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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:58 pm 
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http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/12/02/w ... o-protest/

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Walker intends to charge citizens fee to protest

Free speech is getting expensive in Wisconsin.

Following demonstrations earlier this year which drew up to 100,000 people to the Wisconsin Capitol, Republican Gov. Scott Walker has proposed new policies that would require future protesters to pay in advance to stage an event, at a cost of $50 per hour, per Capitol Police officer.

Police may also require a liability insurance or a bond, according to The Milwaukee Journal Sentinal.

Demonstrators will also be on the hook for any damage and cleanup following protests. Walker’s administration had claimed that the pro-union protests earlier this year had costs as much as $7.5 million, but later admitted that the actual costs were far less.

Under the new policy, permits will be required for groups of four or more people who want to do any activity inside the Capitol. Groups of 100 or more gathering outside the Capitol must also apply for a permit 72 hours in advance. Police will have some leeway if unforeseen events lead to spontaneous gatherings.

American Civil Liberties Union of Wisconsin executive director Chris Ahmuty agreed with the state’s allowance for spontaneous protests, but worried that some groups might have their right to freedom of assembly curbed because they could not afford to pay.

“It leaves too much discretion to the Capitol Police,” Ahmuty told the Journal Sentinel.

For their part, many activists are vowing not to be cowed by the new rules.

“This will only embolden people and get them to protest louder,” Nicole Desautels, who participates in a daily pro-labor, sing-along protest, explained to The Chicago Tribune.

“We are exercising our free speech rights,” Kimi Ishikawa, who also takes part in the sing-along, insisted. “Nothing will stop us.”

Organizers said Monday that they had gotten half the signatures needed to force a recall election of Gov. Walker.

“Every day, every week and every month that goes by, the voters of my state will more clearly see the benefits of the [anti-union] reforms,” Walker told the Republican Governors Association Thursday. “People have a clear choice.”


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:03 pm 
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Demonstrators will also be on the hook for any damage and cleanup following protests.


This is all I see that's necessary.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:06 pm 
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They should have to pay for damages and clean up messes, but I'm uncomfortable with the idea of a fee up front.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:11 pm 
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I'd get upset about this, but I can't afford it.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:11 pm 
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This article shows a bit less bias.
How does one collect damages from protesters after the fact? That said, I don't like the idea of charging beforehand.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:14 pm 
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I agree that damages should be repaid. However, politicians seem to have realized that since they can't squelch protests directly, they've decided to legislate against them via any inconveniences said protests may cause.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:15 pm 
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No doubt FarSky, but who pays the damages?

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:16 pm 
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Also, I'm pretty sure that protestors don't even want police there, so how are they charged per police officer? Who gets to dictate how many police officers are "necessary?"


Last edited by FarSky on Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:16 pm 
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heheh, the police union?

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:17 pm 
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Congratulations, Occupy, look upon what you have wrought.

I am sympathetic, though, to the point Vindicarre makes. When I saw on the news they finally booted Occupy LA out of the park and were talking about the millions of dollars of cleanup that the park would now require, I actually made a comment to my family, "So, who took names as they were clearing the Occupiers out?"

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:19 pm 
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Kaffis Mark V wrote:
Congratulations, Occupy, look upon what you have wrought.

I'd wager this is less about an actual concern for damage reimbursement and more about a control over the population's ability to petition government for a redress of grievances.

It's a concern, sure, but I highly doubt it's the primary concern of those enacting this kind of legislation.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:26 pm 
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FarSky wrote:
I agree that damages should be repaid. However, politicians seem to have realized that since they can't squelch protests directly, they've decided to legislate against them via any inconveniences said protests may cause.
This is not new ...

Free Speech Zones

Approved Protest Areas

...

And this isn't reserved to R's or D's.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:28 pm 
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No, it isn't.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:29 pm 
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FarSky wrote:
I'd wager this is less about an actual concern for damage reimbursement and more about a control over the population's ability to petition government for a redress of grievances.

Exactly. After all, a group of people who want to have a rally in support of a particular administration or policy are less likely to cause problems than a group who want to protest against said administration or policy, so even though the permit and fee requirements are ostensibly content-neutral, the practical effect is that restrictions and fees will be higher on the anti-government groups than they will be on the pro-government groups.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:43 pm 
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This brings all new meaning to "free as in speech, not as in beer"

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 2:26 pm 
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**** the damages. The government shouldn't have enacted policies unpopular enough to cause such large-scale protests in the first place. Now, since the damages would then get paid by the general public through taxes, I suggest if you're upset about the damages you take it out of a politician's ***. Preferably to make room for your foot.

Really, how many people have heard flag-waving morons crowing about how freedom isn't free? Guess what? It's not. Sometimes we get stuck with the damages. If you don't like it, go live someplace where they don't have free speech.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:00 pm 
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Corolinth wrote:
**** the damages.

**** the non-voting, non-contributing slackers that want to ***** about the problem but do nothing more.

The only thing standing in the way of the 99% from being the 1% is hard work, dedication and guts. Put a little bit of energy into making something of yourselves instead of sitting and shitting your comfy nests and THEN come talk to me about inequality.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:01 pm 
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Kaffis Mark V wrote:
I am sympathetic, though, to the point Vindicarre makes. When I saw on the news they finally booted Occupy LA out of the park and were talking about the millions of dollars of cleanup that the park would now require, I actually made a comment to my family, "So, who took names as they were clearing the Occupiers out?"


The City is responsible for the damage. They didn't police the protest (and arrest vandals), they allowed the protesters to stay camped illegally for a long period of time.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:29 pm 
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Corolinth wrote:
**** the damages. The government shouldn't have enacted policies unpopular enough to cause such large-scale protests in the first place.


Ummm, no, not a good plan.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:42 pm 
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Vindicarre wrote:
Corolinth wrote:
**** the damages. The government shouldn't have enacted policies unpopular enough to cause such large-scale protests in the first place.
Ummm, no, not a good plan.
Hmmmms ...

I have to think about this for a bit, but I don't think I agree, Vindi.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:45 pm 
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I think it's foolish to allow 1% of a population to decide policy by showing up somewhere and wrecking the place.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:11 pm 
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Rorinthas wrote:
They should have to pay for damages and clean up messes, but I'm uncomfortable with the idea of a fee up front.


I agree, but who knows what the right way to go about charging liability would be...


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:19 pm 
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Therein, as the Bard would say, lies the rub. I don't have any problem with registering a permit and holding the signatory responsible in court.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:55 pm 
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Taskiss wrote:
The only thing standing in the way of the 99% from being the 1% is hard work, dedication and guts.

That and math.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:57 pm 
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Who paid for the damages of the biggest riot in American history? A riot which was caused by a minority, I might add.

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