14, Washington Post:

President Obama yesterday chose secrecy over disclosure, saying he will seek to block the court-ordered release of photographs depicting the abuse of detainees held by U.S. authorities abroad.

May 22, San Francisco Chronicle:

A federal judge on Friday threatened to severely sanction the Obama Administration for withholding a top secret document he ordered given to lawyers suing the government over its warrantless wiretapping program. . . . The National Security Agency has also refused the judge's previous orders to provide security clearances to two of the charity's lawyers so they can view the top secret document.

June 1, Washington Post Editorial page:

The [Graham-Lieberman] measure, supported by the White House and passed May 21 as an attachment to a Senate funding bill, would put beyond the reach of FOIA any photographs taken between Sept. 11, 2001, and Jan. 22, 2009 . . . [W]hat makes the administration's support for the photographic records act so regrettable [is that in] taking a step aimed at protecting the country's service members, Mr. Obama runs the risk of taking two steps back in his quest for more open government.

June 9, Washington Post:

The Obama administration objected yesterday to the release of certain Bush-era documents that detail the videotaped interrogations of CIA detainees at secret prisons, arguing to a federal judge that doing so would endanger national security and benefit al-Qaeda's recruitment efforts. In an affidavit, CIA Director Leon E. Panetta defended the classification of records describing the contents of the 92 videotapes, their destruction by the CIA in 2005 and what he called "sensitive operational information" about the interrogations.

June 12, Associated Press:

The Obama administration has decided to keep secret the locations of nearly four dozen coal ash storage sites that pose a threat to people living nearby. The Environmental Protection Agency classified the 44 sites as potential hazards to communities while investigating storage of coal ash waste after a spill at a Tennessee power plant in December.

June 16, McClatchy:

Defense Department officials are debating whether to ignore an earlier promise and squelch the release of an investigation into a U.S. airstrike last month, out of fear that its findings would further enrage the Afghan public, Pentagon officials told McClatchy Monday.

June 16, ABC News:

After being briefed today on President Obama’s firing last week of Gerald Walpin, Inspector General of the Corporation for National and Community Service, Sen. Claire McCaskill, D-Mo., said the president did not abide by the same law that he co-sponsored – and she wrote – about firing Inspectors General. . . . “The legislation which was passed last year requires that the president give a reason for the removal," [McCaskill said]. McCaskill, a key Obama ally, said that the president’s stated reason for the termination, “Loss of confidence’ is not a sufficient reason.”

June 17, Washington Post:

President Obama has embraced Bush administration justifications for denying public access to White House visitor logs even as advisers say they are reviewing the policy of keeping secret the official record of comings and goings.



I must admit, though that in the face of the overwhelming transparency efforts of creating plans and launching websites in two three or four months, the above is rather meaningless. :lol:

_________________
"Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko

Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 11:37 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:05 am
Posts: 1111
Location: Phoenix
Wow... I know its pretty pointless arguing with Monty, and so this will probably not faze him one bit, but that was an epic response.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:03 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:22 pm
Posts: 5716
What a tool.

This isn't change, it's more of the same.

All he was doing was dancing for the voters. I wonder if he's just taking advantage of the fact he's been elected, or if he never had any intention of increasing transparency.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:52 pm 
Offline
Asian Blonde

Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2009 7:14 pm
Posts: 2075
He's a politician, I'd go with the second one Arath.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:52 pm 
Offline
Evil Bastard™
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:07 am
Posts: 7542
Location: Doomstadt, Latveria
He's a Chicago politician at that :P

_________________
Corolinth wrote:
Facism is not a school of thought, it is a racial slur.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:08 pm 
Offline
Deuce Master

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:45 am
Posts: 3099
Is that like a normal politician except thick crust?

_________________
The Dude abides.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:23 pm 
Offline
Too lazy for a picture

Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2009 8:40 pm
Posts: 1352
So do they have deeper dishes?

_________________
"Life isn't divided into genres. It's a horrifying, romantic, tragic, comical, science-fiction cowboy detective novel. You know, with a bit of pornography if you're lucky."
— Alan Moore


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:34 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:08 am
Posts: 6465
Location: The Lab
Deep Dish and Square Cut?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 7:38 am 
Offline
Commence Primary Ignition
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am
Posts: 15740
Location: Combat Information Center
shuyung wrote:
So when do we get to say "At least he made the planes run on time"?


Never. He's from Chicago. Evidently you haven't flown through O'Hare in less-than-perfect weather.

_________________
"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 20 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 221 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group