The Glade 4.0

Article from Fox about potential problems with garage sales and recalled products. It is a little bit on the sensationalist side, but I can see lawsuits on this.

A small excerpt from the article:



Thoughts?

Some days I really hate our society.

That's spectacular.

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What about your government?

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Yeah, sometimes. But from my viewpoint, the goverment is just a reflection of our society. If you want to change government, change society.

While I agree that government reflects society, that's not an excuse for the government to behave in an outrageous manner.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

I remember this being a hot topic in the news a couple of years ago after a tragic event triggered notice of the issue.
Baby stuff is commonly resold on ebay, garage sales, etc. Stuff is stored and forgotten, given away later, hand me downs....its so hard to recognize what is safe, and what was included in a recall 10 years ago.
I think it makes more sense to have a "buyer beware" attitude. Parents should research things themselves or exercise common sense before buying that used crib from the thrift store.
The exception to this would be large scale resellers..I'm only referring to people selling off their kids old stuff on ebay or at a yard sale.
I'm on the fence about thrift stores like the salvation army....they don't have the resources to regulate this sort of thing, I don't think, but on the other hand many of their customers don't either.

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"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth

I don't disagree. But when the government is reflecting the wishes of society, they are the ones who decide what outrageous is.

That would be a problem with government behavior then. There's some aspects of society tht are pretty absurd.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

Exactly my point. Sadly, the only way I can see to change that is to try and continue to influence society.

Except that we didn't set up a pure democracy for precisely that reason. We're not supposed to be governed by mob rule. Society can wish whatever it wants, but it cannot merely steamroll its wishes into governmental action -- no matter how popular those wishes are, or how few people think their outcome is outrageous.

Not that it directly pertains to this issue, necessarily -- I'm just pointing out that this is the key difference between rule-by-popular-demand and rule-by-law with an intentionally limited government.

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Sail forth! steer for the deep waters only!
Reckless, O soul, exploring, I with thee, and thou with me;
For we are bound where mariner has not yet dared to go,
And we will risk the ship, ourselves and all.

I completely agree Stathol. That's one of the reasons why I don't typically get all pissed off when some elected official doesn't go directly with "the will of the people".

Of course it's easier to stomach that when what they are doing agrees with my opinions on the matter, just like everyone else.

Except, government changes society. Society does not change government, except by violent application of force. If you look at the phenomenology of 20th Century America, you find that government and elected officials are the driving force behind societal change and shifts in value sets.

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Neither works completely in a vacuum. I believe you are overstating your point, and if you look at any example of government imposing changes on society you will see a concerted effort of at least a section of society putting extreme pressure on that government to impose those changes.

I entirely disagree. Government is incapable of changing society unless society first allows and often demands the change. We can not be controlled by government in any way unless we are at the stage of allowing the control. This goes for all things.

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"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville

Government can become a tool by which to bring about change. For example, our society changed significantly during the Civil Rights era, and violent force was not what changed it, despite the violence that occurred during that time. People, through government, changed our society is a significant way. I think that serves as an endorsement of peaceful change over violent revolution.

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It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans.
---The Daily Show

Aizle and Monte:

It really doesn't happen that way. Popular support for social change occurs after a hegemonic imposition of will. In fact, the Civl Rights Movement is a pretty good example. Theoretically, legal reform should have caused social reform to take place far more quickly, but it didn't. Rather, we're still dealing with the after effects of top down imposition. Natural phenomenology was circumvented by the government, as it has been in almost every major shift in American social values since the Civil War.

Natural societal shifts are so subtle that you cannot mark them with any event or even a clear series of events that delineate the social change. Moreover, they take an exceedingly long time to cultivate.

For example, it's often said on these forums that every generation thinks the succeeding generation is worse, with the implication that there's no real difference. There is, however, a marked change in values and work ethic from generation to generation. Likewise, younger generations are marked by a broader sense of entitlement to government assistance and favorable opinions toward government solutions to social problems. 100 years ago that opinion would have been anathema to the vast majority of Americans. It's a long way to go from Natty Bumppo to Octo-Mom.

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