The Glade 4.0

I don't see how you think the US would have maintained that kind of economic success with the loss of Europe as a meaningful trade partner. Loaning money is all well and good, but in the meantime, things would not be rosy, and how do you think Europe would react to such callous treatment? Your view of conservatives (and therefor conservative presidents) in general as willing to accept the nuclear annihiliation of large parts of 2 continents just to maintain an economic edge is, likewise, silly and childish.

There's also the fact that the U.S. didn't always have the best picture of how far behind the Soviets really were, and finally, thee question of what degree of success the Soviets would even have had in retaliating. Some studies indicate the RAF would have essentially neutralized Soviet retaliation before SAC could even get there. There is considerable room to question whether the Soviets would, in that era, have been able to coordinate retaliation once under attack at all.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Well, except that the Republicans weren't really hawkish back then like they are now, and you're just buying into dumbshit party rhetoric.

But whatever. Really, REALLY irrelevant to George Zimmerman.

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

Childish? When was the last time you read a college level general History textbook? You know, the ones used by the general History classes pretty much everyone with a degree is required to take? I give "conservatives" a lot more credit than most. These books are usually more than willing to suggest that JFKs conservative military advisers were willing to accept the nuclear annihilation of three continents. (the fact that we had total superiority over the Soviets in 1962 is never mentioned) At best, the implication is they do so just so they can say that they "won" or "didn't back down." At worst, the implication is that they just wanted to slaughter Communists so badly that they were willing to pay any price to do so. The famous quote by some General who's name I forget about how, "at the end of the war, if there's two Americans and one Russian, we win" is usually thrown in there.

Ya know if Trayvon Martin had been from outer space, he could have just disintegrated Zimmerman. See I can make up hypotheticals that have no point or baring on reality either.

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I prefer to think of them as "Fighting evil in another dimension"

Thanks DE

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Wrong thread.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

The last time I was in college. Why the **** would I read a textbook? There's plenty of regular books on history out there to read - many of them written by the same professors that produce the textbooks.







When? During the Cuban Missile Crisis? In the event of a general war? Accept it in return for what, exactly? Who the **** are his "conservative " advisors?

Strategists at that time were willing to accept that widespread nuclear devastation would be the cost of a generalized nuclear war, which in turn would most likely result from a Soviet invasion of Western Europe. They accepted that this was a likely consequence, not that it was something they were perfectly ok with happening. Even LeMay did not (contrary to popular misconception) advocate preventative nuclear war, but rather pre-emptive. The difference is important, becuase pre-emptive war is war commenced only when an enemy attack is imminent.



That was LeMay's quote, and it was intended to illustrate the reality of "victory" in a nuclear war as theory at the time existed - you will note that there's no actual empirical data on the subject.

Frankly, I don't care what your textbooks are implying, since they are fairly obviously trying to preserve the popular image of JFK as some hero statesman who stopped the total destruction of both sides. In point of fact, JFK bought into the fictitious missile gap" in the 1960 campaign. There was the Bomber gap as well. Like the Iraqi WMD mirage, this was a matter of people seeing what they wanted to see rather than actually fabricating anything, but the simple fact is that by the time the Cuban Missile Crisis rolled around, Kennedy knew full well that the Russians had no credible intercontinental deterrent - it had around 2 dozen ICBMs and those could take up to 20 hours to prepare for launch; more than enough time for British (much less American) bombers to destroy them.

That was, in fact, why Kruschev wanted missiles in Cuba. The Soviets were doing much better with short range than long range missiles, and that would be a way to maintain a deterrent. Your textbooks, in trying to preserve a fictitious view of history in which the bloodthirsty conservatives want war at any cost, and only the wisdom of the wise liberal messiah Kennedy kept us from it ignores the giant elephant in the room of why the Soviets wanted missiles in Cuba at all.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

^ That. Kennedy was a do-nothing philandering idiot who talked a good game but accomplished nothing in office except making literally everything he touched worse.

Hmmm that sounds familiar.

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He was also young, good looking, and managed to get himself spectacularly assassinated - the latter being his most significant accomplishment.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Utter bullshit. You have either made a very poor interpretation of the information you were given, or were given completely erroneous information and chose to accept them as fact without giving the matter a second thought. The members of EXCOMM became so concerned with the possibility of nuclear war that during the latter part of the Cuban Missile Crisis, they shifted their thinking away from how to remove the missiles from Cuba and devoted their energies on how to prevent a nuclear war. If you're interested in learning something, take a look at The Shattered Crystal Ball: Fear and Learning in the Cuban Missile Crisis by James G. Blight. It has also been argued that the fear of nuclear war was so prevalent among the members of EXCOMM that they had to studiously avoid bringing it up constantly in order to make any decisions. Perhaps you could listen to the tapes of the meetings yourself and then tell me that all his "conservative advisers" were desirous of the "nuclear annihilation of three continents": http://millercenter.org/scripps/archive ... 62/10_1962 .

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"Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko

"George Zimmerman, who has been in hiding since he was acquitted of murder in the death of Trayvon Martin, emerged to help rescue a family who was trapped in an overturned vehicle, police said today.

Zimmerman was one of two men who came to the aid of a family of four -- two parents and two children -- trapped inside a blue Ford Explorer SUV that had rolled over after traveling off the highway in Sanford, Fla. at approximately 5:45 p.m. Thursday, the Seminole County Sheriff's Office said in a statement.

The crash occurred at the intersection of I-4 and route Route 46, police said. The crash site is less than a mile from where Zimmerman shot Martin.

By the time police arrived, two people - including Zimmerman - had already helped the family get out of the overturned car, the sheriff's office said. No one was reported to be injured.

Zimmerman was not a witness to the crash and left after speaking with the deputy, police said."

http://abcnews.go.com/US/george-zimmerm ... d=19735432

How is this news?

I mean, I'm glad he helped those people, but really.... there's nothing else newsworthy in the whole entire **** world?

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

Obviously, he did that in a cynical ploy to sway public opinion to think of him as a good samaritan who selflessly helps others, instead of as a hating hater who hates.

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You should submit that to the tipline. I hear they're looking for this sort of information.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Wait, wait. You want your Hatorade?

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Buckle your pants or they might fall down.

What color were the occupants of the vehicle?

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Obviously not black or he would have shot them in the face.

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The Dude abides.

The vehicle was black. He was profiling against black vehicles! It proves his racism! Charge him now!

Seriously the comments section makes me wish for an alien race to build a superhighway through here.

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A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. ~ John Stuart Mill

Well if he hadn't run them off the road in the first place they wouldn't have needed saving.

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I forgot. Meanwhile, I wonder what happened to the LAPD officers who magdumped two vehicles a while ago?

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A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. ~ John Stuart Mill

Can we get back to the cold war argumen? That was far more interesting than the rest of the thread.

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Holy shitsnacks!

JFK was a douche and people who hero worship him are retards.

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Too much?

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Good for him. Way to rise above it all. I'm afraid I'd have just said "forget it, it isn't worth it" it after what he's been through.

It's news because while he's in hiding for fear of his life, he still took the time to do the right thing, despite the way he's been treated. I could use more news like that.

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I prefer to think of them as "Fighting evil in another dimension"

They got charged with something (I forget exactly what) and the two women got a $5 million settlement.