How many Americans are targeted for assassination? BY GLENN GREENWALD When The Washington Post's Dana Priest first revealed (in passing) back in January that the Obama administration had compiled a hit list of American citizens targeted for assassination, she wrote that "as of several months ago, the CIA list included three U.S. citizens." In April, both the Post and the NYT confirmed that the administration had specifically authorized the assassination of Anwar al-Awlaki. Today, The Washington Times' Eli Lake has an interview with Obama's top Terrorism adviser John Brennan in which Brennan strongly suggests that the number of U.S. citizens targeted for assassination could actually be "dozens":
Dozens of Americans have joined terrorist groups and are posing a threat to the United States and its interests abroad, the president's most senior adviser on counterterrorism and homeland security said Thursday. . . . "There are, in my mind, dozens of U.S. persons who are in different parts of the world, and they are very concerning to us," said John O. Brennan, deputy White House national security adviser for homeland security and counterterrorism. . . .
"If a person is a U.S. citizen, and he is on the battlefield in Afghanistan or Iraq trying to attack our troops, he will face the full brunt of the U.S. military response," Mr. Brennan said. "If an American person or citizen is in a Yemen or in a Pakistan or in Somalia or another place, and they are trying to carry out attacks against U.S. interests, they also will face the full brunt of a U.S. response. And it can take many forms."
Nobody -- or at least not me -- disputes the right of the U.S. or any other country to kill someone on an actual battlefield during war without due process. That's just obvious, but that's not remotely what Brennan is talking about, and it's not remotely what this assassination program is about. Indeed, Brennan explicitly identified two indistinguishable groups of American citizens who "will face the full brunt of a U.S. response": (1) those "on the battlefield in Afghanistan or Iraq"; and (2) those "in a Yemen or in a Pakistan or in Somalia or another place." In other words, the entire world is a "battlefield" -- countries where there is a war and countries where there isn't -- and the President's "battlefield" powers, which are unlimited, extend everywhere. That theory -- the whole world is a battlefield, even the U.S. -- was the core premise that spawned 8 years of Bush/Cheney radicalism, and it has been adopted in full by the Obama administration (indeed, it was that "whole-world-is-a-battlefield" theory which Elena Kagan explicitly endorsed during her confirmation hearing for Solicitor General).
Anyone who doubts that the Obama administration has adopted the core Terrorism policies of Bush/Cheney should listen to the concession -- or boast -- which Brennan himself made in his interview with Lake:
Mr. Brennan toward the end of the interview acknowledged that, despite some differences, there is considerable continuity between the counterterrorism policies of President Bush and President Obama.
"There has been a lot of continuity of effort here from the previous administration to this one," he said. "There are some important distinctions, but sometimes there is too much made of those distinctions. We are building upon some of the good foundational work that has been done."
I would really like never to hear again the complaint that comparing Bush and Obama's Terrorism and civil liberties policies is unfair, invalid or hyperbolic given that Obama's top Terrorism adviser himself touts that comparison. And that's anything but a surprise, given that Brennan was a Bush-era CIA official who defended many of the most controversial Bush/Cheney Terrorism policies.
I've written at length about the reasons why targeting American citizens for assassination who are far away from a "battlefield" is so odious and tyrannical, and I won't repeat those arguments here. Suffice to say -- and I'm asking this literally -- if you're someone who believes, or are at least willing to acquiesce to the claim, that the U.S. President has the power to target your fellow citizens for assassination without a whiff of due process, what unchecked presidential powers wouldn't you support or acquiesce to? I'd really like to hear an answer to that. That's the question Al Gore asked about George Bush in a 2006 speech condemning Bush's claimed powers merely to eavesdrop on and imprison American citizens without charges, let alone assassinate them: "If the answer is yes, then under the theory by which these acts are committed, are there any acts that can on their face be prohibited? . . . If the president has th[is] inherent authority. . . . then what can't he do?" Can anyone defending this Obama policy answer that question?
One other thing that is truly amazing: the U.S. tried to import this same due-process-free policy to Afghanistan. There, the U.S. last year compiled a "hit list" of 50 Afghan citizens whose assassination it authorized on the alleged ground (never charged or convicted) that they were drug "kingpins" or funding the Talbian. You know what happened? This:
A U.S. military hit list of about 50 suspected drug kingpins is drawing fierce opposition from Afghan officials, who say it could undermine their fragile justice system and trigger a backlash against foreign troops. . . .
Gen. Mohammad Daud Daud, Afghanistan's deputy interior minister for counternarcotics efforts . . . said he worried that foreign troops would now act on their own to kill suspected drug lords, based on secret evidence, instead of handing them over for trial . . . "They should respect our law, our constitution and our legal codes," Daud . "We have a commitment to arrest these people on our own" . . . .
The U.S. military and NATO officials have authorized their forces to kill or capture individuals on the list, which was drafted within the past year as part of NATO's new strategy to combat drug operations that finance the Taliban.. . . . "There is a constitutional problem here. A person is innocent unless proven guilty," [Ali Ahmad Jalali, a former Afghan interior minister] said. "If you go off to kill or capture them, how do you prove that they are really guilty in terms of legal process?"
In other words, Afghans -- the people we're occupying in order to teach about Freedom and Democracy -- are far more protective of due process and the rule of law for their own citizens than Americans are who meekly submit to Obama's identical policy of assassination for their fellow citizens. It might make more sense for Afghanistan to invade and occupy the U.S. in order to spread the rule of law and constitutional values here.
What makes all this most remarkable is the level of screeching protests Democrats engaged in when Bush merely wanted to eavesdrop on and detain Americans without any judicial oversight or due process. Remember all that? Click here and here for a quick refresher. Yet here is Barack Obama doing far worse to them than that without any due process or judicial oversight -- he's targeting them for assassination -- and there is barely a peep of protest from the same Party that spent years depicting "mere" warrantless eavesdropping and due-process-free detention to be the acts of a savage, lawless tyrant. And, of course, Obama himself back then joined in those orgies of condemnation, as reflected by this December, 2008, answer he gave to Charlie Savage, then of The Boston Globe, regarding his views of executive power:
5. Does the Constitution permit a president to detain US citizens without charges as unlawful enemy combatants?
[Obama]: No. I reject the Bush Administration's claim that the President has plenary authority under the Constitution to detain U.S. citizens without charges as unlawful enemy combatants.
So back then, Obama said the President lacks the power merely to detain U.S. citizens without charges; indeed, when asked if "the Constitution permit[s]" that, he responded: "no." Yet now, as President, he claims the power to assassinate them without charges. Could even his hardest-core loyalists try to reconcile that with a straight face? As Spencer Ackerman documented in April, not even John Yoo claimed that the President possessed the power Obama is claiming here. Given Brennan's strong suggestion that there are not merely three but "dozens" of Americans who are being targeted or at least could be ("they also will face the full brunt of a U.S. response") -- and given the huge number of times the Government has falsely accused individuals of Terrorism and its demonstrated willingness to imprison knowingly innocent detainees -- is it time yet to have a debate about whether we think the President should be able to exercise a power like this?
In fact, the actual oath taken by the President as compelled by the Constitution -- that irritating, purist, Far Leftist document which he incessantly told us he studied and taught -- is this: "I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States." To fulfill that duty, he might want to begin by looking here: "No person shall . . .be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law."
Spoiler:
The administration defends its assassination program BY GLENN GREENWALD In the wake of Leon Panetta's public defense of the targeting of American citizens suspected (but never charged or convicted) of Terrorism, Obama officials are now apparently going around the country and, with chest-beating rhetoric, overtly defending their right to target Americans for assassination with no due process of any kind:
"If someone like Anwar al-Awlaki is responsible" for part of a plot "to kill more than 300 people over the city of Detroit," [director of the National Counterterrorism Center Michael] Leiter said, "I think it would be wholly irresponsible for citizens like me, Leon Panetta, Defense Secretary (Robert) Gates, and ultimately the president, not to at least think about and potentially direct all the elements of national power to try to defend the American people" . . .
A woman in the crowd who identified herself as an American Civil Liberties Union member asked why there was no judicial review of such kill orders, citing the standard warrant requirements facing a policeman before entering a citizen's home.
Leiter explained that while "a police officer does need a court order to go after a house," the lawman "has a right of self-defense if someone pulls out a gun." The U.S. government, Leiter insisted, has the same right. He added that there is congressional oversight of such actions.
For several reasons, this is misleading in the extreme. First, nobody disputes the military's right (or the police's) to use force if they seek to apprehend someone and that person begins shooting at them. That situation has nothing whatsoever to do with the presidential assassination program, which authorizes targeted killings without any attempt at apprehension and no matter what the person is doing at the time: i.e., sleeping, riding in a car, watching television with their children, etc. (indeed, the administration has already tried to kill Awlaki in exactly this fashion without trying to apprehend him). If, as Leiter deceitfully suggests, this were only about the military or CIA's use of force in the event that a suspect starts using violence during an attempted apprehension, then no presidential order would be needed because they already have that right, and there'd be no controversy. That's just obvious. Instead, "[t]he Obama administration has taken the extraordinary step of authorizing [] targeted killing" of Americans. The police don't have the right to put a bullet in the back of a suspect's head while he sleeps or by sneaking up behind him while he walks on the street, which is the actual Police analogy to what the Obama administration is doing.
Second, Leiter's claim "that there is congressional oversight of such actions" is both irrelevant and materially false. It's irrelevant because the President does not have the right to assassinate American citizens without due process just as long as he tells a few member of Congress what he's doing (that was always the Bush excuse for its lawless behavior: well, we told Congress what we were doing). And it's false because, as Time's Massimo Calabresi reports, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi is "in the middle of an ugly fight with the President -- as well as the CIA . . . about Congress's watchdog powers over the U.S. intelligence services." As Calabresi writes -- using the term "center" to mean "copying Bush/Cheney policies" -- "the battle is turning into the biggest confrontation yet over Executive power between the liberal House Speaker and a White House that has moved steadily to the center on national security matters." As Russ Feingold explained, "the Obama administration is continuing some of the stonewalling practices of the George W. Bush administration when it comes to providing full intelligence briefings to the relevant committees in Congress."
Specifically, Pelosi is demanding -- and the White House is vowing to veto -- a new intelligence law to require "the CIA and other intelligence agencies to inform all members of the House and Senate intelligence committees when they launch any covert action or other controversial program" and to allow "the Government Accountability Office (GAO) [] to audit[] any intelligence program, . . . a power the GAO has for classified Pentagon programs but not for the intelligence agencies." That's because the current process -- which the White House is fighting desperately to maintain -- provides no meaningful oversight of the "most sensitive" intelligence programs, which is how the Bush administration was able to claim it "briefed" members of Congress (including Pelosi) on its torture and eavesdropping programs while telling them very little that would enable meaningful review. As Richard Clarke and so many others have explained, the intelligence "oversight" system in place now is a sham and (quoting Clarke) a "farce." The suggestion that someone whom the President targets for assassination is given anything resembling meaningful due process all because a few members of Congress are told by the CIA about it is so ludicrous as to be insulting.
Finally, note Leiter's decree -- for which no evidence has been offered and which has never been reviewed by any court -- that Awlaki "had a 'direct operational role' in the plot that allegedly sent Christmas Day bombing suspect Omar Farouk Abdulmutallab to attack a Detroit-bound airliner packed with nearly 300 passengers." Could the individuals who trust the U.S. Government to essentially convict people of Terrorism and impose a death penalty through imperial decree (i.e., without any trials or judicial review, and based solely on the unchecked say-so of the Executive Branch) please identify themselves, and particularly explain the basis for that trust in light of this disgraceful and error-plagued record? We really are talking about a President who believes he has the right to send the CIA to murder American citizens based purely on allegations and suspicions of wrongdoing; to describe the seized power is to illustrate its perversity.
* * * * *
As the first commenter notes, we also find here the central justification for most of what was done under the Bush administration: anything and everything is justified if it can be cast as helping to "protect the American people," as though Security is the overarching presidential duty. In fact, the actual oath taken by the President as compelled by the Constitution -- that irritating, purist, Far Leftist document which he incessantly told us he studied and taught -- is this: "I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States." To fulfill that duty, he might want to begin by looking here: "No person shall . . .be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law."
Well, it looks like more and more folks are waking up to the real Obama. I guess others are too oxygen deprived from sucking so hard and long without coming up for air to notice they were duped.
_________________ "Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko
1. Bush actually did wiretap people. I should also point out that Bush also actually did use the CIA to kill American citizens, just like Obama. More than one was killed by Predator strikes, and they knew they were there when they fired. As far as targeting citizens en masse, sure there's probably a plan in place for that somewhere. There's a plan in place to invade Canada too, should we get angry about that one?
2. I find it very funny that conservatives are getting angry over "three people" being targeted and using "no person shall be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law." as the justification.You know, the same people who advocate things like deploying sentry guns on the Mexican border and shooting the Mexicans by the thousands.
Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 9:40 pm Posts: 2289 Location: Bat Country
Unless you disagree with that and this. Is it still funny?
_________________ "...the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?" -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
I'm okay with killing Americans who engage US forces on battlefields. I'm not okay with sticking names on a list (even based on them having done this) and killing them wherever they are. There should be no list of people at all. But a standing order that it's okay to engage Americans participating with enemies on the battlefield with lethal force is not a problem, and how it should be.
That there's a list, or that these standing orders extend to regions where we're not engaging in active conflict, is a serious problem.
_________________ "Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee "... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades
Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 9:40 pm Posts: 2289 Location: Bat Country
Hey, terrorists could be operating in the US right now.
_________________ "...the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?" -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am Posts: 15740 Location: Combat Information Center
Xequecal wrote:
1. Bush actually did wiretap people. I should also point out that Bush also actually did use the CIA to kill American citizens, just like Obama. More than one was killed by Predator strikes, and they knew they were there when they fired. As far as targeting citizens en masse, sure there's probably a plan in place for that somewhere. There's a plan in place to invade Canada too, should we get angry about that one?
No one is disputing that Bush had wiretaps done. That's simply a red herring. As for him assassinating Americans, I want names, and I want to see that they were the actual target, not the facility they were at or people they were with. American's rights not to be targeted for assassination do not extend to protecting hem if they are killed in the process of attacking something else; they are not de facto human shields.
As for a plan to invade Canada, I'd like to see any evidence that there's one "in place". There may be one laying around somewhere in the Pentagon; that doesn't mean ****. It could very well be a plan to invade Canada in response to them being invaded by Russia.
Quote:
2. I find it very funny that conservatives are getting angry over "three people" being targeted and using "no person shall be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law." as the justification.You know, the same people who advocate things like deploying sentry guns on the Mexican border and shooting the Mexicans by the thousands.
It's well understood that the due process clause does not apply to activites performed against foriegn countries and people in pursuit of national defense. It also does not prohibit killing people in the process of enforcing law; it simply limits it. Mexicans trying to cross the border are not citizens, nor are they people in this country entitled to legal protections. They could easily be considered foriegn invaders. By your idiot logic, if the Mexican Army invaded Arizona we couldn't kill them; we'd need to arrest and try each of them.
_________________ "Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."
I'm okay with killing Americans who engage US forces on battlefields. I'm not okay with sticking names on a list (even based on them having done this) and killing them wherever they are. There should be no list of people at all. But a standing order that it's okay to engage Americans participating with enemies on the battlefield with lethal force is not a problem, and how it should be.
That there's a list, or that these standing orders extend to regions where we're not engaging in active conflict, is a serious problem.
2. I find it very funny that conservatives are getting angry over "three people" being targeted and using "no person shall be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law." as the justification.You know, the same people who advocate things like deploying sentry guns on the Mexican border and shooting the Mexicans by the thousands.
Who are these people who have "advocate things like deploying sentry guns on the Mexican border and shooting the Mexicans by the thousands"? Where have they shown that they were "getting angry over 'three people' being targeted"? Did they post invisibly between what I presented, and your post, or is this a wildly incongruous straw-man that you made up? I'm pretty sure Glenn Greenwald at Salon.com and Dylan Ratigan at MSNBC aren't who you're talking about. So, unless they're the conservatives you've made up in your head, who are they?
You are a prime example of those who, based on past history, should be ranting about this. You raged about non-citizens being labeled as enemy combatants and being detained. Yet you shrug off the idea of having lists of names that are assassination targets based on suspicion of being an enemy combatant, or even suspected of assisting enemy combatants. Does this make any **** sense to you? The only difference I see is that these are citizens and you're not, so you don't give a ****. Guess what? If this is how citizens are treated and you have no problem with it don't be surprised how they want to treat non-citizens, because it's a fair bet that the way they're treated isn't going to be "better".
_________________ "Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko
_________________ "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth
He had an "enemies list" of his political opponents, yes, but not of citizens approved for assassination - at least I've never heard of such.
_________________ "Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko
Huh. I remember doing a paper in high school and I really thought his "enemies" list was a hit list with people like Barbara Streisand and stuff on it. Eh. It's been too long ago too remember.
_________________ "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth
Oh, I'm sure it was characterized for you in the worst possible light, everything about Nixon is by some folks.
_________________ "Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko
_________________ "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth
Note that I did say "for you", not "by you"; I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt.
_________________ "Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko
Ha! Thanks. Believe me, my sources were checked and re-checked and checked again. Everything was legit.
_________________ "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own." Jesus of Nazareth
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am Posts: 15740 Location: Combat Information Center
Legit as far as you could tell as a senior is High School. I wouldn't put it past anyone to have tried to pull the wool over your eyes, including your sources. I had a girl in either my junior or senior high school class who thought that the entire Cuban Missile Crisis was manufactured as propaganda against Russia, and that there were no missiles.
_________________ "Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."
Conservatives, the people who brought us "torture them to death if they don't talk", the people who thought it was fine for US citizens to be the victims of warrantless wiretaps, who think it's fine to use centuries old torture techniques on American citizens, are suddenly freaking out about the Obama administration's plan to kill American citizens that have clearly joined forces with our nation's enemies.
_________________
It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans. ---The Daily Show
Conservatives, the people who brought us "torture them to death if they don't talk", the people who thought it was fine for US citizens to be the victims of warrantless wiretaps, who think it's fine to use centuries old torture techniques on American citizens, are suddenly freaking out about the Obama administration's plan to kill American citizens that have clearly joined forces with our nation's enemies.
Nope, you got it wrong... it is perfectly fine to like Nixon because he wanted to cause much harm to Barbara Streisand.
_________________ Darksiege Traveller, Calé, Whisperer Lead me not into temptation; for I know a shortcut
Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 9:40 pm Posts: 2289 Location: Bat Country
Monte wrote:
Let me try to wrap my brain around this -
Conservatives, the people who brought us "torture them to death if they don't talk", the people who thought it was fine for US citizens to be the victims of warrantless wiretaps, who think it's fine to use centuries old torture techniques on American citizens, are suddenly freaking out about the Obama administration's plan to kill American citizens that have clearly joined forces with our nation's enemies.
Well, Obama is clearly keeping all those other things you mentioned. Are you ok with all of them now? I'M CONFUSED.
Personally, I think this story is probably worded for MAXIMUM drama. There are way worse things that are still going on from the previous admin...
_________________ "...the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?" -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
Yup, it's just as I stated, the libs only train of thought is that what they perceive Bush as doing apparently trumps what Obama does.
Vindicarre wrote:
Neat-o I guess the left feels it's a treasonous outrage if Bush does a wiretap, but if Obama wants to do a double-tap it's okie-dokie.
_________________ "Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko
Well, Obama is clearly keeping all those other things you mentioned. Are you ok with all of them now? I'M CONFUSED.
That's not entirely accurate. One of the first things the President did was issue an order to cease all "enhanced" interrogation techniques such as waterboarding. He did seem to keep the outsourcing program, but increased the regulations on what assurances we needed from countries we sent these people to. I am not entirely pleased with his record on this. It's probably one of the most frustrating things for me regarding this administration.
I agree. The story is worded for maximum drama, and so are the selections. If a person leaves the US, goes to another country, and begins waging war on the US, then I have no problem if we take them out. In fact, the more precisely we can kill them, the happier I am with it. Being a US citizen should not protect you from the consequences of going to war with the United States.
Understand that when I say this, I am specifically referring to action on foreign soil. Domestically, it's a law enforcement issue. If an American citizen is recruiting terrorists or taking direct action against the US from within the US, then it's up to our domestic law enforcement apparatus to arrest and prosecute. FBI, NSA, etc.
_________________
It feels like all the people who want limited government really just want government limited to Republicans. ---The Daily Show
Hi-larious! Bush was the devil for wiretapping, but Obama gets a "I'm not entirely pleased with him" for ordering the assassination of American citizens suspected of being accomplices to terrorists, no trial, no hearing. Absolutely beautiful. Go go logical continuity!
_________________ "Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko
Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 9:40 pm Posts: 2289 Location: Bat Country
Enh, why should American citizens get a trial when they leave the country to help support people fighting against American Occupation? If they want to help people who hate freedom, they can die at the end of a predator drone missile just as well as any Taliban.
_________________ "...the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?" -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
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