The Glade 4.0

"Turn the lights down, the party just got wilder."
It is currently Sat Nov 23, 2024 8:43 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 24 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:15 pm 
Offline
Doom Patrol
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:31 am
Posts: 1145
Location: The subtropics
http://www.infowars.com/pre-crime-technology-to-be-used-in-washington-d-c-2/

Quote:
Steve Watson
Infowars.net
Tuesday, Aug 24th, 2010

Law enforcement agencies in Washington D.C. have begun to use technology that they say can predict when crimes will be committed and who will commit them, before they actually happen.

The Minority Report like pre-crime software has been developed by Richard Berk, a professor at the University of Pennsylvania.

Previous incarnations of the software, already being used in Baltimore and Philadelphia were limited to predictions of murders by and among parolees and offenders on probation.

According to a report by ABC News, however, the latest version, to be implemented in Washington D.C., can predict other future crimes as well.

“When a person goes on probation or parole they are supervised by an officer. The question that officer has to answer is ‘what level of supervision do you provide?’” Berk told ABC News, intimating that the program could have a bearing on the length of sentences and/or bail amounts.

The technology sifts through a database of thousands of crimes and uses algorithms and different variables, such as geographical location, criminal records and ages of previous offenders, to come up with predictions of where, when, and how a crime could possibly be committed and by who.

The program operates without any direct evidence that a crime will be committed, it simply takes datasets and computes possibilities.

“People assume that if someone murdered then they will murder in the future,” Berk also states, “But what really matters is what that person did as a young individual. If they committed armed robbery at age 14 that’s a good predictor. If they committed the same crime at age 30, that doesn’t predict very much.”

Critics have urged that the program encourages categorizing individuals on a risk scale via computer mathematics, rather than on real life, and that monitoring those people based on such a premise is antithetic to a justice system founded on the premise of the presumption of innocence.

Other police departments and law agencies across the country have begun to look into and use similar predictive technologies. The Memphis Police Department, for example uses a program called Operation Blue CRUSH, which uses predictive analytics developed by IBM.

Other forms of pre-crime technology in use or under development include surveillance cameras that can predict when a crime is about to occur and alert police, and even neurological brain scanners that can read people’s intentions before they act, thus detecting whether or not a person has “hostile intent”.

It is not too far fetched to imagine all these forms of the technology being used together in the future by law enforcement bodies.

The British government has previously debated introducing pre-crime laws in the name of fighting terrorism. The idea was that suspects would be put on trial using MI5 or MI6 intelligence of an expected terror attack. This would be enough to convict if found to be true “on the balance of probabilities”, rather than “beyond reasonable doubt”.

The government even has plans to collect lifelong records on all residents starting at the age of five, in order to screen for those who might be more likely to commit crimes in the future.

Another disturbing possibility for such technology comes in the form of a financial alliance of sorts between Internet search engine giant Google and the investment arm of the CIA and the wider U.S. intelligence network.

Google and In-Q-Tel have recently injected a sum of up to $10 million each into a company called Recorded Future, which uses analytics to scour Twitter accounts, blogs and websites for all sorts of information, which is used to “assemble actual real-time dossiers on people.”

The company describes its analytics as “the ultimate tool for open-source intelligence” and says it can also “predict the future”.


Recorded Future takes in vast amounts of personal information such as employment changes, personal education and family relations. Promotional material also shows categories covering pretty much everything else, including entertainment, music and movie releases, as well as other innocuous things like patent filings and product recalls.

Those detached from any kind of moral reality will say “If you’ve got nothing to hide then what is the problem with being scanned for pre-crime? If it keeps us all safe from murderers, rapists and terrorists I’m all for it”.

How far towards a literal technological big brother police state will we slip before people wake up to the fact?


_________________
Memento Vivere

I have local knowledge.
That sandbar was not there yesterday!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:37 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 08, 2009 9:36 am
Posts: 4320
I'm curious to find out how accurate it is.

If it helps law enforcement focus their attention and better utilize their resources, that's pretty cool.

That said, it's definately something that needs to be monitored very heavily by the public to ensure it's not abused.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:53 pm 
Offline
The Dancing Cat
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:21 pm
Posts: 9354
Location: Ohio
Infowars is tinfoil hat nutsos :(

_________________
Quote:
In comic strips the person on the left always speaks first. - George Carlin


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:55 pm 
Offline
Mountain Man
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2009 4:15 pm
Posts: 3374
Would you be happier to read something on this from the Los Angeles Times?

"Predictive" is not the right word, though; I think if they called it "anticipatory," it might fly better. If you read the LA Times article, it becomes clear that what they hope to address by this are largely burglaries, that kind of thing, and not so much murders, rapes, etc. In that respect, sure, you might be able to predict that if a house on X block of Main Street got broken into last night, there's a certain percentage chance that another house on the same block, or nearby, might get broken into.

_________________
This cold and dark tormented hell
Is all I`ll ever know
So when you get to heaven
May the devil be the judge


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:08 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:22 pm
Posts: 5716
Quote:
investment arm of the CIA


That scares me more than anything else in that article.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 11:50 pm 
Offline
Not a F'n Boy Scout
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:10 pm
Posts: 5202

_________________
Quote:
19 Yet she became more and more promiscuous as she recalled the days of her youth, when she was a prostitute in Egypt. 20 There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

Ezekiel 23:19-20 


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 11:55 pm 
Offline
Grrr... Eat your oatmeal!!
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:07 pm
Posts: 5073
that about sums it all up for me Rynar.

_________________
Darksiege
Traveller, Calé, Whisperer
Lead me not into temptation; for I know a shortcut


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 7:33 am 
Offline
Has a plan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 2:51 pm
Posts: 1584
Interesting idea, but the amount of personal data needed to make it work... way intrusive. Or this will go to illustrate the amount of info able to be mined without direct consent.

_________________
A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. ~ John Stuart Mill


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 3:29 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:03 am
Posts: 4922
This new pre-crime technology seems like a great advance in my opinion. The program that estimates a parolee's likelihood of future crime is not invasive. It looks at his characteristics and background, and then cross-analyzes these with a database of other criminals. The result is a probability that he will commit future crimes while on parole. Like the article states, this is useful for determining how closely he should be watched. This pre-crime technology can be used in conjunction with subjective criteria to create a good measure of how free a parolee should be. Nobody's privacy is being intruded on here.

Other technology is discussed in the article, such as using video cameras on streets to predict where crime is about to happen. This is obviously good because it's an early warning system that assists law enforcement without the cost of additional personnel.

I see nothing wrong with the CIA using Google's services. From what I can tell, it is simply organizing publicly available information in a way that suits the CIA. Google uses web crawlers and can only access such information anyways... except of course Gmail which contains lots of private data. I doubt they would share that with the CIA.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 3:44 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:22 pm
Posts: 5716
Lex Luthor wrote:
Like the article states, this is useful for determining how closely he should be watched.


And there is where it becomes invasive.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 8:43 pm 
Offline
Commence Primary Ignition
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am
Posts: 15740
Location: Combat Information Center
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
Lex Luthor wrote:
Like the article states, this is useful for determining how closely he should be watched.


And there is where it becomes invasive.


Of course it does. The person Lex is referring to is on parole or probation. It's supposed to be invasive.

_________________
"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 11:19 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:22 pm
Posts: 5716
Diamondeye wrote:
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
Lex Luthor wrote:
Like the article states, this is useful for determining how closely he should be watched.


And there is where it becomes invasive.


Of course it does. The person Lex is referring to is on parole or probation. It's supposed to be invasive.


Not necessarily. It stated that a 14 year old that commits armed robbery would be targeted as a highly likely murderer in the future. You can't monitor this kid like he's a murderer, without him actually committing that crime.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 11:42 am 
Offline
Commence Primary Ignition
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am
Posts: 15740
Location: Combat Information Center
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
Not necessarily. It stated that a 14 year old that commits armed robbery would be targeted as a highly likely murderer in the future. You can't monitor this kid like he's a murderer, without him actually committing that crime.


Yes, and? So he's "highly likely" to. So what? You can monitor him to the exent it's practical. Monitoring doesn't necessarily mean he's having to do anything or anything is being done besides watching him. Eventually if he does nothing, the monitoring will end. Resources are limited.

All this system really does is have a computer do the guesswork instead of a human.

_________________
"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 2:16 pm 
Offline
Lean, Mean, Googling Machine
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:35 am
Posts: 2903
Location: Maze of twisty little passages, all alike
Steve Watson wrote:
Law enforcement agencies in Washington D.C. have begun to use technology that they say can predict when crimes will be committed and who will commit them, before they actually happen.

[...]

Previous incarnations of the software [...] were limited to [...] parolees and offenders on probation.

This implies that the new incarnation in D.C. is being used on someone other than parolees/probationees. If so, that's definitely a problem. The police can't subject some citizens to higher scrutiny than others without a legally justifiable reason (specific reason to suspect the person of a specific crime). Treating people unequally based on past circumstances is prejudicial at best, and violates the equal protection clause at worst.

_________________
Sail forth! steer for the deep waters only!
Reckless, O soul, exploring, I with thee, and thou with me;
For we are bound where mariner has not yet dared to go,
And we will risk the ship, ourselves and all.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 2:22 pm 
Offline
The Dancing Cat
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:21 pm
Posts: 9354
Location: Ohio
Stathol wrote:
Steve Watson wrote:
Law enforcement agencies in Washington D.C. have begun to use technology that they say can predict when crimes will be committed and who will commit them, before they actually happen.

[...]

Previous incarnations of the software [...] were limited to [...] parolees and offenders on probation.

This implies that the new incarnation in D.C. is being used on someone other than parolees/probationees. If so, that's definitely a problem. The police can't subject some citizens to higher scrutiny than others without a legally justifiable reason (specific reason to suspect the person of a specific crime). Treating people unequally based on past circumstances is prejudicial at best, and violates the equal protection clause at worst.

Seriously don't treat Infowars and it's contributors as legitimate sources of information:

http://www.infowars.com/why-are-internm ... ing-built/
http://www.infowars.com/forced-vaccinat ... minations/
http://www.infowars.com/internment-camp ... en-influx/
http://www.infowars.com/why-are-internm ... ing-built/
http://www.infowars.com/bilderberg-fear ... ued-world/
http://www.infowars.com/bilderberg-shad ... overnment/
http://www.infowars.com/articles/world/ ... erberg.htm

I was not joking when I said it was tinfoil hat folk :(

_________________
Quote:
In comic strips the person on the left always speaks first. - George Carlin


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 3:25 pm 
Offline
adorabalicious
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:54 am
Posts: 5094
Lets hope it is Hopwin.

_________________
"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 4:00 pm 
Offline
The Dancing Cat
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:21 pm
Posts: 9354
Location: Ohio
Elmarnieh wrote:
Lets hope it is Hopwin.

I used to hear Alex Jones on Coast to Coast every couple weeks when I subscribed to their podcasts, that guy is straight-up psycho...

_________________
Quote:
In comic strips the person on the left always speaks first. - George Carlin


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 4:41 pm 
Offline
adorabalicious
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:54 am
Posts: 5094
He isn't the only source for building strange facilities in the middle of nowhere though.

_________________
"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 6:04 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:22 pm
Posts: 5716
Diamondeye wrote:
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
Not necessarily. It stated that a 14 year old that commits armed robbery would be targeted as a highly likely murderer in the future. You can't monitor this kid like he's a murderer, without him actually committing that crime.


Yes, and? So he's "highly likely" to. So what? You can monitor him to the exent it's practical. Monitoring doesn't necessarily mean he's having to do anything or anything is being done besides watching him. Eventually if he does nothing, the monitoring will end. Resources are limited.

All this system really does is have a computer do the guesswork instead of a human.


So you don't consider "being watched" intrusive?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 6:07 pm 
Offline
The Dancing Cat
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:21 pm
Posts: 9354
Location: Ohio
Elmarnieh wrote:
He isn't the only source for building strange facilities in the middle of nowhere though.

Certainly not, but he is one of the few saying they are internment camps for American citizens for when FEMA's secret powers kick in and they declare martial law due to (he listed all of these at one point or another, changing diseases when his prediction didn't come true): West Nile; H1N1; Avian Flu; Dengue Fever).

_________________
Quote:
In comic strips the person on the left always speaks first. - George Carlin


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 10:04 pm 
Offline
Commence Primary Ignition
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am
Posts: 15740
Location: Combat Information Center
Stathol wrote:
Steve Watson wrote:
Law enforcement agencies in Washington D.C. have begun to use technology that they say can predict when crimes will be committed and who will commit them, before they actually happen.

[...]

Previous incarnations of the software [...] were limited to [...] parolees and offenders on probation.

This implies that the new incarnation in D.C. is being used on someone other than parolees/probationees. If so, that's definitely a problem. The police can't subject some citizens to higher scrutiny than others without a legally justifiable reason (specific reason to suspect the person of a specific crime). Treating people unequally based on past circumstances is prejudicial at best, and violates the equal protection clause at worst.


This is all completely untrue. You can certainly watch a person with a criminal record more closely. Scrutniy of this type is simply watching what the person does as he goes about his buisness.

By this logic you can't have a higher ratio of cops to citizens in a high-crime city than in Mayberry either.

_________________
"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 10:05 pm 
Offline
Commence Primary Ignition
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am
Posts: 15740
Location: Combat Information Center
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
Diamondeye wrote:
Arathain Kelvar wrote:
Not necessarily. It stated that a 14 year old that commits armed robbery would be targeted as a highly likely murderer in the future. You can't monitor this kid like he's a murderer, without him actually committing that crime.


Yes, and? So he's "highly likely" to. So what? You can monitor him to the exent it's practical. Monitoring doesn't necessarily mean he's having to do anything or anything is being done besides watching him. Eventually if he does nothing, the monitoring will end. Resources are limited.

All this system really does is have a computer do the guesswork instead of a human.


So you don't consider "being watched" intrusive?


Not particularly, especially since there's limited numbers of watchers and money to pay them.

_________________
"Hysterical children shrieking about right-wing anything need to go sit in the corner and be quiet while the adults are talking."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 10:13 pm 
Offline
adorabalicious
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:54 am
Posts: 5094
I'm all about less cops.

_________________
"...but there exists also in the human heart a depraved taste for equality, which impels the weak to attempt to lower the powerful to their own level and reduces men to prefer equality in slavery to inequality with freedom." - De Tocqueville


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Pre crime technology
PostPosted: Sat Aug 28, 2010 6:50 pm 
Offline
Noli me calcare
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:26 am
Posts: 4747
Diamondeye wrote:
Arathain Kelvar wrote:

So you don't consider "being watched" intrusive?


Not particularly, especially since there's limited numbers of watchers and money to pay them.


Eh, just use a GPS device...

_________________
"Dress cops up as soldiers, give them military equipment, train them in military tactics, tell them they’re fighting a ‘war,’ and the consequences are predictable." —Radley Balko

Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 24 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 255 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group