The Glade 4.0

I've spent most of my life on the computer so it would make sense that I know enough to be an "IT" guy. I don't think it's fun to learn random IT related things... I only figure out what I need. I'm not sure if my job is considered IT though... is software engineering IT? That's always been vague to me.

I do not have a four year degree, I don't even have a two year degree, though I probably qualified for one at one time. In the course of my duties at work I frequently answer questions posed by people with Masters and Doctorates, in their supposed fields of expertise - in this case alcohol and drug treatment and recovery. Most of the time it is because they are too lazy to look it up themselves and know I probably know the answer already and where to find the citations.

Most of them are surprised to find out I never finished college.

I write better than most of them too.

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The U. S. Constitution doesn't guarantee happiness, only the pursuit of it. You have to catch up with it yourself. B. Franklin

"A mind needs books like a sword needs a whetstone." -- Tyrion Lannister, A Game of Thrones

That's an interesting question. I guess at it's most basic, the ability to use one's brain effectively. Mostly that means critical and creating thinking.

But my comment was really a reaction to Talya's comments tying computer use with intelligence. One I might add that is quite common in the IT world.

I'll use my Grandfather as an example here. Retired Lt. Col. in the Army, and sharp as a tack. Amazing cognative skills, especially when it comes to people and communication/organization. Doesn't know squat about computers, and further doesn't have an interest to learn about them at this stage in his life.

The CEO of my company is another example. Most definately not computer literate. Knows the basics of what he needs to operate email and probably word, but beyond that he's pretty lost. But he has an incredible mind for business, understand companies, people and fiscal numbers better than many CEOs.

To consider either of these people as somehow unintelligent would be completely wrong.

You'll note my blog post you're referencing is tied to the competence of people at doing their job. The lack of ability to use a computer is not an issue if you don't have to use one. If your job involves making basic use of a computer in some way, and you don't bother learning the basics of how to use a computer, instead calling technicians for help when there is nothing wrong, then yes, at best you're an idiot. At worst, you're a lazy **** *******. That CEO can likely hire someone who knows how to use his computer for him. But if he sits at it and tries to use it then ***** that it doesn't work because he doesn't know what he's doing, **** him.

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me
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Pilot/IT..win win!

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Dream as if you'll live forever...
...Live as if you'll die tomorrow

Vivere Senza Rimpianti

Be careful not to equate intelligence with knowledge, or motivation.

The most intelligent man in the world will not know the answer to a question if he has not been exposed to it.

Likewise, the most intelligent person in the world may not learn something you show him, if he does not give a ****.

Right, because I said "at best, an idiot." At worst, he's too lazy (or unmotivated if you prefer) to learn to do his job. At which point he's worse than an idiot. An idiot doesn't know any better.

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me
█ ♣ █

Could not agree with you more. It isn't limited to IT/computers either. Some days you look at your co-workers and just wonder why exactly they're collecting a check.

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Love that!. Besides teaching 6th grade Social Studies, I am the building technology integration coach because my Master's is in Instructional Technology. Hello, Instructional Technology. I am supposed to be teaching you how to use programs like gaggle, wordle, glogster, and wikis as instructional tools in your classroom, I am not here to show you how to save files to a flash drive. Isn't that what our regular "IT" is for even if it is a simple task?

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"None is more important, none more legitimate, than that of rendering the people safe as they are the
ultimate guardians of their own liberty."- Thomas Jefferson

"Yeah, I'm rehearsing my poker face. I don't handle stupid well. *sigh*" - Farsky

IT isn't for teaching you how to save files to a flash drive.

That's what adult education "computers for grandmothers" classes at your local community center is for.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

An email I received today from the president of the company, forwarded from and regarding another employee sending out a mass email: "I can't tell if she bcc'd the group? Can you tell?"

Priceless, 'Skee.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

This.

IT exists for two purposes: Setting up new (1) hardware/software/network infrastructure required by the company, and (2) maintaining and fixing that infrastructure. They are NOT there to teach you how to use it. If you asked for it, you should already know how to use it.

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me
█ ♣ █

I understand how IT works, but users who are not IT don't, so they need help in all aspects.
Teachers don't ask for computers. It is thrown at us and we are expected to know how to use them, which brings me full circle into not only being your Instuctional technology Coach, but your basic "computers for grandmothers" teacher as well, which turns back into I should not be showing you how to back up files or telling my principal how CTRL+ALT+DELETE works.
(/shakes head sadly) Plus my IT department sucks. I have told them how to to do stuff and most of the time, when I can't do it myself, I call Foamy.

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"None is more important, none more legitimate, than that of rendering the people safe as they are the
ultimate guardians of their own liberty."- Thomas Jefferson

"Yeah, I'm rehearsing my poker face. I don't handle stupid well. *sigh*" - Farsky

Your school district should offer better training and professional development for new programs and equipment, then.

That's not to say that it's not a sadly common occurrence, but just because it's commonly needed doesn't make IT a training department.

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"Aaaah! Emotions are weird!" - Amdee
"... Mirrorshades prevent the forces of normalcy from realizing that one is crazed and possibly dangerous. They are the symbol of the sun-staring visionary, the biker, the rocker, the policeman, and similar outlaws." - Bruce Sterling, preface to Mirrorshades

QFT, but more then likely they would cut that as well as cutting my Social Studies classes.

I hate my district.

Read my rant thread for details

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"None is more important, none more legitimate, than that of rendering the people safe as they are the
ultimate guardians of their own liberty."- Thomas Jefferson

"Yeah, I'm rehearsing my poker face. I don't handle stupid well. *sigh*" - Farsky

Not this. I work for an engineering company. The point of the company is to complete... engineering projects.

If one of my engineers is well respected in the field, knows his **** when it comes to constructability, etc., and his clients love him, he's extremely valuable to me. If he can't use various programs or even a computer real well, I'll hire people to do this for him, or provide support to show him (however many times is necessary) how to do what he needs to do.

I call these people support. Project support includes accounting, marketing, secretaries, techs, and IT.

Supports "job" is to do as much as they can for the engineers, so the engineers can focus on engineering.

I'd much rather pay an IT rate for computer BS than an engineer's rate.

For some reason, many admin folks lose sight of the fact that they are there #1 to support the billable people.

No. "Admin folks" like IT are there to do what the business has paid them to do in the contracts between IT and the divisions that they support. (Yes, there are contracts between these departments, that clearly spell out what is supported and what the SLA is.)

It is true that some companies end up spending to get a training department, or how-to support groups for various applications. (We even have a couple how-to helpdesks for a few specific applications. I am not on those desks.) For the most part, however, the business does not want to pay for these things. They look at the costs involved, and decide no, they do not need them, for the very reasons we have already stated: knowing how to use the basic functionality of your computer or common office apps is part of your job description. Why should we pay the cost of having people to support them?

That's fine. But then the individual users call the helpdesks and demand such support anyway. And then, frankly, **** you. We are not paid nor staffed to provide you with the support you are asking for because your management didn't want to pay for it.

You know, there are different certifications for the types of help you are talking about than what I have. I've got several microsoft technical certifications, mostly regarding network infrastructure and engineering, but also relating to operating system and desktop support. You know what I don't have? A Microsoft Office Specialist Certification. You know why? Because it's not even an asset on my desk. Our department has not been paid to support this. And it's certainly not my job. So they can take their how-to requests and stick them somewhere.

I am technically an engineer. (Even if "Network Engineer" doesn't come close to the pay scales of other engineering fields.)

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Well Ali Baba had them forty thieves, Scheherezade had a thousand tales
But master you in luck 'cause up your sleeves you got a brand of magic never fails...
...Mister Aladdin, sir, What will your pleasure be?
Let me take your order, Jot it down -You ain't never had a friend like me
█ ♣ █

It soundsl ike Arathain is getting pissy because his company's helpdesk wouldn't walk him through using AutoCAD.

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Buckle your pants or they might fall down.

You have to forgive him, maybe; he's a civil engineer.

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As Aizle pointed out earlier in this thread, people often leave off the word "engineer" in that case.

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Buckle your pants or they might fall down.

Seriously, what are you even trying to say with this comment?

Civil Engineers who graduated before around ~2000 are notorious for being utterly and completely CAD-illiterate. They also tend to believe that CAD is "for the draftsmen". This may be true in other engineering fields, but it's definitely true of civil. I see it every. ****. day.

The problem, of course, is that CAD has been as much an engineering design tool as a "drafting package" since pretty much forever. Certainly for at least the last 30 years.

So at this point, if you are an engineer and you cannot use AutoCAD (or Microstation as the case may be), you need to GTFO because that is **** inexcusably lazy. I would not hire any engineer who is not proficient with CAD. It'a enormous waste of resources.

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Sail forth! steer for the deep waters only!
Reckless, O soul, exploring, I with thee, and thou with me;
For we are bound where mariner has not yet dared to go,
And we will risk the ship, ourselves and all.

I've seen college as a waste for years.

Especially if you are a creative writing English major like me (lol).

Civil engineers do not exactly clear the same bar as other engineering disciplines, is what they're saying.

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