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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:52 am 
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DFK! wrote:
Hannibal wrote:
So whats the over/under on Florida burning when Zimmerman is acquitted?


More importantly, what's the likelihood Zimmerman ever gets a normal life again?

I think 95% of the population forgot about this issue and I would bet most folks on this board did too until someone necroposted. So if I were gambling then I would put my money on his odds being pretty good.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:55 am 
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That's probably true, but I'm quite sure the media would not miss a chance to "update" the nation on an acquittal.. or a conviction.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:58 am 
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Diamondeye wrote:
That's probably true, but I'm quite sure the media would not miss a chance to "update" the nation on an acquittal.. or a conviction.


100% agreed.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:55 pm 
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Diamondeye wrote:
That's probably true, but I'm quite sure the media would not miss a chance to "update" the nation on an acquittal.. or a conviction.

Agreed but then it will be forgotten again just as quickly.

In another three years I bet Casey Anthony could get a job in a daycare without anyone raising an eyebrow. We as a society just aren't tuned to care about/remember something long-term.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:59 pm 
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That period of time, however, where the "update" occurs and isn't forgotten, are where you get rioting in the streets.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 1:54 pm 
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Facts that are not in dispute:

1) George Zimmerman shot and killed Trayvon Martin.
2) Trayvon Martin tried to escape.
3) George Zimmerman got out of his car and pursued Trayvon Martin on foot.
4) George Zimmerman was told by the police that his assistance was not required.

Did George Zimmerman fear for his life? I'm certain he did. Will he be acquitted on the grounds that it was self defense? He most certainly will.

The fact remains that George Zimmerman, and only George Zimmerman, placed George Zimmerman in that position. He wasn't walking down the street minding his own business with some young black thug jumped out and assaulted him for no reason.

It's not okay just because it's south of the Mason-Dixon line.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 2:19 pm 
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Corolinth wrote:
Facts that are not in dispute:

1) George Zimmerman shot and killed Trayvon Martin.
2) Trayvon Martin tried to escape.
3) George Zimmerman got out of his car and pursued Trayvon Martin on foot.
4) George Zimmerman was told by the police that his assistance was not required.

Did George Zimmerman fear for his life? I'm certain he did. Will he be acquitted on the grounds that it was self defense? He most certainly will.

The fact remains that George Zimmerman, and only George Zimmerman, placed George Zimmerman in that position. He wasn't walking down the street minding his own business with some young black thug jumped out and assaulted him for no reason.

It's not okay just because it's south of the Mason-Dixon line.



While I'm sure you worked hard to make sure you got your dig in on white southern folk like any good Yankee is wont to do...You left out of your smart little list the oh so important facts that Martin had gotten away, Zim stopped looking for him and then Martin came back and confronted him. If you are going to spout facts, spout all of them. Maybe do some math to help with that.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 4:23 pm 
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Corolinth wrote:
Facts that are not in dispute:

1) George Zimmerman shot and killed Trayvon Martin.
2) Trayvon Martin tried to escape.
3) George Zimmerman got out of his car and pursued Trayvon Martin on foot.
4) George Zimmerman was told by the police that his assistance was not required.

Did George Zimmerman fear for his life? I'm certain he did. Will he be acquitted on the grounds that it was self defense? He most certainly will.

The fact remains that George Zimmerman, and only George Zimmerman, placed George Zimmerman in that position. He wasn't walking down the street minding his own business with some young black thug jumped out and assaulted him for no reason.

It's not okay just because it's south of the Mason-Dixon line.


Yes, as a matter of fact it is "ok" regardless of whether it's south of the Mason Dixon line. George Zimmerman may have gotten himself unnecessarily involved, but it is completely unreasonable to have expected him to forsee that shooting Martin was a likely outcome. Furthermore, Martin ultimately started the physical confrontation itself as far as anyone can tell.

Ultimately, Martin simply had no reason to assault Zimmerman, regardless of how unwise Zimmerman's behavior was. That's the bottom line unless we receive new information. The Mason-Dixon line has nothing to do with it.

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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:45 am 
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Foamy wrote:
DFK! wrote:
Hannibal wrote:
So whats the over/under on Florida burning when Zimmerman is acquitted?


More importantly, what's the likelihood Zimmerman ever gets a normal life again?

Guilty til proven innocent in the land of the free.


More like: Guilty regardless of the outcome of his trial.


With the recent developments, I'm becoming increasingly sure this never makes it to trial, and the Defense has been becoming increasingly confident as time goes on, evidence gets into their hands, etc.

The one witness that has a remote chance of letting the State pin George as the aggressor has critical problems, and if she gets impeached, I don't think the State has probable cause anymore.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:47 am 
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Corolinth wrote:
Facts that are not in dispute:

1) George Zimmerman shot and killed Trayvon Martin.
2) Trayvon Martin tried to escape.
3) George Zimmerman got out of his car and pursued Trayvon Martin on foot.
4) George Zimmerman was told by the police that his assistance was not required.

Did George Zimmerman fear for his life? I'm certain he did. Will he be acquitted on the grounds that it was self defense? He most certainly will.

The fact remains that George Zimmerman, and only George Zimmerman, placed George Zimmerman in that position. He wasn't walking down the street minding his own business with some young black thug jumped out and assaulted him for no reason.

It's not okay just because it's south of the Mason-Dixon line.


Also not in dispute at this point...wherever Trayvon went, he turned around and came back to the T intersection, else the fight never would have happened. I'm not sure that qualifies as "trying to escape."


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:58 am 
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But anyways, I have an anecdote that is relevant I think. I was at the store once, and I saw a youth run out of the store with a TV under his arm. Standing right by the entrance of the store, I pulled out my phone, called 911, watched where he was headed, and when he disappeared around the corner, I walked to the corner to look where he was running, and updated the Police as best as I could. I have no idea if the Police caught him or not, but even though I was following him in the same manner George followed Trayvon that night, I never expected or imagined I'd end up face to face with the thief. He was running away after all.

Likewise, there's nothing really out there that shows that George ever intended, expected, or wanted to get into a confrontation with Trayvon, thus there's no basis to hold him culpable when defending himself from Trayvon's assault and battery.

And on an eerie note, I actually had a post of mine on the Defense website read in court and submitted as evidence during the gag order hearing in October. I talked a bit with George Zimmerman's brother about it after.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:22 am 
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Coren wrote:
And on an eerie note, I actually had a post of mine on the Defense website read in court and submitted as evidence during the gag order hearing in October. I talked a bit with George Zimmerman's brother about it after.


What? What was the post about.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:37 pm 
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I'll post some links that explain better than I could later. In the meantime though, George just filed a lawsuit against NBC for defamation.

www.gzvnbc.com


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:29 am 
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Trial underway..

The prosecutions star witness...they better hope they have something else...

Apparently St. Skittles wasn't as racially sensitive as required by modern society.

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/travyon-mart ... l-comment/

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Witness Rachel Jeantel — who was on the phone with Trayvon Martin moments before he was killed — was back on the stand on Thursday, again facing a grilling from George Zimmerman‘s defense attorney Don West. Alluding to yesterday’s testimony, West asked about Martin characterizing Zimmerman as a “creepy-ass cracker” — which Jeantel felt was not a racist remark.

West questioned Jeantel about why she felt the shooting was racial. Jeantel pointed to Martin’s description of “the person that was watching him and following him.” West repeated, “Describing the person is what made you think it was racial?” Jeantel agreed.

To that point, West recalled Jeantel’s previous testimony — during which she said Martin described Zimmerman as a “creepy-ass cracker.”

“So it was racial, but it was because Trayvon Martin put race in this,” West pressed. “You don’t think that’s a racial comment?”

Jeantel replied simply, “No.”

West repeated the question, receiving the same answer. He then went on to press her on why she didn’t include that description in the letter to Martin’s mother. After a few minutes of back-and-forth, West contended she didn’t tell Martin’s because she knew the remark was “offensive.” Jeantel said it was being “respectful.”

“You don’t think calling someone a creepy-ass cracker is offensive?” West asked.

“No,” Jeantel replied.

At that point, West continued to press the point, questioning whether she felt it would bother Martin’s mother to know the remark. Jeantel dismissed the comment as unimportant.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 12:32 pm 
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Zimmerman is going to jail. That's a foregone conclusion ...

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 12:54 pm 
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WTF did I just read

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:03 pm 
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Wow...more on this witness. I'm going to leave the snark alone as I'm starting to feel sorry for her. Education in this country...oh my...

http://abcnews.go.com/US/george-zimmerm ... cxllD772Ys

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A teenage friend of Trayvon Martin was forced to admit today in the George Zimmerman murder trial that she did not write a letter that was sent to Martin’s mother describing what she allegedly heard on a phone call with Martin moments before he was shot.

In a painfully embarassing moment, Rachel Jeantel was asked to read the letter out loud in court.

“Are you able to read that at all?” defense attorney Don West asked.

Jeantel, head bowed, eyes averted whispered into the court microphone, “Some but not all. I don’t read cursive.”

It sent a hush through the packed courtroom.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:19 pm 
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Khross wrote:
Zimmerman is going to jail. That's a foregone conclusion ...

^That

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:24 pm 
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Yeah, there's no way he can get a fair trial.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:16 pm 
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If Zimmerman goes to jail on 2nd degree murder, there is effectively no right to self defense in this country.

Believe that.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:17 pm 
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DFK! wrote:
If Zimmerman goes to jail on 2nd degree murder, there is effectively no right to self defense in this country.
Ummm, didn't one of the Illinois Democrats introduce a bill to committee that would make all existing and future passage of "castle laws" illegal?

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:18 pm 
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Maybe. Dude shouldn't have been following the other dude.

/shrug

I dunno really.

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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:21 pm 
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Khross wrote:
DFK! wrote:
If Zimmerman goes to jail on 2nd degree murder, there is effectively no right to self defense in this country.
Ummm, didn't one of the Illinois Democrats introduce a bill to committee that would make all existing and future passage of "castle laws" illegal?


Not sure, but "Stand your Ground" (i.e. Florida's Castle Law) isn't in question in Zimmerman's case, despite CNN (and probably a bunch of politicians) thinking it is.

Ultimately, second degree murder contends malice, not that you killed somebody. Had they gone for manslaughter, they probably would have won, as Zimmerman is not contesting that he shot and killed Martin.

Conviction on 2nd degree murder would basically allow you to charge anyone who killed in self defense if you can pump the case profile high enough and allege malice.


Side note: Not only is this witness not working well for the prosecution, the 911 operator they called yesterday fell flat as well. They essentially testified they heard no anger or malice in Zimmerman's voice.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:23 pm 
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Müs wrote:
Maybe. Dude shouldn't have been following the other dude.

/shrug

I dunno really.


That's technically an unsubstantiated fact in this case.

Additionally: if he did follow him, why not? If your neighborhood had a bunch of home breakins and you believed someone was suspicious, AND you were on the phone with 911 at the time, would you not want to make sure they didn't "get away?" Or would you not have bothered to call in the first place? (No judgment there, just asking.)

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:43 pm 
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Müs wrote:
Maybe. Dude shouldn't have been following the other dude.

/shrug

I dunno really.

^ That

Mind your own **** business, especially after 911 explicitly tells you to mind your own **** business.

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