The Glade 4.0

Yeah, I thought so too. Still, I'm betting they can shelve it and not bring it to a vote.

The bill is signed. It'll take an exorcism to be rid of it now.

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In time, this too shall pass.

Eh, they'll vote against it, as well as all the other amendments that are being presented.

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"Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko

On CNN they're mentioning a provision of the health care bill I've never heard of before - that private health insurers will be required to spend 85% of collected premiums on health care costs. That effectively socializes the whole system without having the government control anything. With 85% of all money collected required to be spent on health care costs, the insurance companies won't have anything left to spend on hallmarks of the private insurance system. Things like advertising, fraud investigations, extensive claims auditing, etc. It's essentially telling the entire industry they have to run their companies like Medicare - while turning a profit.

I'm sorry, this framing just makes me laugh. And cry.

I hate our legislators.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

Health insurance advertises?

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Sure. Just not to individuals, because nobody buys individual insurance anymore (*sigh*). But you can bet your *** they advertise targetting the HR people in charge of companies' benefit plans.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

*Flips through SHRM Magazine*

**** you're right, they do.

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Which is why health care will be unavailable in this country in five years. Either that, or more doctors going into private practice will only accept cash, while the government still allows them to. Essentially, what this "reform" has accomplished is to destroy the best, most accessible health care in the world, and replace it with a system in which only members of unions, elected officials, government employees, and the uber wealthy have access to quality care.

/golfclap

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Ezekiel 23:19-20 

Also people who have the foresight to save money in advance, since a cash-only doctor is going to charge you a lot less than he charges insurance.

What's sad is in my experience liberals agree with the assertion that, "it's going to be run like Medicare" and think this is a good thing. In my experience, liberals view private insurance companies as horribly greedy corrupt organizations that are running 50% profit margins based off of denying people needed care on technicalities. Don't bother pointing out that it's more like 5%, they'll claim any source that says so is doctored.

I think you may have just exposed the real agenda.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

That's what they do on every issue.

Global warming? It's "industry shills" for "big oil", not prudent science

National defense? It's the "military-industrial complex", not a need to replace fighters that are pushing 30 years old and bombers so old the current crews' grandfathers may have flown them.

Banks? It's "corporate greed" not the rush to make sure every ******* buys a home.

No matter what the issue is, facts that don't fit the liberal political model are tossed aside. It's not surprising. Liberalism is simply socialism watered down to a high degree. It exhibits watered-down tendencies that are the same, no different than Mao or Khruschev making decisions based on what their political model says should be rather than what is.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

You've come along way baby.

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"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville

You aren't kidding. This is why X has long been one of my favourite posters. His willingness to grow.

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Ezekiel 23:19-20 

You folks crying about Obamacare don't get a lot of sympathy from me. I've expressed the opinion plenty of times over the years that the U.S. has been going down the wrong path for decades, and in far too many cases, Gladers have applauded things I felt/feel were bad for us and pushed for things I feel will be to our detriment.

IMO, the U.S. is getting what it deserves. It's sown for decades, and continues to sow, and harvest is fast approaching. *shrug*

/derogatory comments incoming!

My father just finished writing a review of the health care bill for his company; he's a partner in the largest locally owned an operated accounting firm in Utah. They have many businesses and clients that are worth millions, and they needed a concise version that they could give to clients and use to advise them.

The advice they're giving? If you're a business looking to save a little money, don't offer health care to your employees anymore. The $166.67 per employee per month charge you'd have to pay is far less than the $600+ you'd pay to offer health care. Tell them all to sign up for whatever state run option they can get.

He said if you want to sum it up in one sentence, it would be "A health care bill designed to force everyone into government provided health care by making all other options more expensive or harder to get and use.

And a side note: The economy just cost me my third job in a row. The first sold to a competitor because they couldn't get summer funding (a summer sales company). The second went under just after they offered me the job, as congress recently changed the way they could charge customers, and the company was no longer viable (I don't really know more than that). The third was a job at a local national park who received so little funding this year that they couldn't hire all the rangers and guides they actually need. Had a great 30m conversation with the Head Ranger who really wanted to hire me but just couldn't; he had too many people with seniority apply and even then couldn't hire all of them either. He did tell me that if one more position opens up somehow that it would be mine, but he didn't see it happening.

But at least now I can be charged for not having health care next year at tax time, because I can't afford it!

Having personally worked in the insurance industry before, I can assure you that the margins are considerably more than 5%. The company I worked for usually sat closer to the 35-45% range.

My company (not health) runs at CR of .92 or $.08/dollar is profit. Many other carriers in our corner of the industry run over 1.0 and make their profits on investments.

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Is that 8% figure you're using including profit from investments with the premiums?

No Combined Ratio is a measure of underwriting profitability and does not include investment activities. This is what the law referenced above is discussing; 85% of premiums must be spent on healthcare. If they double their 15% in the market they don't need to spend a penny more on healthcare.

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Exactly. Out of curiosity then for your company, how much profit do they make on the investments that are made with that 8%?

The "fixes" bill just passed by the Senate triples that penalty, so he might want to evaluate it again.

$500 < $600 still though.

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Holy shitsnacks!

By my math, he accepted as fact that the Senate would accept the House changes in his estimate... $167 * 12 = ~$2,000, which I believe is the penalty under the House plan.

Of course, what might have been neglected, and has been by the media for the most part, is that the House plan also lowers the adjustments in calculating what constitutes the "Cadillac" plans moving forward, so much so that by the time it actually kicks in under the House plan, the vast majority of plans as they exist today will qualify for the extra tax... welcome to AMI v2.

I've read that the Senate "fixes" bill substantially increases the threshold for when something qualifies as a "Cadillac plan."

I don't know what the House was thinking setting the Cadillac plan limit at $8,500 for an individual unless they were straight-up trying to just implement a huge stealth tax on corporations or run the insurance industry out of business.

Per-capita health spending in this country is about $4,800 and about 40 percent of the population is employed. Since the employed population has to pay for all that spending, directly or indirectly, there's no possible way any sufficiently large insurance company that insures a broad spectrum of the population can charge less than $8,500 a year per person.

I will not sign this pledge. Nor will I vote against Obama in the next election!

Of course, I won't vote for him, either. It's just this Canadian thing, you know...

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me
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