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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 8:35 am 
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At least according to some Health and Human Services sources. The report detailed the costs would in fact not be put under control, but quite the opposite. No surprise to many, but disturbing.

http://spectator.org/archives/2010/04/2 ... es-beneath

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The economic report released last week by Health and Human Services, which indicated that President Barack Obama's health care "reform" law would actually increase the cost of health care and impose higher costs on consumers, had been submitted to the office of HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius more than a week before the Congressional votes on the bill, according to career HHS sources, who added that Sebelius's staff refused to review the document before the vote was taken.

"The reason we were given was that they did not want to influence the vote," says an HHS source. "Which is actually the point of having a review like this, you would think."

The analysis, performed by Medicare's Office of the Actuary, which in the past has been identified as a "nonpolitical" office, set off alarm bells when submitted. "We know a copy was sent to the White House via their legislative affairs staff," says the HHS staffer, "and there were a number of meetings here almost right after the analysis was submitted to the secretary's office. Everyone went into lockdown, and people here were too scared to go public with the report."

In the end, the report was released several weeks after the vote -- the review by the secretary's office reportedly took less than three days -- and bore a note that the analysis was not the official position of the Obama administration.


Here is a piece on what was in the report:

[youtube]sQZsfbLG-o8[/youtube]

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 8:43 am 
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Yeah, I wanna see the apologists defend this one. Anyone have some popcorn?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 8:49 am 
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There's something Orwellian about this...


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 8:51 am 
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Khross wrote:
Yeah, I wanna see the apologists defend this one. Anyone have some popcorn?

No need. Its should be understood that the achieving the goal is paramount to anything else, and something as trivial as cost analysis should not be used to distract from, and potentially destroy, the unequivocal right to health care. Why apologize for doing what must be done?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 8:55 am 
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Ladas:

While I understand that's the sentiment on the issue, it's still painful. The emotional impact is vastly more significant and important to the majority of legislators in our government than the reality of their actions.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:01 am 
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It's not like this report would have been a surprise to any of the people who voted on the issue. Unless they are completely blinded by ideology.

Same with anyone closely following this issue. The swathes of Americans who are only peripherally aware of what the heck is going on, you'd think this would sour them even more on what was done.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:53 am 
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It would have ended (hypothetically anyway, assuming the media isn't complete biased) the propaganda blitz during the lead up to the vote that this would save money, which was the biggest "selling" point to those weren't 100% behind the idea on nothing more than the desire to see the outcome, regardless.

Of course, the CBO had similiar things to say, if just lacking the specifics, and that got downplayed by the various outlets (official and media), and completely ignored by those "fact checking" groups... how many people did the AP have factchecking Palin's book compared to the statements by the Dems and WH regarding health care?

Yeah...


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 10:17 am 
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It would be interesting to see a side by side comparison between this reports findings and the other reports that claim the changes will save money. I wonder where the discrepancy is.

Unfortunate, but not surprising politics around the timing of the report.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 10:18 am 
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My search-fu sucks. I'm not able to find the report they're talking about. Anybody else able to find it?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:09 am 
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It doesn't actually link the effects of the bill to increased costs. But I'm pretty convinced the health care bill is not about health care, it's just a large stealth tax to boost government revenue. Corporations drop their group coverage and pay an extra tax, while everyone that got dropped now gets individual insurance which isn't tax-free so the government gets even more revenue.

That said, the more honest liberals (unlike the deluded center-left ones that actually think costs will go down) are perfectly well aware that public health care increases costs. They just want the rich to pay for those so that the 40-50 million uninsured can get insurance.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 12:16 pm 
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The report can be read here: http://www.camp.house.gov/webreturn/?ur ... nacted.pdf

Leaving the motives out of it for now, I think the methods used were structured in a way that they could pass the bill (any bill) first and then be left with the problem of funding it. The steath tax will come in the form of a VAT most likely. I'm not sure how else they'd do it. Just taxing the rich wont work.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 1:12 pm 
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Xequecal wrote:
But I'm pretty convinced the health care bill is not about health care, it's just a large stealth tax to boost government revenue.
It's monetary redistribution more than anything else. A pretty pure example of it, too.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 5:10 pm 
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It's crazy that this report's been out a week and I haven't heard about it. I'd expect a serious uproar.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 5:25 pm 
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Arathain Kelvar wrote:
It's crazy that this report's been out a week and I haven't heard about it. I'd expect a serious uproar.

LOL from who?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 5:28 pm 
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Screeling wrote:
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
It's crazy that this report's been out a week and I haven't heard about it. I'd expect a serious uproar.

LOL from who?


The media? /cry


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 5:36 pm 
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Arathain Kelvar wrote:
Screeling wrote:
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
It's crazy that this report's been out a week and I haven't heard about it. I'd expect a serious uproar.

LOL from who?


The media? /cry


Hrmmm...

Seems to me you are defeating your own argument in another thread here.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 7:14 pm 
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Rynar wrote:
Hrmmm...

Seems to me you are defeating your own argument in another thread here.


Why, because their failure to report this a week ago automatically means they were bought by the government?

Give me a break. Hey, there's a report about it now, guess that means the media's been freed?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:09 pm 
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No Arathain, they paid their debt to their master and to relieve tension on their leash that is composed of denial of introspection ,lest it be burst under the growing pressure of shame-of-a-duty-ignored - the issue is released and the press feel that they are the bringers of truth to the people once again. Ready for the next round of bowing to the master.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:20 pm 
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Elmarnieh wrote:
No Arathain, they paid their debt to their master and to relieve tension on their leash that is composed of denial of introspection ,lest it be burst under the growing pressure of shame-of-a-duty-ignored - the issue is released and the press feel that they are the bringers of truth to the people once again. Ready for the next round of bowing to the master.



.... um ....

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 27, 2010 10:58 pm 
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Elmarnieh wrote:
No Arathain, they paid their debt to their master and to relieve tension on their leash that is composed of denial of introspection ,lest it be burst under the growing pressure of shame-of-a-duty-ignored - the issue is released and the press feel that they are the bringers of truth to the people once again. Ready for the next round of bowing to the master.


so....

blatantly ripped (out of context) from another thread and edited ever so slightly and attributed to the wrong person to serve my own giggles...

[strike]Rafael[/strike] Obama wrote:
If I want my balls to feel good, I'll go find a chick media group with low enough self esteem to put them in her mouth....

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 3:49 pm 
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Elmarnieh wrote:
No Arathain, they paid their debt to their master and to relieve tension on their leash that is composed of denial of introspection ,lest it be burst under the growing pressure of shame-of-a-duty-ignored - the issue is released and the press feel that they are the bringers of truth to the people once again. Ready for the next round of bowing to the master.


LMFAO

Wow, man. You're on a whole other level.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 4:10 pm 
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Thank you.

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PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2010 12:50 pm 
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And the hits keep coming...

CBO: Medicare Payment 'Doc Fix' Is More Expensive Than Expected

You know that little bit of "fluff" that was eliminated from the bill to make it "deficit neutral"? Well, it's worse than they thought, surprise surprise.

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