The Glade 4.0

I think we need more information about these cookies you mentioned.

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I'd argue otherwise. Unless someone is banned, the only reason they're not here is 'cause they don't want to be.

Things were this way when Sunmoon ran the show and I don't know that any other era was any different.

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In time, this too shall pass.

When *I* was a mod it was all milk and honey. *nods*

Oh...yes...of course. OTHER than that, though...

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In time, this too shall pass.

MILK! AND! HONEY!

(opaque and prone to spoilage. And sticky.)

Aside from the fact that McCarthyism is a totally nonreligious context it's only the same religious attitude in the most broad sense. In fact McCarthyism illustrates perfectly that religion really has nothing to do with this attitude so much as fear that ideas different than their own will become prevelant.

There is no reason it should be "worrying" you. It's a very long leap from "I think that what you believe is incorrect" to "I'm willing to kill you over it." Yes, this means there is a double standard that they have towards you, but it is absurd for you to worry about possible religious violence because people get their panties in a twist when you say "Blessed Be". Yes, there will always be some people who will engage in violence, but religious violence in our society is a small footnote of violence in general; most religious violence in the U.S. other than that perpetrated by outside attackers is conducted by people who would take any excuse to be violent.



Yes, you are. That's part of the unavoidable fact that there are assholes in the world. However, you can't reasonably ask that the assholes be ashamed of their beliefs (i.e. hide them from you) and then accuse them of flaunting them when they don't if you want to complain about this. You can either say "If they're going to flaunt them, so am I" or "I'm going to hide mine and then complain what assholes they are for flaunting theirs" but trying to have it both ways looks hypocritical.



Whether it is or not, and regardless of what you mean by "worse" neither you nor they would be "aggressive" by going and knocking on the other's door, much less overly so. There's nothing aggressive about knocking on someone's door. That is why we have front doors, walks, and addresses, so a person can make contact with you. If you don't wish to continue after they've done so that's up to you.



Thank you.



Except that they AREN'T in the majority (they're a small minority of what actually is the majority), and probably DON'T feel precisely safe, nor do they care about it. In fact, feeling that they're doing it despite possible danger would make them feel they were doing the "right thing".

Furthermore, they aren't "rubbing your nose in it". Like I said, that's what front doors are for. They can't read your mind and clearly some people DO welcome the invitation or they'd have gone to other methods.

I fully sympathize with your annoyance at their boorishness, but trying to paint it as some sort of unfair advantage they have is really not accurate.



Believeing that something is not okay is not the same as believing it IS ok to kill the person doing it, and it is a tremendous leap from one to the other. Saying "I'm afraid you might kill me because you disapprove of my behavior" ranges from unreasonable to paranoid.

As for it being comforting, yes it's rather comforting that I don't have to worry about pagans blowing things up, but I would be far more comforted if I saw muslims turning pagan.





For now, yes. I dn't predict any barrage of pagan jihadists any time soon, but it's really only a matter of time before you get your token crusaders too.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

I don't think so... for the same reason you don't see a whole lot of buddhist monks protesting except when they set themselves on fire. Paganism appeals to a very specific sort of person (much the way certain professions appeal to certain personalities), and the most dangerous crazies we get aren't violent or agressive, they're sleazy and sex crazed. Since there's no 'reward in the afterlife' there's no leverage to create fanatics willing to die for their faith. Douchebags and con artists abound, but the three-fold rule keeps out the fanatical powermongers.

You're really pretty overoptomistic if you think you won't get anyone crazy or who wants to crusade for it. All it takes is someone who, say, runs into one of the jackasses we've been discussing up to this point, but who decides they just can't take that sort of treatment.

The threefold rule isn't any different than any other religious rule in it's ability to keep people out. Christianity has lots of teachings that should theoretically keep out violent crazies. It doesn't. There's also plenty of sleazy sex-crazed people that have a violent streak.

You may not see a lot of Bhuddist monks protesting, but you do see regular old Bhuddists protesting.

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"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."

And Kaffis.

After he was told that it was not his place to offer constructive criticism to the mod staff.

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Darksiege: You are not a god damned vulcan homie.

Kaffis is gone??

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"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth

Announced in this very thread, LK.

He was told it's not his place to publicly call people out and trash them. In the past he's used PM's, at least to me, and was very well thought out and made his case. I dont know why he chose this time to make it public especially when I frankly found it insulting, not to mention inaccurate. If he did leave I'm sorry to hear it since I consider him a good guy, but I said what I felt at the time. I'm sure frustrations were high on both ends.

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“Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general”. - Mark Rippetoe

Did this thread need to be necroposted

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Holy shitsnacks!

Burying the thread doesn't change what happened. If the events are that painful, than maybe discussing them to try to prevent them from happening again is the better course of action.

And I still don't see where Kaffis 'publicly called out and trashed' anyone.

He told someone he thought they did a bad job of moderating. And since the moderators "work for" the populace of the board, then it is certainly 'his place'.

You can argue that it is tactless, that it should have been done differently- but it is certainly his place.

And honestly, mods/admins saying what they felt 'at the time' or when 'frustrations were high' is what has, many times, brought us to the point of collapse on these boards.

As was brought up a great many times in this thread (although incorrectly, since Talya was no longer a mod), was that mods and admins are, and should be, held to a higher posting standard than the rest of the board, as they have other powers to back their words.

If a mod or admin feels like they have been wronged, or if they feel like they can't post something that is not in the heat of the moment, than perhaps they should not post it, or 'be the bigger one' and take it to PMs.

I realize modding is a hard job. I do it other places, and have offered to do it here. That is why most mod crews often rotate out fast, because most people can't easily do the job for long periods of time- it takes a toll on you, as I'm sure DFK, Talya, Tamaar, and the other former mods can attest to.

But that doesn't mean you should use the 'modding is hard' shield. If it is getting too hard on you, take a break or step down.

And Dash: Being told something is not your place by the board admin is very different than being told so by any other poster. And I can well understand why Kaffis decided he was no longer welcome here.

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Darksiege: You are not a god damned vulcan homie.

Oh. Yeah I see now. I had sort of quit reading it and just skimmed there. Well that sucks.

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"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth

I think that's absurd.



And why does it keep happening over and over again? The mods and hosting spaces change but the outcomes cycle over and over. I think these two statements are related. If people are taking a view that mod/admins need to be some nigh infallible servants of the people I think that's a huge problem. Message boards go through these cycles from time to time, some worse than others. You can blame moderation or lack thereof for it if you want, but you find me the magic formula for here and I'll gladly implement it or get out of the way for it. I've asked privately for suggestions and I'm still not seeing much, which leads me to:



I would gladly step down. In fact I've been mulling it over quite a bit since I've tried what works for me on my other board and that doesnt seem to have worked here. I've also seen the same complaints here about not doing anything even though the mods have done quite a bit including banning two of the people who we get the most complaints about. So whoever is willing to step up is more than welcome or I can just say "i'm done" and let you guys figure it out. I'll be glad to give whoever mod powers and do whatever you need done so long as someone else wants to call the shots.

Modding is not hard. Modding here is ... well it is what it is. Modding other places is far worse, and modding on my other board is extremely simple. I dont have to do anything there other than reset a password from time to time or move a thread. Its just a small group of people who have known each other for 8 years or so, I thought this would be similar. Whoops =p

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“Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general”. - Mark Rippetoe

And that...is why you fail.

Why would people bother to give you suggestions privately when public suggestions are met with pique and disdain?

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Are you stepping up Shuyung?

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“Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general”. - Mark Rippetoe

Some of you need to GTFO. You will never change, never be happy, and never let the community have peace. There are some here that could happily reside here, but then there are some here that aren't happy unless they are ***** and moaning about something.

Seriously, just back out, delete the bookmark, and move the **** on. Life's much too short for you to waste time where you don't like, and too short for those of us who do like it here and have to listen to your childish bullshit every damn time we turn around.

/finger

So as long as no one else is willing to be administrator they can't comment on the way you do things?

And as I recall, it was a vote, of the populace, that brought moderation into effect on these boards. So with that logic, how does the moderation not work for the board populace?

Are you not doing a requested service?

Who exactly do you see the mods answering to?

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Darksiege: You are not a god damned vulcan homie.

I have suggested things and offered to help mod in a PM before, as well as on discussions here that remained civil. I can only assume I'm not considered a fit moderator, due to the fact that you never filled the vacancies as mods left, and never responded one way or another to me.

The problem that seems to be happening here right now is what happened with Sunmoon and Farsky both when they got worn out with being administrators. It's not the usual crap. It's when you get too tired of dealing with the issues that keep cropping up over and over. And it's not any particular poster, it's the group of us. The fact that they've been popping up for around 10 years now with changing rosters of participants attests to that.

If you are truly worn out of being an admin, or if any of the current mods are tired of being mods, why not just post in the general forum and ask for replacements? If you don't have anyone interested, then come the harder decisions... But if there is someone willing, and your heart is no longer in it, it certainly seems worth a shot.

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Darksiege: You are not a god damned vulcan homie.

I'm just grateful to have a site that doesn't crash every couple of days. Stability is nice.
I am also grateful that I don't have to maintain this place..it seems like a lot of work, so I'm glad I don't have to do it and I appreciate it.
Yeah, I've been spitting mad around here more than once and I've done my share of apologizing and being apologized to. There are a couple of people I'd like to kick in the teeth, and a couple of people that I consider pretty good frenemies after a good row or two.
I don't really have anything to say about the mod stuff...I think working it out amongst ourselves is the best way to go.
The times that I have been deeply hurt (perceived, anyway), some really good people here have stood up for me and had my back. That means way more to me than any mod action could have and makes it just a tiny bit easier to ignore the person the next time.
We can change leaders/mods/rules/whatever, but the fact is there will always be strife and there will always be somebody that everyone wants to blame. It's human nature, especially on online forums.
It was nice having a scapegoat because everyone threw all their stuff at Monte and it seemed like everyone was thinking how great it would be around here if he was gone. He's been gone long enough that the mob moved onto someone else....and now its gotten to the point that several REALLY AWESOME PEOPLE have left.
That totally sucks and I feel really sad about that.
I wish we could all just work this stuff out. Its hard when people hurt you or make you angry around here, I know, but there has to be a better way of dealing with it than picking ourselves apart..yanno that whole united we stand thing?
Anyway, thanks to all the nice people around here and thanks to the powers that be around here. I really think ya'll are doing your best and I appreciate it.

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"Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth

The administrators were not elected, and moderation was not imposed based on any popular vote. The administrators were chosen based on technical ability, moderation was created to deal with Monte, and the moderators were chosen by the administrators based on perceived fairness and willingness to work.

We're not civil servants. We're volunteers who chose to help out around the board. Personally, I don't care if you criticize us, but don't tell me I'm somehow beholden to you.

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This is the corollary to "you work for me", the "I can say what I want but you cant". If you recall, I'm not censoring anyone. You can comment on whatever you want and so can I.
As I said I'm going to step aside for whoever wants to take over. I'm offering to the current mods first.

Thanks LK, as I said hopefully someone with better knowledge of the Glade and it's members can take over and fix what needs fixing.

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“Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general”. - Mark Rippetoe

I never said that administrators were elected.

But there were certainly nomination polls for moderators, at one point.

And there was a poll for whether to include moderation or not, I forget whether it was on this incarnation of the board or the previous one. I am relatively certain it was with Farsky on the last incarnation.

Nor do I recall saying that you were civil servants or beholden to the posters.

But a poster offering constructive, well worded criticism and being told it was not their place? One of our oldest, most steadfast posters, at that?

Different matter.

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Darksiege: You are not a god damned vulcan homie.