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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm 
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Because fags can't teach math? Or be cops? Or judges? Or principals?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:45 pm 
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Müs wrote:
Because fags can't teach math? Or be cops? Or judges? Or principals?


People on this board get very upset when they find out public schools are encouraging things like socialism or excessive environmentalism. That doesn't mean the teachers who believe those things are incompetent at teaching math or science, but we know that often these views will bleed into their teaching. While I'm obviously pro-gay rights I could easily see how Bery or anyone who is vehemently opposed to homosexuality would be concerned by a gay teacher implicitly teaching their kids that homosexuality should be tolerated.


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 Post subject: Re: Obama's fisting Czar
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:46 pm 
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Xequecal wrote:
Khross wrote:
Yay! More out of context scripture used to defend the preposterous notion that Homosexuality is contagious. But, we do have proof that bigotry is.


He's not arguing that homosexuality is contagious, he's arguing that homosexuals shouldn't be allowed to teach kids because they might teach the kids that homosexuality is acceptable or even something to take pride in.


Would Bery object to heterosexuals teaching that heterosexual is right and something to be prideful of. Based on his answer, I think so. In fact, he just said so.

I am opposed to gay marriage. I am opposed to it because I believe marriage is not an institution of government, that our right to be married does not come from government, and thus all laws regarding marriage are wrong. Additionally, I don't find them Constitutional. Marriage is not an institution that should have any such standing with regards to taxes and the like. Willing one's possessions can be done under private contract, already, outside of marriage.

Would you say I'm bigoted and anti-gay?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:56 pm 
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And I think that it could also be said that people who dogmatically and unquestioningly chastise gays should not be in any position of authority over children.

Love your fellow man, love your enemy, treat others as you wish to be treated. Maybe we should just start ***** at Bery for being straight and so angsty against gays.

Because if he follows the teachings of Christ; he obviously wants to be treated the way he treats gays.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama's fisting Czar
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:00 pm 
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Rafael:

It was the "adultery" qualifier Beryllin challenged. That said, I find your understanding of the word "marriage" to be a bit problematic. The "right" to marry only comes from God if you believe in that God. Of course, I also think government should get the **** out of Dodge on the matter, but for entirely different reasons.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:07 pm 
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I wouldn't call "adultery" a qualifier because he specifically cited it as an example, and a non-exclusive one at that.

However, God may or may not be a construct of man. Therefore, the right of marriage may not be a construct of man as well. The Convenant of Marriage in specific instances most certainly comes from God, but I'm speaking in generalities.

I think Constitutionality is more than enough, and frankly, the only thing that needs to be said about the matter of Government involvement.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama's fisting Czar
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:13 pm 
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Beryllin wrote:
Khross wrote:
Yay! More out of context scripture used to defend the preposterous notion that Homosexuality is contagious. But, we do have proof that bigotry is.


Yeah, God forbid that the Scriptures actually disagree with you. The "out of context" defense seems to be the real popular one recently.

*edit* Scripturally, the burden of educating children is delegated to fathers from OT times on, and allowing children to be taught things that are in violation of the Scriptural teaching is a big no-no. For example:

In Joshua 4, to memorialize the crossing of the Jordan, 12 stones were heaped as a memorial, ..."that this may be a sign among you when your children ask in time to come, saying, "What do these stones mean to you?" Then you shall answer them....". But in Judges 2, we find that Joshua died, was buried, and then these words: "When all that generation had been gathered to their fathers, another generation arose after them who did not know the Lord nor the work He had done for Israel. Then the children of Israel did evil in the sight of the Lord, and served the Baals; and they forsook the Lord God of their fathers...And the anger of the Lord was hot against Israel. So He delivered them into the hands of plunderers who despoiled them; and He sold them into the hands of their enemies all around, so that they could no longer stand before their enemies. Wherever they went out, the hand of the Lord was against them for calamity, as the Lord had said, and as the Lord had sworn to them. And they were greatly distressed."

Why did a generation arise that did not know the Lord? The fathers did not properly teach the children.


Quoting myself because I don't want the edit to get buried and missed.


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 Post subject: Re: Obama's fisting Czar
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:21 pm 
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Beryllin:

You assume I think your Bible agrees with my position or judgment of your statements and behavior. Consequently, you think I assume there is scripture to defend or corroborate my position. Unfortunately, since you're only assuming, you're grossly inaccurate on the matter.

So, I will repeat myself: You are taking Scripture out of context to attack something that you find repugnant. You are using the Bible as a bludgeon against those who disagree with you in hopes that its historical and philosophical weight will somehow convince them that their beliefs are wrong. That's called an appeal to authority (God), appeal to tradition (religiosity), and appeal to popularity. Unfortunately, it's not flying.

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Corolinth wrote:
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:28 pm 
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Wait, I just figured it all out ...

Beryllin anger and frustration is misdirected, because he can not longer focus it on the statistically gay highschool teacher he had back in the day. The one he didn't know was gay!

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Corolinth wrote:
Facism is not a school of thought, it is a racial slur.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:38 pm 
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Xequecal wrote:
That doesn't mean the teachers who believe those things are incompetent at teaching math or science, but we know that often these views will bleed into their teaching.


Actually, that's exactly what it means to me.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama's fisting Czar
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:48 pm 
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Khross wrote:
Beryllin:

You assume I think your Bible agrees with my position or judgment of your statements and behavior. Consequently, you think I assume there is scripture to defend or corroborate my position. Unfortunately, since you're only assuming, you're grossly inaccurate on the matter.

So, I will repeat myself: You are taking Scripture out of context to attack something that you find repugnant. You are using the Bible as a bludgeon against those who disagree with you in hopes that its historical and philosophical weight will somehow convince them that their beliefs are wrong. That's called an appeal to authority (God), appeal to tradition (religiosity), and appeal to popularity. Unfortunately, it's not flying.


Actually, your opinion or judgment or belief is immaterial to God and what He expects of people. He will judge according to what He says, and "But I believe...." will not be a defense. Nor will "But I don't believe...." He will dismiss both as immaterial.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:52 pm 
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Sounds suspiciously like the reasoning capabilities of some on this board.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:53 pm 
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DFK! wrote:
Xequecal wrote:
That doesn't mean the teachers who believe those things are incompetent at teaching math or science, but we know that often these views will bleed into their teaching.


Actually, that's exactly what it means to me.


If their views bleed into their teaching, that means they are incompetent at teaching that subject.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:55 pm 
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Beryllin wrote:
Actually, your opinion or judgment or belief is immaterial to God and what He expects of people. He will judge according to what He says, and "But I believe...." will not be a defense. Nor will "But I don't believe...." He will dismiss both as immaterial.


That God is of that nature, God would take such action and that God exists at all is also your belief, no more substantial than Khross'.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:57 pm 
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Rafael wrote:
DFK! wrote:
Xequecal wrote:
That doesn't mean the teachers who believe those things are incompetent at teaching math or science, but we know that often these views will bleed into their teaching.


Actually, that's exactly what it means to me.


If their views bleed into their teaching, that means they are incompetent at teaching that subject.


And that they have an agenda to push that has nothing to do with educating children. Math teachers should teach math and keep their personal lives and viewpoints to themselves. Just as an example.


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 Post subject: Re: Obama's fisting Czar
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:04 pm 
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Rafael wrote:
Beryllin wrote:
Actually, your opinion or judgment or belief is immaterial to God and what He expects of people. He will judge according to what He says, and "But I believe...." will not be a defense. Nor will "But I don't believe...." He will dismiss both as immaterial.


That God is of that nature, God would take such action and that God exists at all is also your belief, no more substantial than Khross'.


I did not say otherwise, except to point out that the Scriptures declare that even nature points to God:

"The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament shows His handiwork. Day unto day utters speech, and night unto night reveals knowledge. There is no speech nor language where their voice is not heard. Their line has gone out through all the earth, and their words to the ends of the world. In them He has set a tabernacle for the sun, ....."


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:12 pm 
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DFK! wrote:
Xequecal wrote:
That doesn't mean the teachers who believe those things are incompetent at teaching math or science, but we know that often these views will bleed into their teaching.


Actually, that's exactly what it means to me.


This is like claiming that any journalist that doesn't completely eliminate all bias is an incompetent journalist. It's impossible to completely separate your political views from everything else you do.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:14 pm 
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Xequecal wrote:
DFK! wrote:
Xequecal wrote:
That doesn't mean the teachers who believe those things are incompetent at teaching math or science, but we know that often these views will bleed into their teaching.


Actually, that's exactly what it means to me.


This is like claiming that any journalist that doesn't completely eliminate all bias is an incompetent journalist. It's impossible to completely separate your political views from everything else you do.


Actually it's not like that at all.

Would you like me to explain why, or do you get it and you were just trying to elicit a response?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:18 pm 
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Teachers are not robots, nor should they (nor can they) act like it. Who they are (which includes what they believe) will always bleed --at least a little bit-- into what they teach, no matter the subject. Instructor led teaching is proven to work best if there is a personal element involved--people generally don't care what you have to say until they know a bit about who you are. So either the students are going to on average learn less, or yes, the personal views and lives of all those goddamned breeders they hire to teach kids are going to cause them to want to stick Tab A into Slot B and ruin them! Or something.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:23 pm 
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Talya wrote:
Teachers are not robots, nor should they (nor can they) act like it. Who they are (which includes what they believe) will always bleed --at least a little bit-- into what they teach, no matter the subject. Instructor led teaching is proven to work best if there is a personal element involved--people generally don't care what you have to say until they know a bit about who you are. So either the students are going to on average learn less, or yes, the personal views and lives of all those goddamned breeders they hire to teach kids are going to cause them to want to stick Tab A into Slot B and ruin them! Or something.


Thank you for reinforcing my point, that parents who care about such things should remove their children from the public schools and into private schools that have teachers who hold the same values as the parents. I appreciate it.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:28 pm 
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Beryllin wrote:
Talya wrote:
Teachers are not robots, nor should they (nor can they) act like it. Who they are (which includes what they believe) will always bleed --at least a little bit-- into what they teach, no matter the subject. Instructor led teaching is proven to work best if there is a personal element involved--people generally don't care what you have to say until they know a bit about who you are. So either the students are going to on average learn less, or yes, the personal views and lives of all those goddamned breeders they hire to teach kids are going to cause them to want to stick Tab A into Slot B and ruin them! Or something.


Thank you for reinforcing my point, that parents who care about such things should remove their children from the public schools and into private schools that have teachers who hold the same values as the parents. I appreciate it.


Because insulation from the real world is always the best solution... :roll:


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:31 pm 
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Aizle wrote:
Beryllin wrote:
Talya wrote:
Teachers are not robots, nor should they (nor can they) act like it. Who they are (which includes what they believe) will always bleed --at least a little bit-- into what they teach, no matter the subject. Instructor led teaching is proven to work best if there is a personal element involved--people generally don't care what you have to say until they know a bit about who you are. So either the students are going to on average learn less, or yes, the personal views and lives of all those goddamned breeders they hire to teach kids are going to cause them to want to stick Tab A into Slot B and ruin them! Or something.


Thank you for reinforcing my point, that parents who care about such things should remove their children from the public schools and into private schools that have teachers who hold the same values as the parents. I appreciate it.


Because insulation from the real world is always the best solution... :roll:



Given that "the real world" has roundly rejected popular votes to legalize gay marriage (and thus, according to some, legitimize it), I'm pretty sure if we use whatever standard you're using (which appears to be majority rule), it would be you who isn't in the real world.

Not that I really care much about the gay marriage issue.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:33 pm 
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Beryllin wrote:
Rafael wrote:
That God is of that nature, God would take such action and that God exists at all is also your belief, no more substantial than Khross'.


I did not say otherwise, except to point out that the Scriptures declare that even nature points to God:

"The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament shows His handiwork. Day unto day utters speech, and night unto night reveals knowledge. There is no speech nor language where their voice is not heard. Their line has gone out through all the earth, and their words to the ends of the world. In them He has set a tabernacle for the sun, ....."


So? What is "special" about the Scripture? In order for the Scripture to be some sort of axiom, one must believe in it. If they proclaim the Word of God and decry that which is not, in order for this to be the case, you must believe that they are divine.

They cannot be Divine because they proclaim the Word of God or that God is Divine. They are proclaiming God is Divine. What would it mean to say that because they proclaim God to be Divine, they are Divine because we know that God is Divine because the Scripture proclaimed it to be so?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:33 pm 
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DFK! wrote:
Aizle wrote:
Because insulation from the real world is always the best solution... :roll:



Given that "the real world" has roundly rejected popular votes to legalize gay marriage (and thus, according to some, legitimize it), I'm pretty sure if we use whatever standard you're using (which appears to be majority rule), it would be you who isn't in the real world.

Not that I really care much about the gay marriage issue.


In his face. In his face, big time. He can't have his cake and eat it. He can't even have it or eat it. He can't even know what cake is.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:40 pm 
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Aizle wrote:
Beryllin wrote:
Talya wrote:
Teachers are not robots, nor should they (nor can they) act like it. Who they are (which includes what they believe) will always bleed --at least a little bit-- into what they teach, no matter the subject. Instructor led teaching is proven to work best if there is a personal element involved--people generally don't care what you have to say until they know a bit about who you are. So either the students are going to on average learn less, or yes, the personal views and lives of all those goddamned breeders they hire to teach kids are going to cause them to want to stick Tab A into Slot B and ruin them! Or something.


Thank you for reinforcing my point, that parents who care about such things should remove their children from the public schools and into private schools that have teachers who hold the same values as the parents. I appreciate it.


Because insulation from the real world is always the best solution... :roll:


And who is doing that? You think when I took my children to the Renfest, they didn't see things I would not have approved of? Or to the mall?

It's one thing to let your children see all the troubles in the world, and teach them what God says about why these troubles come to the world. It is something else entirely to give a position of authority over your child to someone with whom you vastly disagree, concerning their worldview.


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