The Glade 4.0

They can all go f*ck themselves. My "no longer deserving of the title" brother can add himself to that list.

We're done. They are for all intents and purposes, out of me and my family's lives.

I can't wait to put the kids to bed so I can go to sleep, forget about today and just get back to the weekly work routine.

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This must be Thursday. I could never get the hang of Thursdays.

Shoot someone in the face, it will make you feel better for a minute.

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Raell Kromwell

Oonagh here: I don't know why this is posted here instead of rants, but I guess Foamy put it into the wrong spot. This was my baby girl's first Christmas. Not that she will remember any of this, but I wish I could forget about it. I mean don't get me wrong, I love sitting and talking to state troopers on Christmas Day about the Assault of my brother-in-law, on my husband, but really I have better things to do with my time. Well, all I can say is see you in hell, mom, dad, and brother because that is the only place you will all end up. **** you, **** your "family", I hope you all end up very happy together because I sure as hell will be since you are out of my life and my kids lives for good.

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This must be Thursday. I could never get the hang of Thursdays.

Jumping Jesus...

Any desire to move far away from these people?

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Raell Kromwell

The problem is that Oonagh's family, which seems to have mostly sane people, is just as close or even closer to them physically. They would lose the good along with the bad, and the bad they can tell to get the bleep out of their lives.

It is never easy.

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The U. S. Constitution doesn't guarantee happiness, only the pursuit of it. You have to catch up with it yourself. B. Franklin

"A mind needs books like a sword needs a whetstone." -- Tyrion Lannister, A Game of Thrones

Foamy here, posting as Foamy:

Raell: Yes, absolutely but...

What Micheal said essentially, but this time they will remain out of our lives until they agree to family counseling.

Also, since I don't YET want to call him out in front of family on Facebook, I'd like to say to my brother this:

It takes a special kind of man to attack your older brother in your parents house on Christmas Day for me doing nothing more than raising my voice and arguing with my parents. You are about as good of an uncle to my kids as my dead brother in law who never knew them. I'll echo your sentiment to me before you attacked me yesterday, "I am embarrassed to call you my brother, and you are an *******." You may continue staying out of my family's life.

I have friends who are better brothers to me than you have ever been. **** off.

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This must be Thursday. I could never get the hang of Thursdays.

I'm sorry you had a bad time. I hope you feel better and you figure it out.

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I prefer to think of them as "Fighting evil in another dimension"

sounds like long past time for a clean separation, or at least spending the Holidays with Elm.

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"Life isn't divided into genres. It's a horrifying, romantic, tragic, comical, science-fiction cowboy detective novel. You know, with a bit of pornography if you're lucky."
— Alan Moore

Damn man I had no clue it went this far. Hey for what its worth y'all still got me to kick around. New year new page.

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A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. ~ John Stuart Mill

That means a lot to me. I appreciate it!

Now more than ever, I feel the support of my friends around me and I couldn't be more thankful.

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This must be Thursday. I could never get the hang of Thursdays.

I don't understand, but then I love my family and we get along.

Some thoughts though.

Oongah - let Foamy drive the bus on this. Even if he agrees, be careful what you say about his family. He'll be conflicted despite what he says, and you don't want to be on the other side of the coin from him for even a minute while he sorts this out. Just support and fill the holes this is making in his life.

Foamy - I can't imagine how difficult it would be to be in your situation. Good luck, I hope you find a solution that fits. It may be perhaps that you can get along and maintain a relationship with individuals in your family, if under certain circumstances? For example, hanging out with your brother every once in a while without the rest of your family. Or with each of your parents, etc. If something can work, great. If not, I'd have to echo everyone else here and say move on.

You know, I used to think I had issues with my family.

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me
█ ♣ █

Your parents have shown that they don't respect your wishes for your children, and also that they're crazy. The leverage you have over your parents is your presence in their lives. Use it. Don't go visit them on holidays. Oonagh's family is sane and normal. Hang out with them.

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Buckle your pants or they might fall down.

/\

+1

They will hear from me that I will not speak face to face with them without a professional counselor present.

I plan on keeping the communication channel open to them, but the message will repeat until it dawns on them that the ball is in their court. If they want to move forward, there is only one way. They control their own destiny and will be made to understand that constructive discussion can not happen between us without professional help.

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This must be Thursday. I could never get the hang of Thursdays.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

A testament to how out of touch with reality my mom is:

After yesterday's shenanigans and basically my wife and I being pushed out of the house (that we were in the process of leaving anyway), she calls my cell and leaves me a message. Simply stating, "Come over the house tonight, let the kids open their Xmas presents, I have extra food for dinner". All of this as if nothing at all happened. For a moment, I let my guard down and spoke to Oonagh about how it escalated and I started shouting because they aren't listening to us no matter how we address it. This of course led to my idiot brother letting his emotions and violent tendancies take over.

I thought for a short moment, that without my brother present, we can try to have the "discussion" again and I promise to Oonagh and myself that I will keep my temper in check. But she set me straight and reinforced to me that things WILL NOT BE ANY DIFFERENT, no matter how much I hope it to be.

Anyway, to that effect, does anyone have any ideas about how I even go about this? What is available? Are there counselors who do such things? Who do I call to be an intermediate between my parents and myself? Obviously, we can not solve our problems on our own. I understand this, they do not. They think that just us talking is solution enough and all is well. I just don't know how to proceed. Noting of course that I am not throwing my hands up and saying "f*ck it" and turning my back on them. I will know that, no matter what, I at least tried to get my family into counseling. I push for it, and they keep denying...fine. Their loss and I can sleep easy at night knowing that I tried to bring normalcy to the "relationship" I have with my parents.

I am waiting for her or my dad to speak for my brother and tell me that "He's sorry" or "He just got upset and didn't mean to jump you." I will shut them right the hell up and let them know that he is is own man and he can speak for himself. I have nothing to say to him and if he wants to clear the air, his *** better be getting in touch with me on his own and apologizing for his COMPLETELY out of line actions. They have a tendency to do so and I will not accept it. He acted on his own and he will have to man up to it if he ever wants me to acknowledge him as a brother again.

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This must be Thursday. I could never get the hang of Thursdays.

Foamy, I'm very sorry your holiday had to be ruined this way.

I'd say that you really shouldn't try to "go about" anything. The ball is in their court. If I were you, I'd just ignore them until they go from "come on over" as if nothing had happened to "why won't you come over anymore?". Then, tell them that it's because of this incident, and you won't discuss it any further unless its with a counselor, and if they want to "But---" just repeat it and leave it at that.

Either they'll acknowledge their problems or they won't.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

This.

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Holy shitsnacks!

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Allow me to give you a perspective of your situation, from somewhere on Oonagh's side of the family. Let's say, Oonagh's brother.

Western culture, with its focus on nuclear family, tends to overlook one particularly significant aspect of marriage. When you marry, you are trading families. That's why Oonagh's mother and father are your mother-in-law and father-in-law. You are another son. That's how that works.

My sister-in-law has crazy parents. They are a threat to my nieces and nephew. You have raised concerns that your own parents are dangerously negligent to your children. You owe it not just to your children, not just to yourself and your wife, but also to Oonagh's family to not allow your parents to bring harm to your children.

On top of that, both my brother's kids and his wife are my family, too. Her parents have crazied at her one too many times. She should not put up with that bullshit anymore. That's not what the holidays are for. Now she spends them with us. She has a family that does family things with her. She doesn't suffer for not seeing her parents anymore.

That's the only leverage you have as an adult. As long as you keep visiting your parents in their house, they will never change. It's still their house, and their rules. That clashes with your child, your rules. So your child doesn't go to their house. Period. You're a grown man. You have a place where you get to set the rules, it's called your house, and that's the only place they get to see you or your children. If they can't behave themselves, they get the **** out.

While they're acting the fool, you've got more family who don't treat you that way. Spend your holidays with them. Do your family stuff with them. Spend your family time with the family that treats you right. I know it works. We've done it for my sister-in-law. You're not an outsider. You're not some guy who married Oonagh. You're their son, their brother, and their uncle. You're family, too.

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Buckle your pants or they might fall down.

Corolinth:

While there isn't much else I've found myself agreeing with you on, your family advice has been amazingly wise and I have taken much of it to heart.

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This must be Thursday. I could never get the hang of Thursdays.

I've always have said that. TY Corolinth. My RULES, MY HOUSE! I have always said that to Foamy. Their house my son acts like a nightmare and I'll be damned first before I see them anymore do anything to my kids. **** THEM. I am Sorry that, Mom,could never stand up to her in-laws, but that isn't my way, no matter how crazy she is she will here when they do something wrong.

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"None is more important, none more legitimate, than that of rendering the people safe as they are the
ultimate guardians of their own liberty."- Thomas Jefferson

"Yeah, I'm rehearsing my poker face. I don't handle stupid well. *sigh*" - Farsky

This, this, a million times over this.

If you don't like them, if you find them abusive, annoying, disrespectful, dangerous, whatever...never enter their home.

If they dislike that, oh **** well.










Also, TheRiov, you've just treated yourself to a big ol' bowl of dickishness this Christmas season, haven't you?

So, to correct a point, I should point out that my wife is distressed by her alienation from her parents (well, parent, that's a story that I'll share a bit further down), she is just less distressed than she would be by having them in her life. There is certainly an appreciable and observable difference in her stress levels now vs. prior to total separation. I can sympathize with the trepidation, but it's really for the best. There's a jag you'll have to get over, and it's not easy, but you have to bear in mind that it's not (solely) about you.

My wife has two siblings, a brother and a sister. Neither of them will have anything to do with their parents, either. None of them emerged unscathed from their childhood. It was, so far as I have been able to piece together, very bad. I do not think your situation is as bad, but it's difficult enough that I think you should pursue the same approach.

To give you an idea of how crazy my in-laws are, my mother-in-law died this past April. Nobody knew about it until September/October sometime when my wife ran across an entry on one of the people-finder sites indicating that her mother had, in fact, died this year. She ended up having a probation officer friend of hers query the bureau of vital records to confirm. When confronted, the father related that the mother's wishes were for nobody to be told. Now, I put it to you, what kind of a mind would make that sort of request, and what sort of a mind would think it was a good idea and go along with it?

You won't be able to modify your parents' behavior or attitudes. You have a shot with your brother, and I'd recommend you don't write him off just yet. I do recommend that you put his face through a wall, though. I'm of the mind that police and lawyers don't need to be brought into sibling disagreements. Mr. Clue-by-four, however, is very influential.

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