The Glade 4.0

AHA! Thanks FarSky, that was the snippet I was looking for earlier on when Khross was looking for more reading.

Yes, strawman. You're changing my argument to something I am not arguing to make it easier to attack. I never said it was ok to take children out of Haiti with no documentation or proof. So yes, strawman.

It certainly doesn't.

Again, I'm only speaking to the branding of such things as that DE and Farsky spoke of as criminal acts and saying that nothing "nefarious" happened in the detaining of individuals. Nefarious being subjective, they need a better label.

That's my sole point.

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

Strawman, strawman, strawman, strawman, strawman, strawman, strawman, strawman, strawman, strawman.

Just saying it over and over again makes you wrong, and makes me right, right?

I'm not going to assert whether you did or didn't make any such argument. But I will point out that it's rather hard for people to know what you have or haven't said when you've gone out of your way to nuke all of your post history in this thread.

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Sail forth! steer for the deep waters only!
Reckless, O soul, exploring, I with thee, and thou with me;
For we are bound where mariner has not yet dared to go,
And we will risk the ship, ourselves and all.

Which is good, as far as it goes. It does show that the group was not trying to fly under the radar and get kids out for trafficking purposes; the Dominican Republic was aware of their efforts. And I won't say more.

True enough, and frankly I don't care. People are going to believe what they want to no matter what. People who know me even just a little would know beyond doubt I would never make such an argument. I can't help what others believe and don't really care.

Multiple times you've said that you don't care, and that people will not change their minds on the subject. Apparently this doesn't stop you from trying, though.

Stupidity is trying the same thing over and over, expecting different results.

Well *maybe* it shows they weren't trying to fly under the Dominican Republic's radar. However, it's Haiti's radar they should have been more concerned with obviously.

That's the argument you've been making this whole time. I can scrawl "I CAN HAZ KIDZ PLZ" on a piece of paper and present it to an adoption agency, but I'm not going to be walking out with a child. Why? Because that's not the authorization they're looking for. That holds no weight.

The Dominican Republic may have been aware of their actions...so what? They were taking the children out of Haiti, who had not signed off on the transfer.

Edit: Damn, Aizle beat me to it. Took too much time trying to make my LOLcat-ese authentic.

Except that I don't expect different results. And it's "insanity", not "stupidity".

Beryllin:

Let me translate the diplomacy-speak into simple English for you, since it seems to be causing some sort of cognitive dissonance: "You're going to go to jail if you persist in your current course of action."

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Insanity.

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

The quote originally states insanity, yes, but feel free to argue against stupidity.

You've repeatedly asserted that requiring such proof is red tape, and causing children to die. How exactly is that different?

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Not so. My argument pretty much this whole time has been that y'all are rushing to judgment that the group is either criminal or idiots without full knowledge of what actually happened on the ground there. It's really easy for folks here to sit back in their easy chairs and criticize and condemn those who got off their lazy butts and actually went down there to help people in dire need of help.

It's especially easy to do so when that group creates a problem for themself that no one else is having.

By "sitting on my ***" here, I'm at least not causing any counterproductive problems for the rest of the rescue offort, or an international incident which means I'm contributing more than these idiots are.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Yeah, because that gives you an excuse not to consider the truthfulness of someone who's telling you that you don't know the whole story, even though unless you actually were there it's obvious you don't know the whole story. Were you there, DE? Do you know what gov't officials (in the Dominican Republic as well as in Haiti) the group or its leader met with? Were you privy to the conversations? Unless you can answer those questions with a "yes", you're rushing to judgment without knowing the whole story. And for that, y'all have earned condemnation and a lack of respect.

Many of you have judged them based on what the media is reporting, and I'm supposed to respect you after that? I don't think so.

Beryllin:

The statements of the Dominican Consul are pretty clear. Silsby was warned that if she did not comply with Haitian rules, that there would be criminal charges of a human rights variety. Silsby did not comply with Haitian rules. Criminal charges were brought. It's really that simple.

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Of course it is.

So you're 100% sure that Silsby or the group did not meet with Haitian officials. Guess you were there, then.

Beryllin:

Rules compliance and meeting with Haitian officials are not mutually exclusive. Your last post is, in point of fact, a strawman. The facts are this:

1. The Dominican Consul warned Silsby, quite specifically, that her plans ran the risk of Human Trafficking charges if they did not comply with Haitian rules.

2. Silsby and her group were arrested for Human Trafficking.

3. Haitian authorities have stated that Silsby and her group had paperwork issues.

So, yes, it really is that simple. Silsby persisted in a course of action she was advised would have negative consequences.

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Again I say: You were there, right?

What is really "that simple" is that all you really know is what is reported in the media. And we all know that the media never gets it wrong....

Beryllin:

Do you have any verifiable facts to the contrary that events happened any differently than I stated?

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Beryllin,

The only reason you even know Silsby exists is from the media, and all the information you have about her is from the media. With your line of arguing, you might as well not talk about her.

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"The map is not the territory."

I don't know with 100% certainty. It kinda depends on certain circumstances. What I do know, I have first hand. I won't divulge more.