The Glade 4.0

Then that's the fault of the Board of Directors who write in Golden Paracute clauses into contracts. What idiot offers someone a job where massive failure results in massive reward?

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"It's real, grew up in trife life, the times of white lines
The hype vice, murderous nighttimes and knife fights invite crimes" - Nasir Jones

It seemed to be standard in the banking world...

Do you have any actual evidence of golden parachutes other than your own suspicion?

In any case, it can hardly be blamed on the executives when, as stated, the market in that area is saturated and the deal was recognized as necessary and acceptable by other unions.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

But are the Twinkies too big to fail?

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"Life isn't divided into genres. It's a horrifying, romantic, tragic, comical, science-fiction cowboy detective novel. You know, with a bit of pornography if you're lucky."
— Alan Moore

That's a big Twinkie.

Tell him about the Twinkie.

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"Life isn't divided into genres. It's a horrifying, romantic, tragic, comical, science-fiction cowboy detective novel. You know, with a bit of pornography if you're lucky."
— Alan Moore

Hmm that's interesting given the mediocre to outright lousy chronic performance of the banking and financial services industries.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Tapatalk 2

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"It's real, grew up in trife life, the times of white lines
The hype vice, murderous nighttimes and knife fights invite crimes" - Nasir Jones

Actually it's standard in the professional world period. ANYONE who is a CEO of a medium to large business most likely has a golden parachute of some type.

Similarly, it's is very rare for top executives to actually be fired. Unless they have done something completely out of line, like **** an employee on the boardroom table while being video taped, they are just "encouraged to leave" and they part ways on their own, typically getting a very large stipend from their contract.

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/1 ... -downfall/

Come on dude, they TRIPLED executives pay as they were filing for bankruptcy.



This is a case of blatant corporate greed and mismanagement.

Hardly.

[URL]http://m.washingtonexaminer.com/ding-dong-hostess-is-dead-and-wicked-union-did-it/article/2513727?custom_click=rss&utm_campaign=Weekly+Standard+Story+Box&utm_source=weeklystandard.com&utm_medium=referral
[/URL]

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Ezekiel 23:19-20 

The company was long dead before any of the union crap even happened.

The company died from making too much Junk Food :p

Horse ****. 374 different collective bargaining agreements didn't just happen overnight, and many of the redundancies and inefficiencies they created handcuffed management's ability to solve the fiscal issues the company faced. Ultimately the final management group decided that what was best for the company and it's owners was to take a hard .ine with the unions that thry would either accept, or they would close the doors and sell off the healthy assets.

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Ezekiel 23:19-20 

Please, this is yet another example of execs robbing the place blind, purposely burning the company to the ground, and selling it off cheap. They and every other executive who has done this should be in jail and never allowed near a executive position again. It's become an epidemic in this country.

But no, the unions are the evil ones, despite this being just another company in a long line of of them being stripped bare. The people in charge can't possibly be evil and we must protect them!

How did they "rob the place blind"? How did they "burn it to the ground", and to what ends? What is the core business benefit of selling the company for less than it is perceived to be worth? On what charges would you try the management group? Is failing to run a profitable business with goals sufficiently socialist and non-profit driven for Sean's taste a crime now? Why should failed business models be continually propped up to meet the demands of fungible labor? Define "evil".

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Ezekiel 23:19-20 

Rynar, what is the largest company that you've ever been an employee of?

It is silly to suggest this is solely the blame of Unions. 372 collective bargaining agreements? Define AGREEMENTS.

If the management allowed the Unions to run a muck, to the point where cuts to make the place competitive are perceived as "robbing the place blind" then they are equally to blame.

Let's take the $2.5M, in fact let's assume the other 9 guys mentioned in the story got a 1m salary bump too (Even though they didn't according to your quote) which yields a whopping $11.5M for executive salaries for 1 year. Versus $944.2M owed to the Union in the form of pensions.

Let's take this example further though (because goddamn $11.5M sounds like a lot of money to grunts like you and I) divide out the exagerated $11.5M over the company's 19500 employees. Which yields $590 more per year per employee which works out to $0.28 more per hour per employee.

Now if I click a few more links off of your quoted source I find:

Then if we follow a third link from your source...


In other words, the **** that killed Twinkies is the same **** that is killing America. Unfunded entitlement spending, in the Hostess example it is pensions, for the country it is Medicaid/Medicare and Social Security.

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So, in other words, you have no evidence. Thanks. Having a high salary or a pay raise before the company goes under isn't a golden parachute. Those are what happens when you get fired but still get a massive compensation package. In this case the company is going under so any "golden parachute" would be subject to the review of the bankruptcy court anyhow.

Furthermore, citing an organization like "thinkprogress" is laughable. That's blatant partisan hackery right there.



This is a case of blatant corporate greed and mismanagement.[/quote]

No, it's not. In view of the total assets and liabilities of a company of the size of Hostess, a couple million in executive salaries is not greed or mismanagement; it's a triviality. In fact, given the responsibilities of someone managing a company that big in a tough economy and an oversaturated industry, I'd say the pay raise was absolutely necessary.

Furthermore, in view of the fact that most past major sweet deals for failed executives that have become public issues, have involved vastly more than 2.5 million or so dollars, this one looks like a fairly modest executive salary. Hell, many major sports figures make a lot more than that and don't exercise one iota of the responsibility of a CEO.

Seriously, a billion dollars in union pension funds, and somehow a few million in executive salaries means management is equally to blame?

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

This implies that you don't think management is equally to blame. Do you not hold management equally to blame for the union pension fund costs? After all, they negotiated with the unions and agreed to these.

I'm not sure how that's relevant to anything, but I currently work for a huge multi-national.

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Ezekiel 23:19-20 

No. They are not negotiating from a clean slate. Hostess has been around a long time; they had to negotiate from what was previously there, and the union will always demand more. Any compromise still always ends up going up from wherever you start from as management. It is a herculean effort, as this case shows, to make any sort of cut.

Second, unions are at a major advantage in strikes because of various regulations protecting them.

I did not say management was entirely at fault, but the fact is that people in general have a very bad habit of assuming that when both sides are to blame, the blame is equal, or to take the side of the "little guy" simply because he's the little guy. Individually, workers are the little guy, but collectively they're not a little guy at all, and they ruthlessly exploit emotionalism. As a general rule, union workers and their supportive public always assume there is money somewhere in the company to support what they want or at least most of it, and the management is just hiding it somewhere, or is getting paid too much. People have a very bad habit of assuming that the physical difficulty of labor or the number of hours worked are what makes it valuable rather than the skillset, the value produced, or the level of responsibility. Physical difficulty and danger certainly are deserving of compensation, but they do not carry the same value as responsibility.

To put it simply, privates work physically harder and often in greater danger than generals, but privates do not lose entire wars.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

If that's the case, we can't be holding our elected representatives responsible for our budget issues.



Fair enough.

Is that a new thing? I ask because I don't recall holding anyone responsible for not having a budget for the last three years or for the Bush spending bonanza the previous 8 years...

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Yes we can. They can change the law that requires mandatory spending and the like. A business cannot change the law. The only thing stopping elected representatives from doing this is the fear of losing the election.

Therefore, in a sense, you're right. We should be blaming ourselves for the budget situation, rather than making excuses about "monoparties" and "systems" and "ruling classes." If the citizenry had more concern for the state of the nation as a whole and less concern for either getting the most benefits from government they could or advocating for what viscerally seems like the kind thing to do, we would not have such a massive edifice of spending.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."