The Glade 4.0

I know some of you guys have played some warhammer. I was looking for some beginners advice on painting the army. A lot of "beginner's guides" I've found on the internet seems to still assume I know certain things. It's annoying, because they leave out things I have questions about and never tell me why I should do anything or what basic materials I even need.

I know some people use white or black base layers, but I have know idea why one would use one or the other except, "well, this guy uses it. I guess I will too."

I'm curious about what paints to use. I know Games Workshop sells their citadel stuff which consists of colors appropriate for warhammer, but they're also expensive. What I have available locally is Testor's. I'm holding off on deciding for the meantime.

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"...the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?" -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

Wwen:

Things You Need
1. A clutter free work space with a surface you don't mind scarring or staining with paint and other chemicals.
2. A good set of hobby knives. You want 3 or 4 different knives and several blades of varying lengths and angles. This is mostly so you can clean up large blemishes on pewter, lead, and plastic figurines.
3. A very fine, soft wire brush. You don't want thick, hard steel or copper, but do you do want something that can very lightly score a surface on occasion, particularly when you're jointing custom pieces together.
4. Steel Wool in 3 or 4 different grades, including 0000. Again, you don't really want to deface your miniatures in most cases, but you do want something that can treat the surface.
5. Sand Paper (1 coarse, 2 or 3 medium grits, 4 or 5 progressively finer grits).
6. Brushes. Lots and Lots and Lots of Brushes. You want good brushes off various shapes, sizes, and thickness. You want good organic bristles and maybe a few synthetic bristles for different textures etc.
7. Mineral Spirits and Paint Thinner.
8. A box of #2 pencils (which are good for masking certain fine parts of the miniature and easily cleaned off when the surrounding paint is dry.

Base Coats:

You have 3 or 4 options here, but I'll go over the most common.

White Base Coats for models you want to be brighter and on which you will use very bright colors (like Yellows and Light Greens and Blues).

Black Base Coats for models you want to be DARK and on which you will use very, very dark colors, like Dark Angel Green and Ultramarine Blue. It matters. Black's also good for Orks.

Grey Base Coats for things you want in between.

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Will answer later from home.

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

Wwen, you know how a boat is simply a hole in the water into which you throw money? Warhammer is much like that, except without the benefit of being able to fish or ski.

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It's cheaper than golf, and skiing, and many other hobbies.

Are you advocating people to not have hobbies?

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

No, I'm making fun of Warhammer.

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I see.

Make sure to include skiing, golfing, hunting, and any other hobby with an expense/hour of about $7 or higher, then.

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

Ah, but you get to game!

The paint thinner is optional to start out (GW paints are acrylic, and thus water-soluble, so you can dilute with water unless you're going for preposterously thin, in which case the water will alter the surface tension more than you want), and I've yet to use steel wool or a wire brush in my modelling (but have used a metal file, instead), but Khross makes a good list. (I'll have to keep the pencil trick in mind; I hadn't seen/heard that one before)

I'm going to say that I've worked with Testor's paints before, and I don't like them nearly as much. GW is still darned expensive, yes; but see if you can get Vallejo as an alternative at an acceptable price. Lots of stores that support GW will stock or order them for you, and their "Game Color" line is essentially what GW rebrands as GW paints; you can find unofficial GW/Vallejo color equivalence conversion charts online if you want/need to match official GW colors.

Testor's makes good sprays, still, though. (And again, Privateer Press makes good, less expensive base coat sprays that DFK! and I recently switched over to) Testor's spray gloss and matte are vastly cheaper than paying GW prices for 'Ard Coat and Dull Coat, and are essentially the same product.

I may post more after I see what DFK! covers.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

Is this essentially the same thing as painting the little lead figures for AD&D?

I'm not sure why I would do that, DFK!, as it would cut into my "making fun of Warhammer" time.

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Warhammer is one of those games that I never could understand. Not to make fun of it or anything, but the idea of buying whole armies with which to game, in a pre-made configuration, always struck me as going against the idea of gaming that I grew up with. Ya know, when we'd want to play some armor battles, we'd throw a bunch of armor and stuff on the table, spread around some lichen and maybe a hill or a few buildings, and off we'd go.

Never did have as much armor as I wanted, though. Maybe now that I actually have, like, a job ...

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This cold and dark tormented hell
Is all I`ll ever know
So when you get to heaven
May the devil be the judge

Foundation paints.

I LOVE these things. Its completely changed how I paint models. I wish they made foundation paints in the normal color range!

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They can't, Crim -- the whole reason foundation paints work is that it's a pigment that you can get to be very dense. If they could make, say, Red Gore a foundation paint, they would have already just made the Red Gore paint cover better. Instead, they identify the colors that are particularly BAD at covering, and then find colors that are similar (and typically less bright, since the bright pigments are the ones that require the most pigment to cover) and crank those out as a Foundation color.

Aethien; it's essentially the same reason you graduate from playing Cowboys and Indians (or is it Cops and Robbers now to appease the PC crowd?) to playing paintball or laser-tag. Or "let's play pretend" to RPGing, or what have you. Rules structures reduce arguments ("I shot you!" "Nuh-uh, I've got super-awesome armor!" "But I've got magic bullets!" "Well you missed, anyways!") and provide a framework in which you can standardize the experience so that you can meet new players and the game works the same. It also facilitates a competitive environment, if you're into that.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

Huh, OK, I guess that can make sense. I graduated from Cowboys and Indians to wargames, though, so there were rules structures aplenty. Maybe it's the lack of spontaneity that strikes me. Do you ever get to use someone else's miniatures? Or can you only play with what you personally own?

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This cold and dark tormented hell
Is all I`ll ever know
So when you get to heaven
May the devil be the judge

I know :\ but I'd still buy it if they could!

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Every time I see this thread, I read it as "Warhammer Pudding!" ... I think I'm hungry.

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Aha. I think I misunderstood you. I misread "Warhammer" as "Wargaming is one of those things I could never understand" in your first post.

Buying "whole armies" isn't the norm, or is done to get good deals on quantity when switching/acquiring new armies, and sold that way to recoup money if you're tired of what you've got. Most of the people I know build their armies to suit their own tastes. Maybe this is something regional? It's certainly not a part of the rules.

DFK! and I borrow models (mostly tanks, 'cause I'm a slacker when it comes to building my transports and/or he's building up a new army and testing some things out) from each other fairly regularly. Playing with only what you own is standard fare for tournaments and among strangers, but between friends, there's nothing stopping you from permitting some proxying or the like (though it does get stale seeing your old Orks proxied for Space Marines for a year straight, if you get my drift)..

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

I can post pictures of my Tau again if people want to see them

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Beginner's advice: come to grips with the fact that your models will not look like the ones in official pictures.

After you've come to grips with that, keep painting. Practice makes perfect.



Super-duper ultra basic?

Spray primer: I believe you're playing Orcs IIRC, so I'd go with black. This is because paints are not 100% opaque, and so some of each underlying color comes through. As such, white makes models much brighter in the end than black. "Bright" and "Orcs" don't go together. Also, white is harder for beginners to spray prime, because it takes a very particular touch to get it everywhere on the model, and with white must get everywhere or the final model won't look good. Black isn't quite as important to get into the nooks and crannies, though you still want to ensure good coverage.

Some brushes: I don't put nearly the emphasis on quality as Khross does. You're going to **** up brushes. Get over it. Replace them as soon as they start to fray or the tip to curl. You'll need several sizes. The Games Workshop starter set is overpriced, but a good start. In theory, you could probably get away with a #1 brush for a long time by itself.

A painting surface: Newspaper, a plastic tray, etc. Something you don't care about spilling things on.

Plastic cups: Put water in these for brush cleaning.

Paints: Use ACRYLIC. Otherwise you'll need thinner to dilute, thinner to clean, and overall just have a worse time of it. GW are expensive but go with well the official painting guides and look good. I like Vallejo more, as Kaffis said, but then you'll pretty much have a mixing tray as another requisite, because their squirt-topped bottles mandate it.

Minimum paints are: Black, white, a metallic (either Chainmail or Boltgun metal, or their equivalent), and two primary colors for your army (your choice). Get "foundation" colors to start with, as these cover black phenomenally well. Later, you can get lighter/darker shades of each paint, plus more colors for detail work. Washes will also really step up your quality, Devlan Mud and Badab Black being the two most heavily used. You can use the black/white to mix colors up and done and save money. If money isn't an issue, get not only the 2 foundation colors you need, but a couple lighter colors of the same range (so if you get Orkhide shade Foundation, also pick up Goblin and Snot green, for example), this will allow you to easily highlight.

Vallejo offers color equivalents of both Foundation and Wash ranges of GW products, and while the same price their bottles are bigger by ~5ml, so effectively about 35% cheaper.




Unless the Testor's is acrylic, and usually it isn't, don't get it. Enamel is a pain in the gonads to work with.

It sounded like you were just asking for painting tips, if you want assembly as well that's fine, just let me know.



When it comes to spray technique, all brands will have an optimal distance from the model. Experience will help you learn this, but it's usually 6-18 inches. Remember when spraying that multiple thinner coats are better than one thick-ass one, except when sealing the model later.



Assuming I'm correct in your having Orcs, follow these steps and you'll be tournament-minimum ready and have a decent "tabletop quality" army:
1) Spray black
2) Green Foundation the ork skin
3) Wash Ork skin green
4) Leave wash in recesses and hit up with Goblin/medium green
5) Brown foundation on clothes/shirts
6) Brown wash (Devlan mud)
7) Either leave brown as is, or hit with Snakebite leather/medium brown, leaving wash in recesses
8) Slightly thinned boltgun metal/metallic on metal parts
9) Second thinned coat of metallic for coverage if necessary
10) black wash on metallic areas

After that, you could base them and be done. Everything else would be highlights and additional colors for details.

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

I don't actually have anything to spray w/ atm. I think the testors is enamel.

I kinda missed out, because a guy came in wanting to sell around $800+ worth of army and paints for $300, but I didn't go for it because I am clearly an idiot. The place where the hold the tabletop stuff has some house armies though, so that's useful.

Thanks for the info guys. I kinda wish I hadn't glued some of the things together yet.

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"...the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?" -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

Why do you wish you hadn't glued something together? (superglue or plastic bonding compound? Superglue joints can usually be carefully broken with no permanent damage if you need to)

A few more things you might want to consider:

Use separate rinse water cups for metallics and non-metallics. Metallic paints are made with little flecks of glitter, essentially, which will float around in the rinse water, and get on your brush to creep into whatever you're painting. Separate rinse water stops most of this, and having a dedicated metallic brush will prevent it entirely.

Cleaning your brushes well will both keep your colors brighter and extend the length of your brush's useable life. To clean your brush thoroughly, go beyond just swirling it around in the rinse water. Press it gently up against the side of the cup and tilt the brush towards (but not approaching) perpendicular, so the bristles fan out a little. Apply some gentle pressure up near the base of the bristles and rotate the brush handle slightly in either direction. Repeat a few times. This helps get paint that's crept up into the base of the brush before it has a chance to dry and stiffen the brush (which will eventually degrade the point and reduce the amount of paint the brush holds).

As DFK! said, you'll destroy brushes over time. This isn't a bad thing -- just watch the quality of your point, keep an eye out for fraying, and when a brush goes bad and can't be used for detail-work, use it for area coverage and dry-brushing (which don't require a fine point and is *really* hard on brushes while not requiring much of any brush quality, respectively) instead.

If you get to the point where you're trying highlighting (say, you've gotten comfortable painting with washes and want to make your HQ stand out or something), my best advice is to thin your paint and build up the highlight slowly with multiple layers. Make the first layers broad, extending from the edge out into the area of flat color, and with each successive layer, narrow it up bit by bit until you're just running your brush along the edge. With practice, that will give you a smoother, blended look to the highlight.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

As Kaffis and DFK! noted, you mostly want to use Acrylic paints. Paint Thinner and Mineral Spirits are for cleaning contact oils off large surfaces. Non-powdered rubber gloves are generally a good idea.

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The locals are trying to get a WH40k group going now that we have a store again. Someone even offered me a refresher/update course.

I litterally dusted off my tacklebox this week and looked over what I've got available. I haven't used it in 4 moves, but I couldn't stand to part with it. There is too much time and money invested in it just to let it go.

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I prefer to think of them as "Fighting evil in another dimension"

Word.


Where are you located in OH again? Maybe I should come help you convert to 5e...

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“The duty of a patriot is to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine

Just up the pipe several dozen miles.

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I prefer to think of them as "Fighting evil in another dimension"